John D. Suggests polygraph test

[Jan C Still]

John D.
Statements that John D. made in the "Fake 1941 Krieghoff in Shattuck collection" string:
"...As I watch this silly game played within the Forum"
"- have you started the paperwork to disinter Mr. Skinner, so you can hook him up to a polygraph to get his "confession".

While a polygraph of a dead man is certainally the height of sillieness, that of a living man might be of value. If done wright, polygraph questions could be asked about the fake 1941 Krieghoff and the .45 carbine at the same time.

Except for some misquotes/distortions and comments that seem to have been issued from the brain of an ACLU lawyer, this search for the facts/truth has been civilized, pleasant, and sometimes informative.

Note: I stand on all that I have posted on this Forum. Please read what I say (post) and not what others think I said.

Respectfully
Jan C. Still

[img]biggrin.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

[bradsimpson]

Jan,
Hook me up first! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

[Edward Tinker]

Jan I don't find these comments very enlightening.
If you have a beef with Ralph, then fine, but I for one am getting tired of you pushing it.
Several conversations / threads have been started that then get nasty sounding by others; because you have made veiled accusations and it is noticed, it has been directed at one person.

Why not enjoy the forum for its purpose and share information?

[Roadkill]

A dog fight, be it between mongrels or purebreds, is still a dogfight, and not an honorable event.

RK

[John D.]

Jan,

What a stellar post. But again â?? you failed to connect the dots.

If you have a beef with Ralph â?? work it out privately. Itâ??s not your â??rightâ?� to use this Forum as your own personal â??ventingâ?� area. To that point, if someone was coming after you in the way you are going after Ralph â?? I would have a similar amount of disdain for them.

To that point - say what you have to say once - or even a few times - regarding any Luger you feel is â??boosted of fakedâ?� â?? but frankly, I, for one, am quite sick of seeing your diatribes every week or so over the same issue, over the same dealer and reading the same re-worded allegations. And my informed guess is â?? so are a lot of other people who have chosen not to confront you personally. To me - itâ??s like watching a bunch of school-girls at the back of the bus, finger-pointing and giggling amongst themselves.

My personal advice would be - â??get over itâ?�, Jan â?? whatever it is you need to get over. Work it out with Ralph, or whoever you need to speak to, to properly vent your frustrations. Frankly, in my opinion, you could be a tremendous resource for collectors here, but you appear to have chosen a different path through your constant haranguing â?? and seem to be simply stuck on one dealer and some hidden agenda that you refuse to share with the rest of this community.

As for Brad, in the following post saying â??Hook me up first!â?� (I believe I quoted you properly?) â?? I would offer to do so, Brad - if I thought you had anything of value to contribute above what you have speculated on numerous occasions. My guess is that you donâ??t have anything further to contribute on this issue â?? for if you did, you would have stated it already.

And Jan â??if you think you can do a Luger Discussion Group on the Internet any better â?? please, just do it â?? this Forum costs me real dollars everyday to operate, but I believe you feel you can do it better. And since the Internet is â??freeâ?�, there are lots of web hosting companies out there that would be thrilled to set you up. Based on the way you have treated this Forum, itâ??s format and community members to your agenda â?? Iâ??m somewhat confident that folks will flock to any Forum you set up â?? at least once.

On a personal note - if this is what â??collectingâ?� Lugers is all about â?? dealers back-stabbing dealers, â??authoritiesâ?� or authors who have nothing better to do then vent their hidden agendas in a public fashion, and silly innuendoes being constantly and continuously cast about â?? I really donâ??t want to be a part of it.

In short â?? itâ??s a joke. My thanks for making that readily apparent.

And that joke is being played by the â??big boysâ?� on the rest of us â?? we, the â??new kids on the blockâ?�. But here is the punch line to your joke, Jan and Brad. We are the â??newâ?� collectors â?? we buy your books, we call you with our stupid questions, we pour over your photographs and websites, we are riveted by any post you make, we respected you, we looked up to your guidance - we are indeed, collectively â??what this hobby was supposed to be about â?? or so I thought - or at least, until this Forum. That has now changed, at least for me. I donâ??t believe Iâ??m alone in that same thought.

Roadkill is right â?? â??A dog fight, be it between mongrels or purebreds, is still a dogfight, and not an honorable event.â?� Terrific post, RK, as you are right on target, IMNSHO.

