1938 S/42 98% with STIFF TD-lever? (pics)

Bob in OH · 07-29-2006, 07:26 PM

I just privately bought a 1938 Mauser that is very clean, matched mag, great E/M holster and wonderful price... Before I bought it, I tried to field strip the gun and the TD lever was VERY stiff and I couldn't flip it. The seller wanted to use a penny (ouch) and I knew the gun was right so I bought it as-is w/o trying the "penny trick".

After some Kroil, the lever released reluctantly and I find it as expected... matched to the firing pin and grips are numbered too. It's simply a magnificent machine and is well preserved despite being stored in that Navy holster for years.

My real question surrounds the TD lever being soooo stiff. Even with the sideplate off it's stiff and tighter as it goes back over the side plate.

Any ideas... and thanks for any comments

SteveM · 07-30-2006, 10:37 AM

Place the end of the barrel against the palm of your hand or other object so that the cannon moves back a bit and then try turning the td lever. Sometimes this helps.

Bob in OH · 07-30-2006, 11:17 AM

Hi Steve- Yep, that's the way I take them down to release the tension initially... Still tough...

Vlim · 07-30-2006, 11:50 AM

Hi,

Judging from the photo the lever sticks out quite a bit on one side of the pistol. I guess that either the lever or the small lever spring is damaged, which allows the lever to move too far to one side, thus blocking normal operation.

With the gun dismantled, you can pull out the takedown lever, when it's in downwards position. Examine the lever and the little L-shaped spring.

Perhaps someone installed a home-made spring...

minigun · 07-30-2006, 12:54 PM

Okay, what's the trick to getting the lever back in once it's out? Thanks

Clyde from Carolina · 08-10-2006, 09:14 AM

Bob, that's a real beauty.

Let us know what the deal with the lever was...

John Sabato · 08-10-2006, 10:05 AM

Do a search on takedown lever spring.. there has been a recent discussion on this...

Clyde from Carolina · 08-10-2006, 10:17 AM

Thanks, John !

Jan C Still · 08-10-2006, 11:16 AM

Bob
Would like to see photographs of the KM holster that this Luger came in. Reported 1938 dated Lugers near the serial number 9431i are mostly KM marked. I would speculate that your luger may have been one of those procured by the Kreigsmarine but not KM marked. More information in the link below.

PART 2/2. S/42-1938 LUGER, WITH ACCESSORIES Jan C Still http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7289

You made an outstanding find.
Jan

Bob in OH · 08-10-2006, 01:10 PM

Thanks Jan for the encouragement... I was wondering the same as I also bought a Navy Mod34 from the same gent and also looked in your book re: 1938 KM lugers and was wishing it had been KM marked as I saw the trend.

Here's a link to the Luger holster...

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...threadid=14999

John Sabato · 08-10-2006, 02:26 PM

There is damage to your frame in this area as shown by one of your photos... I will bet the frame was dropped with the takedown lever removed at some point in the gun's life... the hole is no longer perfectly round and causes binding on the shaft of the takedown lever when you turn it. The only cure would be the VERY JUDICIOUS removal of the metal where the parts are rubbing each other...

Bob in OH · 08-10-2006, 05:41 PM

Thanks John... great eyes! From the pic it certainly would appear you are correct. I better dig it back out and take another look about...

minigun · 08-10-2006, 10:10 PM

OR maybe just leave it alone and either live with it or it will eventually in many turns and twists, wear the hole round again. Neat observation as to why this lever would be hard to turn (or twist).

the gunman · 07-02-2007, 07:53 PM

'" That's some eye you have John"

Quentin · 07-03-2007, 03:23 PM

Sometimes it takes a long time for compliments to roll in, huh, John!

Anyway, nice to see this thread and I learned something new. And I'll agree, great eye!

Steinar · 07-03-2007, 04:26 PM

Having the TD lever out makes sence.. can't imagine the luger landing on that area with the barrel attached.

From the front picture it is possible to see some grooves in the damaged area.. I guess that is another little part of the puzzle.

It's a nice Luger Bob, congratulations with it!

Aaron · 07-03-2007, 10:19 PM

Is it possible that the hole was out of round originally and someone tapped the frame to try to make the hole concentric?

Lugerdoc · 07-04-2007, 09:55 AM

Bob et al, For lowering of the TD lever to insure that the receiver is out of battery, I find it easiest to have the toggle held open, before trying to lower lever. Even then, I may have to resort to a custom made tool that pushes down on the shank of the lever, rather than the checkered circular part that have been known to snap off. Reinstalling is best down with the barrelled reciever removed, so that as your pushing it in from the left side, you can push down on the right side, against the spring pressure, to aline it with the hole in the frame. If a new TDL spring is required, I do have DDR originals @$25 each. TH

Bob G · 07-06-2007, 11:04 PM

Looking closely at the take down lever knurled knob it seems to possibly have a slightly dented area on the bottom of the knurl also. May have been in the unlocked position and dropped causing the damage to the frame and maybe the take down button. Would need a better pic of the bottom of the button to be sure.

Steinar · 07-08-2007, 05:36 AM

Perhaps the TD lever was not snaped completly in place, but sticking out a little on the impact. If completly in, I don't think the frame would bend like that.
..what type of floor was it in the shop you bought it? Concrete or wood/carpet?

