1943 black widow??

matt ott · 11-01-2010, 05:39 PM

any one out there know if mauser made the black widow lugers with a 1943 date or is it a fake, waiting for picks. any help thanks matt ,,,,,when did mauser make the black griped guns...

Thor · 11-01-2010, 06:21 PM

Black Widow was a marketing name to help make these more desireable (increase the price) usually a Mauser Luger 4" with black plastic grips (fake grips are out there) with the Proper Army type 3 or more frequently a type 4 Army mag that was all black including the bottom piece. They were found on byf toggle codes with "41" or "42" chamber date codes (1941 & 1942). As far as I know only byf/41 or byf/42 were called black widows though the black grips can be found occasionally on eariler Mauser Luger as wood became in short supply. Frank or another more knowledgeable Mauser expert can correct anything I said that was incorrect.

Frank · 11-01-2010, 06:45 PM

Thor is right on if you are talking about Military Mausers!!

Krieghoff made 1943 Lugers, but I believe they had brown grips.

Norme · 11-01-2010, 06:58 PM

Hi Frank, Krieghoff grips were black bakelite from 1940 on, possibly obtained from the same source used by Mauser. Regards, Norm

DavidJayUden · 11-01-2010, 07:48 PM

Currently produced Kreighoff P08s? Let's hear more, although they sound expensive.
dju

Norme · 11-01-2010, 08:13 PM

Here you go, Valentine. 1943 Krieghoff, black bakelite grips.

FNorm · 11-01-2010, 08:14 PM

DJU,

Simpsons has one on their list.

There were several years of black bakelite grips in the Kreighoff line.: 1940, 1941 small date, 1941 large date, 1942, P code series II, etc.

Here's a 1940

FN

Edward Tinker · 11-02-2010, 11:56 AM

Well, Gibson's Krieghoff book says that they DID make them in black grips.

I'm sorry, you ordered a $17k gun and don't own the book about the early ones Lou?

Ed

Frank · 11-02-2010, 12:30 PM

Norme & FNorm, thanks for the correction!!

DavidJayUden · 11-02-2010, 01:25 PM

Lou:
What did they say the wait time was on those babies? Not that I can afford one, just curious. Hope your investment pays off for you.
And those post WW2 Kreighoffs must be pretty collectable, huh? I'll have to read up on them.
Beautiful guns.
dju

suum cuique · 11-03-2010, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by valentine

Here is the current Kreighoff that is for sale. It is still available, only 200 will be made and the numbers will continue right after the brown griped P-08's were left off in 1945. I called them yesterday,10/31/2010 they are 17,545 dollars. I did order one.

http://www.krieghoff.com/ki/index.ph...104&Itemid=150

And Thank you so much Norme for your description and illustration;Your kindly spoken words. You are an incredible asset to this forum. I really appreciate the information.

This is a fascinating place to be and is filled with such fantastic wonderful individuals.
May God bless all of you Luger collectors young and old.

Whow, what a beauty. But 17 K is way over my limit...

ratdog · 11-03-2010, 04:28 PM

Pure insanity!!!!!!!!

11-01-2010, 05:39 PM	#1
matt ott Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 33 Thanks: 3 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	1943 black widow?? any one out there know if mauser made the black widow lugers with a 1943 date or is it a fake, waiting for picks. any help thanks matt ,,,,,when did mauser make the black griped guns...

11-01-2010, 06:21 PM	#2
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Black Widow was a marketing name to help make these more desireable (increase the price) usually a Mauser Luger 4" with black plastic grips (fake grips are out there) with the Proper Army type 3 or more frequently a type 4 Army mag that was all black including the bottom piece. They were found on byf toggle codes with "41" or "42" chamber date codes (1941 & 1942). As far as I know only byf/41 or byf/42 were called black widows though the black grips can be found occasionally on eariler Mauser Luger as wood became in short supply. Frank or another more knowledgeable Mauser expert can correct anything I said that was incorrect. __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

11-01-2010, 08:13 PM	#6
Norme Always A Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,417 Thanks: 226 Thanked 2,607 Times in 933 Posts	Here you go, Valentine. 1943 Krieghoff, black bakelite grips. Attached Thumbnails

11-01-2010, 08:14 PM	#7
FNorm Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 978 Thanks: 68 Thanked 127 Times in 108 Posts	DJU, Simpsons has one on their list. There were several years of black bakelite grips in the Kreighoff line.: 1940, 1941 small date, 1941 large date, 1942, P code series II, etc. Here's a 1940 FN Attached Thumbnails Last edited by FNorm; 11-01-2010 at 08:18 PM. Reason: sp

11-01-2010, 06:45 PM	#3
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 164 Times in 87 Posts	Thor is right on if you are talking about Military Mausers!! Krieghoff made 1943 Lugers, but I believe they had brown grips.

11-01-2010, 06:58 PM	#4
Norme Always A Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,417 Thanks: 226 Thanked 2,607 Times in 933 Posts	Hi Frank, Krieghoff grips were black bakelite from 1940 on, possibly obtained from the same source used by Mauser. Regards, Norm

11-01-2010, 07:48 PM	#5
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Currently produced Kreighoff P08s? Let's hear more, although they sound expensive. dju

11-02-2010, 11:56 AM	#8
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,960 Thanks: 2,062 Thanked 4,591 Times in 2,114 Posts	Well, Gibson's Krieghoff book says that they DID make them in black grips. I'm sorry, you ordered a $17k gun and don't own the book about the early ones Lou? Ed

11-02-2010, 12:30 PM	#9
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 164 Times in 87 Posts	Norme & FNorm, thanks for the correction!!

11-02-2010, 01:25 PM	#10
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Lou: What did they say the wait time was on those babies? Not that I can afford one, just curious. Hope your investment pays off for you. And those post WW2 Kreighoffs must be pretty collectable, huh? I'll have to read up on them. Beautiful guns. dju

11-03-2010, 04:28 PM	#12
ratdog User Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 147 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Pure insanity!!!!!!!!