Premium For 1915 Date?

Mauser720 · 09-08-2007, 03:15 PM

I have a copy of "The Bluebook of Gun Values" which is about 6 or 7 years old. It says to add a premium of 20% to the value of an artillery Luger if the gun is dated 1915. I am wondering what is the reason for this premium to be added to LP-08s that were made in 1915? Thank you for any information on this topic.

Ron - Mauser720

MFC · 09-09-2007, 10:48 PM

These numbers come from Standard Catalog of Luger by Aarron Davis.
Quantities made or approximate.
1914 Artillery, Erfurt- 23,000

1914 Artillery, DWM- 5,000
1915 " " -15,000
1916 " " -20,000
1917 " " -90,000
1918 " " -25,000

There have been lots of mistakes reported in this book, so I don't know how accurate it is.
Seems to me that the highest premium should be added to a 1914 dated DWM Artillery, but if you add 1914 Erfurt and 1914 DWM, fewer were made in 1915.
Mike C.

Pete Ebbink · 09-09-2007, 10:54 PM

Mike,

Those DWM & Erfurt LP-08 numbers match what Jan Still has in his Imperial Lugers book, published 1991.

Mauser720 · 09-09-2007, 10:55 PM

Mike -

Well, I'd have to agree that it looks like based on production numbers that the 1914 DWM should receive the premium. Strange.

Thanks for the information.

Ron

MFC · 09-09-2007, 11:04 PM

Pete,
I'm still looking for Imperial Lugers, for a reasonable price.
$300 (ouch).

Mike C.

lugerholsterrepair · 09-09-2007, 11:08 PM

Ron, The 1914 DWM IS at a premium. $10 Grand if you are lucky..$15,000 is more likely the starting price for one today. I don't keep up as there are very few offered.
Jerry Burney

Mauser720 · 09-09-2007, 11:23 PM

Jerry -

Well, maybe at the time this particular edition of the "Blue Book of Gun Values" was being published, they were only looking at total production numbers by year. If that's all they were looking at, then the 1915 would appear to be the year of lowest total production. Maybe it's just another case of the informed collectors knowing more about the subject than the editor of the book. Anyway, thank you for the excellent information.

Mauser720, Ron

Gary H · 10-30-2007, 07:45 PM

I just put a few rounds through my 1915 LP-08 a little over a week ago. that was fun. It's been years since I've shot it.

Gary

spartacus38 · 10-31-2007, 04:19 AM

On 10/17/05 Jan Still said that in his new book

Central Powers he estimates production of the

1914 DWM Artillery at less than 750 not 5000

as reported in Imperial Lugers.

Bob

John F. · 11-02-2007, 08:39 PM

Interesting! Any ideas on what an all-original, matching number 1915 DWM Artillery in ~85% condition/excellent bore would be worth these days?

Thanks,
John

Lugerdoc · 11-03-2007, 09:39 AM

Jerry, Seven years ago, most collectors didn't believe that the 1914 DWM Lpo8s existed, or perhaps were not original. TH

spartacus38 · 11-03-2007, 11:36 AM

Hi Tom, I now have 18 DWM 1914 Artillerys reported.

There are also 2 dubious and 1 mismatched reported.

Bob Young

Big Norm · 11-03-2007, 11:12 PM

Bob,
If you don't have Serial #'s 262, 1339, 3669 and 7754, then you now have 22 reported. My 262 is also unit marked. I wouldn't trade any of them for a common ol' 1915 artillery (Hee! Hee!). I also sincerely hope that Jerrys price estimates are correct.

Big Norm

spartacus38 · 11-03-2007, 11:37 PM

Big Norm, Thank you.

This is to confirm that you have 4 DWM 1914 Artillerys.

Their serial numbers are :

262 I have this one recorded.

1339

3669 Note: There are none recorded above #1612.

7754

Thank you,

Bob

Big Norm · 11-04-2007, 12:59 PM

Bob,
Jan Stills 'Imperial Lugers and Their Accessories' page 15. The serial number ranges are 262-1995a. This is the first time that I noticed that my 262 is the first in his serial range. I got a celebrety LP-08!! The line forms to the right gentlemen.