07-29-2006, 07:26 PM	#1
Bob in OH User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NE OH Posts: 129 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	1938 S/42 98% with STIFF TD-lever? (pics) I just privately bought a 1938 Mauser that is very clean, matched mag, great E/M holster and wonderful price... Before I bought it, I tried to field strip the gun and the TD lever was VERY stiff and I couldn't flip it. The seller wanted to use a penny (ouch) and I knew the gun was right so I bought it as-is w/o trying the "penny trick". After some Kroil, the lever released reluctantly and I find it as expected... matched to the firing pin and grips are numbered too. It's simply a magnificent machine and is well preserved despite being stored in that Navy holster for years. My real question surrounds the TD lever being soooo stiff. Even with the sideplate off it's stiff and tighter as it goes back over the side plate. Any ideas... and thanks for any comments

08-10-2006, 10:05 AM	#7
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	Do a search on takedown lever spring.. there has been a recent discussion on this... __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

08-10-2006, 02:26 PM	#11
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	There is damage to your frame in this area as shown by one of your photos... I will bet the frame was dropped with the takedown lever removed at some point in the gun's life... the hole is no longer perfectly round and causes binding on the shaft of the takedown lever when you turn it. The only cure would be the VERY JUDICIOUS removal of the metal where the parts are rubbing each other... __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

07-03-2007, 04:26 PM	#16
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Having the TD lever out makes sence.. can't imagine the luger landing on that area with the barrel attached. From the front picture it is possible to see some grooves in the damaged area.. I guess that is another little part of the puzzle. It's a nice Luger Bob, congratulations with it! __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

07-04-2007, 09:55 AM	#18
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	Bob et al, For lowering of the TD lever to insure that the receiver is out of battery, I find it easiest to have the toggle held open, before trying to lower lever. Even then, I may have to resort to a custom made tool that pushes down on the shank of the lever, rather than the checkered circular part that have been known to snap off. Reinstalling is best down with the barrelled reciever removed, so that as your pushing it in from the left side, you can push down on the right side, against the spring pressure, to aline it with the hole in the frame. If a new TDL spring is required, I do have DDR originals @$25 each. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

07-30-2006, 10:37 AM	#2
SteveM User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,016 Thanks: 94 Thanked 275 Times in 137 Posts	Place the end of the barrel against the palm of your hand or other object so that the cannon moves back a bit and then try turning the td lever. Sometimes this helps.

07-30-2006, 11:17 AM	#3
Bob in OH User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NE OH Posts: 129 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Hi Steve- Yep, that's the way I take them down to release the tension initially... Still tough...

07-30-2006, 11:50 AM	#4
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Hi, Judging from the photo the lever sticks out quite a bit on one side of the pistol. I guess that either the lever or the small lever spring is damaged, which allows the lever to move too far to one side, thus blocking normal operation. With the gun dismantled, you can pull out the takedown lever, when it's in downwards position. Examine the lever and the little L-shaped spring. Perhaps someone installed a home-made spring...

07-30-2006, 12:54 PM	#5
minigun User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 424 Thanks: 16 Thanked 20 Times in 15 Posts	Okay, what's the trick to getting the lever back in once it's out? Thanks

08-10-2006, 09:14 AM	#6
Clyde from Carolina User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: North Carolina Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Bob, that's a real beauty. Let us know what the deal with the lever was...

08-10-2006, 10:17 AM	#8
Clyde from Carolina User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: North Carolina Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks, John !

08-10-2006, 11:16 AM	#9
Jan C Still User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Box 240188, Douglas, Alaska, 99824 Posts: 463 Thanks: 0 Thanked 52 Times in 32 Posts	Bob Would like to see photographs of the KM holster that this Luger came in. Reported 1938 dated Lugers near the serial number 9431i are mostly KM marked. I would speculate that your luger may have been one of those procured by the Kreigsmarine but not KM marked. More information in the link below. PART 2/2. S/42-1938 LUGER, WITH ACCESSORIES Jan C Still http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7289 You made an outstanding find. Jan

08-10-2006, 01:10 PM	#10
Bob in OH User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NE OH Posts: 129 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Thanks Jan for the encouragement... I was wondering the same as I also bought a Navy Mod34 from the same gent and also looked in your book re: 1938 KM lugers and was wishing it had been KM marked as I saw the trend. Here's a link to the Luger holster... http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...threadid=14999

08-10-2006, 05:41 PM	#12
Bob in OH User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NE OH Posts: 129 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Thanks John... great eyes! From the pic it certainly would appear you are correct. I better dig it back out and take another look about...

08-10-2006, 10:10 PM	#13
minigun User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 424 Thanks: 16 Thanked 20 Times in 15 Posts	OR maybe just leave it alone and either live with it or it will eventually in many turns and twists, wear the hole round again. Neat observation as to why this lever would be hard to turn (or twist).

07-02-2007, 07:53 PM	#14
the gunman User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Leland NC 28451 Posts: 1,017 Thanks: 1 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	'" That's some eye you have John"

07-03-2007, 03:23 PM	#15
Quentin User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: NorthWest USA Posts: 124 Thanks: 59 Thanked 11 Times in 4 Posts	Sometimes it takes a long time for compliments to roll in, huh, John! Anyway, nice to see this thread and I learned something new. And I'll agree, great eye!

07-03-2007, 10:19 PM	#17
Aaron Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 1,008 Thanks: 0 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts	Is it possible that the hole was out of round originally and someone tapped the frame to try to make the hole concentric?

07-06-2007, 11:04 PM	#19
Bob G User Join Date: May 2007 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 11 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Looking closely at the take down lever knurled knob it seems to possibly have a slightly dented area on the bottom of the knurl also. May have been in the unlocked position and dropped causing the damage to the frame and maybe the take down button. Would need a better pic of the bottom of the button to be sure. __________________ Do It Right The First Time!

07-08-2007, 05:36 AM	#20
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Perhaps the TD lever was not snaped completly in place, but sticking out a little on the impact. If completly in, I don't think the frame would bend like that. ..what type of floor was it in the shop you bought it? Concrete or wood/carpet? __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane