What kind of grips are these?

[Olle]

Fresh from eBay, not sure what to do with them but I'm thinking about sanding them down and re-checker them. Before I do that, I would like to know if these grips look like anything that ever came on a Luger. They appear to be original, but the checkering is less than 16 LPI (maybe 15 or 14, not sure) and seems to be done by somebody who knew how to lay out a pattern. However, I can't recall ever seeing such coarse checkering before, so I would think they have been redone at some point.... or?

[nukem556]

Kind of look like the Chinese Norinco....except those were even worse looking.

[Dick Herman]

Could they have been made in the Dutch East Indies(GS) arsenal?

[lfid]

the right grip looks like both that were seen on a ww1 erfurt luger rebuild which I had long ago - the receiver right side flat had that mystery proof mark of crossed swords under a crown and I think E and L letters left and right all inside a circle

seems like some luger book has luger picture with such grips identified as field repairs

left grip looks like maybe wider angle checkering tool than right grip

cool find !
Bill

[Olle]

Originally Posted by lfid

the right grip looks like both that were seen on a ww1 erfurt luger rebuild which I had long ago - the receiver right side flat had that mystery proof mark of crossed swords under a crown and I think E and L letters left and right all inside a circle

seems like some luger book has luger picture with such grips identified as field repairs

left grip looks like maybe wider angle checkering tool than right grip

cool find !
Bill

I forgot to mention one reason why I think the checkering is a later "enhancement": The panels are slightly different at the bottom, and if you look closely you will see that the LH panel (to the right in the picture) has a slightly beveled bottom edge. It also seems like the color of the wood is different, I guess a good cleaning will reveal if this is the case. I haven't tried them on a gun yet, but the backs look like properly made factory grips.

I have seen pictures of similar grips, but I can't for the life of me remember where. A field repair would kinda make sense, and that could also explain the semi-professional look, the two tack marks (a common work holding method when you checker handgun grips) and the varnish. The inscription on the back reads "CL (or possibly CCL) Rush 1949". This was obviously inscribed after the varnish was applied, so the varnish is not a later addition.

So what's your opinion? Leave alone as a conversation piece, or sand and re-checker? Or have I stumbled upon the remnants of the extremely rare, yet to be discovered Albanian Luger variation?

[John Sabato]

Originally Posted by Dick Herman

Could they have been made in the Dutch East Indies(GS) arsenal?

Good Guess Dick. I don't know how to prove it, but I think these may have been on a VICKERs LTD. marked Luger. I recall that the ones that I have seen having larger checker diamonds rather than the fine line checkering used by DWM and Erfurt.

[dz]

Dutch

[Olle]

Originally Posted by John Sabato

Good Guess Dick. I don't know how to prove it, but I think these may have been on a VICKERs LTD. marked Luger. I recall that the ones that I have seen having larger checker diamonds rather than the fine line checkering used by DWM and Erfurt.

Interesting...

http://www.acant.org.au/Articles/MoreVickersLuger.html
http://www.rockislandauction.com/vie...id/55/lid/1676
http://jamesdjulia.com/item/3109-358/

[wlyon]

Look like Dutch to me. Bill

[Ron Wood]

My immediate impression from the coarse checkering was Dutch also, but quickly had doubts. The coarse checkered Dutch grips were replacements made at the Geweermakers Scool in Indonesia and bear a small "GS" in an oval on the back, as Dick has mentioned, and do not have holes on the back. Grips with two holes on the back are typically Italian made repros, but they are very high quality and there would be no need to rechecker them unless they were badly worn or damaged. I suspect that Olle is correct that the holes are for work holding and the grips may be aftermarket (or original) items that were hand checkered by someone.

[Olle]

Well... Seems like I could possibly have found something "rare and interesting" after all, so I guess I won't be re-checkering them until we have a positive ID.

I just tried them on two DWM frames, and they seem to fit just fine. I seriously doubt that they are reproductions, the aging and the date on the back look 100% genuine. They are a bit snug around the grip screws so I couldn't get them all the way in, but everything else seems to line up and fit perfectly (safety, mag button etc), just like factory grips. I also tried to gauge the thickness, and they don't appear to be thin enough to be sanded and re-checkered.

[Olle]

Here's a picture of the backs, and I'm 99% sure that those tool marks are from a checkering jig.

[Sergio Natali]

I don't think you've got two reproductions, to me they look pretty genuine, but I don't think they belonged to a Dutch East Indies Luger.
My 2cents.


Sergio

[alanint]

You also have information in the way of something scratched into the rear of the grips. Can you read what is written? It looks like "C.L. Rush" or something similar.

[Olle]

Originally Posted by alanint

You also have information in the way of something scratched into the rear of the grips. Can you read what is written? It looks like "C.L. Rush" or something similar.

Yes, it says "CL Rush 1949".

[Sergio Natali]

I noticed, but it can't explain much, maybe it was some previous owner? Who knows.


Sergio

[Lugerdoc]

I agree with the above; Dutch Indonesian arsenal replacements. I have plenty of them in stock, for anyone needing a cheap set of wood grips. TH

[Olle]

Originally Posted by luger.parabellum

I noticed, but it can't explain much, maybe it was some previous owner? Who knows.


Sergio

It was pretty common that GI's marked their trophies with name, date, unit, home address etc. so they could ID them if they happened to get lost in transit or "acquired" by another trophy hunter. Some even scratched it into the bluing to make sure nobody would take it. Many of them did it on the back of the grips just like this, so the date implies that the grips are from a bring back gun. The odd thing is that it's inscribed in the varnish, which means that the varnish must have been applied very early. This makes me think that they could be either an odd variation that was varnished from the factory, or simply a makeshift field replacement/refurb type.

Edit: I see that Tom confirmed the field replacement theory just one minute before I hit the button.

[Ben M.]

dutch had grip safetys do not see wood cut for those.

[Sergio Natali]

Originally Posted by Ben M.

dutch had grip safetys do not see wood cut for those.

That's right how I didn't notice it?


Sergio