Opinions as to Martz .45 Luger value

David-NY · 08-09-2015, 12:37 PM

I suppose the title is self-explanatory. A friend of mine has two John Martz .45 Lugers. One is a 4" and the other is a 6", but both have Navy-style rear sights/toggles and are numbered together. Both are unfired and in about 99% condition. I've been trying to talk my friend into parting ways with them [easier said than done] and we both wondered if anyone on this forum might have some input. They don't come up at auction very often. Thanks for any insight, and otherwise, enjoy the gun porn.

sheepherder · 08-09-2015, 12:51 PM

A .45 cal Martz 'Navy' Luger???

Very nice!

Sergio Natali · 08-09-2015, 01:43 PM

... and look at those grips...

G.T. · 08-09-2015, 02:04 PM

The grips were probably made by George Sarkiskian (Sp.?) I couldn't even say his name much less spell it?...

..... But his talent was outstanding! And I really liked and admired him! I also made several sets of 45 grips for John, among his other offerings.. But they were ALWAYS bordered & checkered by George! ... His name, or my name, (put there by George!) might be on the backside... BUT, I'm pretty sure on who made the mag bottoms though!....

..... Although I didn't put that nick on the one in the grain spot?...

... Brings back a lot on memories.. Never knew what the finished product looked like or anything special as we just got the frame in the white for grip fitting... Memories of great craftsman and fine friends, John & George both.. Best to all, til...lat'r....GT

.

rhuff · 08-09-2015, 02:46 PM

Stunning Lugers!!

sheepherder · 08-09-2015, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G.T.

...I'm pretty sure on who made the mag bottoms though!....

..... Although I didn't put that nick on the one in the grain spot...

I can't make out the stamp on that mag bottom; is it JM or GT???

G.T. · 08-09-2015, 05:19 PM

H Rich! I hardly ever mark my stuff! And, I never put my mark visibly on any of his stuff!

.... The mark on the bottom of the magazine was put on by me, but it is JVM in an ellipse..... I started marking them for him after he broke a few regular bottoms trying to hand stamp them unsupported! .... Wham! ..a broken bottom! Wham, a broken bottom! Wham... Gerry, would you please stamp them for me?....

...best to all, til...lat'r...GT

David-NY · 08-09-2015, 11:32 PM

I'm glad everyone likes them - I like them too - but what's a fair price???

DonVoigt · 08-09-2015, 11:36 PM

There is one in an online auction now, starting bid $4k.

Sieger · 08-09-2015, 11:50 PM

Gentlemen,

Priceless, but I'd start at $10,000.00.

Sieger

Edward Tinker · 08-10-2015, 08:52 AM

I feel their value is 4k minimum, but I would expect they would be worth $6500-$8500 (each)

depending on who was selling them.

They have always kept their value, but they are unkn0wn by many collectors and so they are harder to sell. I have always wanted one, although I would want one to shoot every now and then...

Lugerdoc · 08-10-2015, 09:00 AM

Beautiful pistols, designed to be shot with no problems. These were priced @$5,000+ when John was still making them. I agree, probably now worth closer to $10K each as dependable .45 shooters, compared to the M1907 test look-alikes, which have function problems. TH

Sieger · 08-10-2015, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lugerdoc

Beautiful pistols, designed to be shot with no problems. These were priced @$5,000+ when John was still making them. I agree, probably now worth closer to $10K each as dependable .45 shooters, compared to the M1907 test look-alikes, which have function problems. TH

Hi,

To me, it's unthinkable to ask that much for an M1907 recreation and then have the final product not function properly.

With an extra few days of testing and development, I'm sure he could have mastered the cartridge O.A.L. and spring balance issues. Perhaps he just isn't a Luger shooter.

Sieger

Sergio Natali · 08-10-2015, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sieger

Hi,

To me, it's unthinkable to ask that much for an M1907 recreation and then have the final product not function properly.

With an extra few days of testing and development, I'm sure he could have mastered the cartridge O.A.L. and spring balance issues. Perhaps he just isn't a Luger shooter.

Sieger

I agree completely, if I spend that much on a "range gun" however beautiful, I would expect from it at least a decent accuracy wthout any issues.

Sergio

David-NY · 08-10-2015, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

There is one in an online auction now, starting bid $4k.

Do you mean the Rock Island auction scheduled for September 11-13? That's not online - but anyway yes, I am watching it.

David-NY · 08-10-2015, 05:11 PM

OK I have a related question - how much is shooting them going to take down their value? (How many remain unfired?) These two are about 99%. The safety on the 6" one has been moved so there is the wear mark from that, but the 4" one doesn't even have that mark. Frankly I had put these in the "never shoot" category but everyone keeps saying what great shooters they are . . .

ithacaartist · 08-10-2015, 05:37 PM

Yes, I'm planning to get one for a shooter, right after I finish my caviar and champagne!

Sergio Natali · 08-11-2015, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David-NY

OK I have a related question - how much is shooting them going to take down their value? (How many remain unfired?) These two are about 99%. The safety on the 6" one has been moved so there is the wear mark from that, but the 4" one doesn't even have that mark. Frankly I had put these in the "never shoot" category but everyone keeps saying what great shooters they are . . .

Who knows, after all they are not vintage collectible Lugers, I think that if you get one of them as a shooter you do it manly because you want something beautiful to show off at the range and wear marks are not that important at all.
To me a small scratch on a 1900 Luger would be like tearing my heart out, but on those modern productions perhaps a small scratch won't be the end of the world.

Sergio

David-NY · 08-11-2015, 04:31 PM

Yeah but a Martz .45 is going to be rarer than a 1900 soon . . .

rhuff · 08-11-2015, 05:38 PM

Once the Martz is fired(could be only one round) it goes into a larger group of fired specimens. Definitely two different categories, and two different price points. I would be so tempted, as I am a shooter, but I would resist if I owned an unfired Martz.

08-09-2015, 12:37 PM	#1
David-NY User Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Peoples Republic of New York Posts: 33 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 10 Posts	Opinions as to Martz .45 Luger value I suppose the title is self-explanatory. A friend of mine has two John Martz .45 Lugers. One is a 4" and the other is a 6", but both have Navy-style rear sights/toggles and are numbered together. Both are unfired and in about 99% condition. I've been trying to talk my friend into parting ways with them [easier said than done] and we both wondered if anyone on this forum might have some input. They don't come up at auction very often. Thanks for any insight, and otherwise, enjoy the gun porn. Attached Thumbnails

08-09-2015, 12:51 PM	#2
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,195 Thanks: 1,413 Thanked 4,462 Times in 2,336 Posts	A .45 cal Martz 'Navy' Luger??? Very nice! __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...

08-09-2015, 01:43 PM	#3
Sergio Natali User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Somewhere in Northern Italy Posts: 2,646 Thanks: 1,087 Thanked 1,783 Times in 1,007 Posts	... and look at those grips... __________________ "Originality can't be restored and should be at the top of any collector's priority list.

08-09-2015, 02:04 PM	#4
G.T. Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chandler Arizona Posts: 3,523 Thanks: 1,321 Thanked 3,707 Times in 1,012 Posts	JVM grips The grips were probably made by George Sarkiskian (Sp.?) I couldn't even say his name much less spell it?........ But his talent was outstanding! And I really liked and admired him! I also made several sets of 45 grips for John, among his other offerings.. But they were ALWAYS bordered & checkered by George! ... His name, or my name, (put there by George!) might be on the backside... BUT, I'm pretty sure on who made the mag bottoms though!......... Although I didn't put that nick on the one in the grain spot?...... Brings back a lot on memories.. Never knew what the finished product looked like or anything special as we just got the frame in the white for grip fitting... Memories of great craftsman and fine friends, John & George both.. Best to all, til...lat'r....GT.

08-09-2015, 05:19 PM	#7
G.T. Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chandler Arizona Posts: 3,523 Thanks: 1,321 Thanked 3,707 Times in 1,012 Posts	All JVM H Rich! I hardly ever mark my stuff! And, I never put my mark visibly on any of his stuff! .... The mark on the bottom of the magazine was put on by me, but it is JVM in an ellipse..... I started marking them for him after he broke a few regular bottoms trying to hand stamp them unsupported! .... Wham! ..a broken bottom! Wham, a broken bottom! Wham... Gerry, would you please stamp them for me?.... ...best to all, til...lat'r...GT

08-09-2015, 02:46 PM	#5
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,305 Thanks: 2,735 Thanked 991 Times in 727 Posts	Stunning Lugers!!

08-09-2015, 11:32 PM	#8
David-NY User Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Peoples Republic of New York Posts: 33 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 10 Posts	I'm glad everyone likes them - I like them too - but what's a fair price???

08-09-2015, 11:36 PM	#9
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,681 Thanks: 1,443 Thanked 4,355 Times in 2,041 Posts	There is one in an online auction now, starting bid $4k.

08-09-2015, 11:50 PM	#10
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,579 Thanks: 2,142 Thanked 402 Times in 251 Posts	Gentlemen, Priceless, but I'd start at $10,000.00. Sieger Last edited by Sieger; 08-10-2015 at 10:31 AM.

08-10-2015, 08:52 AM	#11
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,960 Thanks: 2,062 Thanked 4,592 Times in 2,114 Posts	I feel their value is 4k minimum, but I would expect they would be worth $6500-$8500 (each) depending on who was selling them. They have always kept their value, but they are unkn0wn by many collectors and so they are harder to sell. I have always wanted one, although I would want one to shoot every now and then... __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-10-2015, 09:00 AM	#12
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	Beautiful pistols, designed to be shot with no problems. These were priced @$5,000+ when John was still making them. I agree, probably now worth closer to $10K each as dependable .45 shooters, compared to the M1907 test look-alikes, which have function problems. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

08-10-2015, 05:11 PM	#16
David-NY User Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Peoples Republic of New York Posts: 33 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 10 Posts	OK I have a related question - how much is shooting them going to take down their value? (How many remain unfired?) These two are about 99%. The safety on the 6" one has been moved so there is the wear mark from that, but the 4" one doesn't even have that mark. Frankly I had put these in the "never shoot" category but everyone keeps saying what great shooters they are . . .

08-10-2015, 05:37 PM	#17
ithacaartist Twice a Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY Posts: 3,368 Thanks: 7,432 Thanked 2,611 Times in 1,378 Posts	Yes, I'm planning to get one for a shooter, right after I finish my caviar and champagne! __________________ "... Liberty is the seed and soil, the air and light, the dew and rain of progress, love and joy."-- Robert Greene Ingersoll 1894

08-11-2015, 04:31 PM	#19
David-NY User Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Peoples Republic of New York Posts: 33 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 10 Posts	Yeah but a Martz .45 is going to be rarer than a 1900 soon . . .

08-11-2015, 05:38 PM	#20
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,305 Thanks: 2,735 Thanked 991 Times in 727 Posts	Once the Martz is fired(could be only one round) it goes into a larger group of fired specimens. Definitely two different categories, and two different price points. I would be so tempted, as I am a shooter, but I would resist if I owned an unfired Martz.