Good luck to you Jan. I wish you well. And to Brad â?? give my regards to your father. I hope to meet him someday, as he too â?? has nurtured many down the path of collecting, learning and appreciating what Lugers are to so many new collectors. I suspect Ralph has started as many down that same road. I simply hope they, the "new collectorsâ?� donâ??t read these posts on this same Forum â?? for they will probably be as disillusioned as many of us remain - as to what this hobby was supposed to be about, and in contrast, how you two have mis-represented it in within these same Forums.

John D.

[bradsimpson]

John,
Jan and I have both contributed positive information to this post. And have a lot more to offer.

I would love to be helping to educate your members, but I have been spending most of my time trying to defend myself. The only reason I said "Hook me up first!" is because of what I've been accused of on this forum. I would love to take a polygraph to defend what I've written.

Jan has written more books on Lugers and published more information on Lugers than anyone. Now he is offering his expertise to your members. Yet it sounds as though you want him off the Luger Forum?

I have no hidden agenda, I'm barely even in the Luger business anymore (just call Simpson Ltd. and ask for me?) I'm in Bangkok more than I'm in Galesburg, and my business there has nothing to do with Lugers.

But I still have years of experience buying Lugers for my father's list. When I was younger & less experienced, there were those who couldn't wait to try to take advantage of me because they knew I had my father's money to spend. I've been told many stories & offered many fake or boosted guns over the years. And I've learned to tell the good from the bad.

Most fake/boosted guns are only good enough to fool the beginners. I love to teach beginners how not to fall victim. I've shown many Navy buyers how to spot the fakes (and saved them a lot of money in the process.) This forum is a great means for exchanging such information. But those selling bad guns don't want your members to learn anything. And they can't wait for you to shut us up!

Just by pointing out an example, I get crucified on this forum. I've pointed to photographic evidence (not even my photos) that anyone can look at. I've stated facts ("Switzerland does not have a Navy") and I get sarcastic replies.

I don't have any "beef" with anyone. If forum members can learn to identify fake/boosted guns, it doesn't matter who is selling them. I want to talk about Lugers, not Luger dealers.

Collecting Lugers is no more dangerous than the stock market. How many beginners are losing their money there? The smart money pulled out over 2 years ago. Would you have wanted their advice if it was offered?

It seems that the Luger information Jan and I have to offer is not what you want to read.

Why is that?

[Frank]

Brad, I couldnâ??t agree with you more in regards to trying to provide information to the Forum. The real question is how many members of the group could even afford to buy a 45 Carbine or 1941 HK? Then if one could afford it, would not that individual take some precautions to verify the purchase? These are both rhetorical and donâ??t require a response.

If the more knowledgeable members of the Forum would provide information useful to the bulk of the membership, instead of comments about the â??exoticâ?� pistols, I for one, would be most appreciative.

Having said that, now letâ??s get back to the real purpose of this gathering and discuss LUGERS !!!

[wterrell]

Maybe, we are not listening to each other:

[quote]A man is driving up a steep, narrow mountain road.
A woman is driving down the same road.
As they pass each other, the woman leans out of the window
and yells "PIG!!"

The man immediately leans out of his window and
replies, "BITCH!!"

They each continue on their way, and as the man rounds
the next corner, he crashes into a pig in the middle of the
road.

<hr></blockquote>

...if only we could listen?

[Roadkill]

Mr. Still, Mr Simpson, your expertise in the arena of Lugers has never been disputed. Your comments and opinions are always welcome. Thank you.

RK

[Edward Tinker]

Agreed, the expertise y'all bring is undisputed.

[Garfield]

Wes:

Very astute observation and so very appropos.

Good Hunting,

[Johnny Peppers]

Our education will not be complete if we are only open to and accept those things that we are comfortable and in agreement with. Sometimes the bitter pill is the one that does us the most good.

[Luke]

I have made this comment before, but it is worth repeating.

Everything I know about "boosted" and "bogus" Lugers I learned on this Forum.

While the Still and Kenyon books (and others) are essential to the learning process, they do not address this subject. This Forum has been really helpful to me in this regard . . . . and, obviously, to many others.

I welcome any open and objective discussion of methods and techniques used to "boost" Lugers.

[Herb]

I agree with Luke, back when I was collecting Nazi dress daggers my most useful books were two written solely on the fakes, there are a lot of fake daggers. Perhaps this topic would be of interest to those inclined to write books, I certainly would buy a copy. I also appreciate the assistance given to the forum members by Msr's Still and Simpson, I feel we all can benefit by learning from others knowledge and experience. However, i'll miss the outcome of the 'dogfight'! LOL <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />