Norwegian holster

[Vlim]

I want to present a somewhat underestimated holster variation here. Many of these holsters have been modified to appear what they are no longer, taking away the interesting history and generally turning them in none of both: The Norwegian holsters. Some of them are even incorrectly identified as 'captured holsters' presuming they were captured and used by the allies during WW2 (which is incorrect).

After the Germans surrendered in 1945, the Norwegians took over the army supplies of the former occupation forces. Being quite practical, they equipped their own troops with this equipment. As Norway is a NATO-member, the P08 and holster even received a Nato Stock Number (NSN):

1005-25-102-7195: The Pistol 08, 9mm without accessories.
1005-25-102-7196: The Pistol 08 with accessories (including holster).

As the Norwegian army, like most Western-European postwar armies, used the US-style web belt, they modified the holsters accordingly. The leather belt straps were removed and a steel web belt hanger was riveted instead.

The Norwegian army used the P08 until around 1980. The Glock was introduced as a replacement and the last guns (P08 and P38) were traded with a Canadian company. These guns were still German in shape, size and markings and found their way onto the Western American collector's market.

The holsters were sold to a European surplus dealer and they found their way onto the Western-European market. Many holsters had the web hanger removed, the holes plugged and new leather loops sewn on, creating something of an inbetween version, neither one, nor the other...

When an unmodified holster showed up, I immediately bought it, as I wanted one for my small collection, in the state it is in, a holster that started out as German issue, modified by the Norwegians and used until around 1980.

This holster had the main markings on the edge of the back, so that they were not obscured by the web holder that was riveted on.

The maker is DLWP (Deutsche Lederwerkstatten Pirmasens), from Pirmasens, a small town not too far from Karlsruhe. The date is 1940, and the WaA is 416. Being made after 1939, it has the P.08 marking as well.

Norwegian soldiers in the 1970s. Note the P08 holster on the web belt.


The back, the rivetwork can be seen quite well:


The front, pretty standard brown P08 holster:

[mauro]

Nice Gerben,
The Norvegian used the P08 longer than the French.
Actually the French stop using the 1946 P08 and LP08 around 1970.
Thank you for the info.
Ciao
Mauro

[LU1900]

[..........

[Steinar]

For those interested..
ww2 P08 and p38's (including the crappy post war P38's made for our army) saw service as guard sidearms even in the 90s. As G. van Vlimmeren stated, most where faded out within the 80's.
However, we also had the Kongsberg Colt 1911 that was more common until the Glock where issued.
The machineguns are actually still in service within the homeguard. It's not that different from the HK MG3 wich is the standard MG in the norwegian army.
The K98 rifle, saw 'service' until the 80's as well. But as a rifle issued to the homeguard. Stored away in private homes.. but naturly most common since the late 60's has been the HK A3 assult rifle known as AG3 here. Most of it made by Kongsberg on contract.. damn good rifle.. under replacement today.
I have had the 'pleasure' to have all above as a sidearm back when I was working in the military + some stuff..

I have 10-15 of these web converted holsters on my attic.. send me a PM if anyone is interested. All with original german marking and without post war norwegian markings.

[mauro]

Bonjour Pat,
Let me rephrase:

The P08 (maybe LP08) made by Mauser under French control in 1946 where used by Army and Gendarmerie. The Gendarmerie was the last official user, in fact they stop using the P08 in the 1970.

You know the LP08 were used by the Spahis of the General Konig when he was the Chief of the French Area in Germany (Headquarter located in Baden Baden).
What it is really interesting is that both the P08 and the LP08 are codified in the French Army Logistic files (you know something like the current NATO Stock number and part number) with the following numbers:

151.311 300 100 and E.M.A. 1 113 41

With these two numbers the French identified the standard model as well as what they call â??long barrel type with tangent sight â?� (the LP08 I deduce).

I agree with you that most probably they never use operationally the LP08 but, formally specking, they are codified in the Logistic Army Files.

Bonne dimanche.
Amicalement,
Mauro

[olivier5848]

Hello to all

The LP08 was never used by the gendarmerie.
The P08 was used by the gendarmerie after the war near the P38 (made under licence by manurhin and stocks from the war). The gendarmerie stop using the P08 in the 50 when the MAC 50 enter in service.
The P38 was stoped to used by the gendarmerie in the 1970.
The MAC 50 is always on stock but not used.

Best regards

Olivier

[mauro]

Hi Olivier,
You are right, there are not formal evidences (document) to state that the LP08 was used by the Gendarmerie.
Let me fix something on your previous statement, if I can:

The P08 was used by the gendarmerie until 1970. I have two evidences about this specific point:

1) if you look at the official gendarmerie web site you can read the following:

â??De toutes ces armes, une seule fait carriÃ?¨re, la Sten. Si cette mitraillette est rentrÃ?©e en gendarmerie dâ??une faÃ?§on Ã?« classique Ã?», il nâ??est est pas de mÃ?ªme pour deux futurs PA rÃ?©glementaires dâ??origine allemande. Il sâ??agit bien entendu des mythiques Luger P 08 et Walther P 38, qui sont en service de 1945 au dÃ?©but des annÃ?©es 1970. Lâ??arrivÃ?©e officielle de ces deux PA au sein de lâ??armÃ?©e franÃ?§aise, et plus particuliÃ?¨rement dans la gendarmerie, fait suite Ã?Â* une prise de guerre consÃ?©quente.â?Â�

2) In a letter exchanged between Mr.Kornmayer and the â??Ministere dâ??etat chargeâ?? de la defense nationaleâ?� on date 18 january 1973 (I have one copy of this letter in my files), Mr. Daumard (sous directeur du controle du commerce international des materiels de guerre) wrote:

â??En effet ce type dâ??arme (he was writing about P08) qui �©tait utilis�© par la Gendarmerie Fran�§aise nâ??est plus en service depuis 1970. Les pistolets one �©t�© mis en depotâ?¦â?�


I am doing in deep research about the use of the LP08 and P08 by the French Army and Gendarmerie (no LP08) and I am in contact with a couple of Ministerial offices that are providing to me some really interesting documents about the use of the P08 and LP08.
I need all these documentation for my new book project about post WWII Mauser production.

All information you can provide to me about the use of the French models is really welcomed.

Have fun
Ciao

Mauro

P.S. Hereafter the link to the Gendarmerie web page I mentioned above:

http://www.servicehistorique.sga.def...nt/centre1.htm