I just looked at my serial numbered 7754. Its a beauty. All matching, including the grips and the magazine which was the spare ('+' marked). If this gun was ever restored, someone did a masterful job. I also have a 1914 artillery holster that would go great with it. I paid as much for that holster as I would for most other artilleries.

I was planning on going to Ed Tinkers house this summer and to swing over to Jerrys place this past summer, but my motor home was destroyed in a fire. Instead, I spent the rest of the summer settling my insurance claim and customizing my new motor home for this hunting season. Hopefully, I will make the trip next summer. Bragging is good. Never been to Colorado. I plan to take my new Dachshund with me too. If my 1914 DWM LP-08's don't break thier hearts, then my Dachshund will.
Big Norm

paradox998 · 11-05-2007, 11:09 PM

Hi all:

I have a 1914 dwm artillery serial numbered 7970b Seems to be out of range, but everything else checks out. Purchased this as a restored piece from Lugerman (Eugene Golustov) about six weeks ago. The restoration is very nice, but now I wonder about the serial number. Is it possible that some were out of sequence? Barrel has the appropriate proofs and the frame is cut for the artillery sight. All the numbers match. Any comments?

Big Norm · 11-06-2007, 10:02 AM

Paradox998,
I can't say one way or another. Personally, because of the scarcity of this particular year and manufacturer, I go absolutely by the serial numbers. But there might be exceptions. Without highly detailed pictures and maybe a physical examination by somone who REALLY knows his Lugers, I don't think anyone could give a definite answer. Just too much counterfeiting going on out there at these prices.
Big Norm

09-09-2007, 10:48 PM	#2
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	These numbers come from Standard Catalog of Luger by Aarron Davis. Quantities made or approximate. 1914 Artillery, Erfurt- 23,000 1914 Artillery, DWM- 5,000 1915 " " -15,000 1916 " " -20,000 1917 " " -90,000 1918 " " -25,000 There have been lots of mistakes reported in this book, so I don't know how accurate it is. Seems to me that the highest premium should be added to a 1914 dated DWM Artillery, but if you add 1914 Erfurt and 1914 DWM, fewer were made in 1915. Mike C. __________________ Mike C.

09-09-2007, 10:55 PM	#4
Mauser720 User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Kansas Posts: 535 Thanks: 18 Thanked 49 Times in 33 Posts	Mike - Well, I'd have to agree that it looks like based on production numbers that the 1914 DWM should receive the premium. Strange. Thanks for the information. Ron __________________ Mauser720 - Ron "Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it."

09-09-2007, 11:04 PM	#5
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	Pete, I'm still looking for Imperial Lugers, for a reasonable price. $300 (ouch). Mike C. __________________ Mike C.

09-09-2007, 11:08 PM	#6
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,763 Thanks: 4,866 Thanked 3,105 Times in 1,429 Posts	Ron, The 1914 DWM IS at a premium. $10 Grand if you are lucky..$15,000 is more likely the starting price for one today. I don't keep up as there are very few offered. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

09-09-2007, 11:23 PM	#7
Mauser720 User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Kansas Posts: 535 Thanks: 18 Thanked 49 Times in 33 Posts	Jerry - Well, maybe at the time this particular edition of the "Blue Book of Gun Values" was being published, they were only looking at total production numbers by year. If that's all they were looking at, then the 1915 would appear to be the year of lowest total production. Maybe it's just another case of the informed collectors knowing more about the subject than the editor of the book. Anyway, thank you for the excellent information. Mauser720, Ron __________________ Mauser720 - Ron "Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it."

09-08-2007, 03:15 PM	#1
Mauser720 User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Kansas Posts: 535 Thanks: 18 Thanked 49 Times in 33 Posts	Premium For 1915 Date? I have a copy of "The Bluebook of Gun Values" which is about 6 or 7 years old. It says to add a premium of 20% to the value of an artillery Luger if the gun is dated 1915. I am wondering what is the reason for this premium to be added to LP-08s that were made in 1915? Thank you for any information on this topic. Ron - Mauser720

09-09-2007, 10:54 PM	#3
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Mike, Those DWM & Erfurt LP-08 numbers match what Jan Still has in his Imperial Lugers book, published 1991.

10-30-2007, 07:45 PM	#8
Gary H User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 31 Thanks: 22 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I just put a few rounds through my 1915 LP-08 a little over a week ago. that was fun. It's been years since I've shot it. Gary

10-31-2007, 04:19 AM	#9
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	1914 DWM Artillery On 10/17/05 Jan Still said that in his new book Central Powers he estimates production of the 1914 DWM Artillery at less than 750 not 5000 as reported in Imperial Lugers. Bob

11-02-2007, 08:39 PM	#10
John F. User Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 37 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Interesting! Any ideas on what an all-original, matching number 1915 DWM Artillery in ~85% condition/excellent bore would be worth these days? Thanks, John __________________ John

11-03-2007, 09:39 AM	#11
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Jerry, Seven years ago, most collectors didn't believe that the 1914 DWM Lpo8s existed, or perhaps were not original. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

11-03-2007, 11:36 AM	#12
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	Hi Tom, I now have 18 DWM 1914 Artillerys reported. There are also 2 dubious and 1 mismatched reported. Bob Young

11-03-2007, 11:12 PM	#13
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Bob, If you don't have Serial #'s 262, 1339, 3669 and 7754, then you now have 22 reported. My 262 is also unit marked. I wouldn't trade any of them for a common ol' 1915 artillery (Hee! Hee!). I also sincerely hope that Jerrys price estimates are correct. Big Norm

11-03-2007, 11:37 PM	#14
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	1914 DWM Artillerys Big Norm, Thank you. This is to confirm that you have 4 DWM 1914 Artillerys. Their serial numbers are : 262 I have this one recorded. 1339 3669 Note: There are none recorded above #1612. 7754 Thank you, Bob

11-04-2007, 12:59 PM	#15
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Bob, Jan Stills 'Imperial Lugers and Their Accessories' page 15. The serial number ranges are 262-1995a. This is the first time that I noticed that my 262 is the first in his serial range. I got a celebrety LP-08!! The line forms to the right gentlemen. I just looked at my serial numbered 7754. Its a beauty. All matching, including the grips and the magazine which was the spare ('+' marked). If this gun was ever restored, someone did a masterful job. I also have a 1914 artillery holster that would go great with it. I paid as much for that holster as I would for most other artilleries. I was planning on going to Ed Tinkers house this summer and to swing over to Jerrys place this past summer, but my motor home was destroyed in a fire. Instead, I spent the rest of the summer settling my insurance claim and customizing my new motor home for this hunting season. Hopefully, I will make the trip next summer. Bragging is good. Never been to Colorado. I plan to take my new Dachshund with me too. If my 1914 DWM LP-08's don't break thier hearts, then my Dachshund will. Big Norm

11-05-2007, 11:09 PM	#16
paradox998 User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: South Florida Posts: 105 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi all: I have a 1914 dwm artillery serial numbered 7970b Seems to be out of range, but everything else checks out. Purchased this as a restored piece from Lugerman (Eugene Golustov) about six weeks ago. The restoration is very nice, but now I wonder about the serial number. Is it possible that some were out of sequence? Barrel has the appropriate proofs and the frame is cut for the artillery sight. All the numbers match. Any comments?

11-06-2007, 10:02 AM	#17
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Paradox998, I can't say one way or another. Personally, because of the scarcity of this particular year and manufacturer, I go absolutely by the serial numbers. But there might be exceptions. Without highly detailed pictures and maybe a physical examination by somone who REALLY knows his Lugers, I don't think anyone could give a definite answer. Just too much counterfeiting going on out there at these prices. Big Norm