Need Repro Stock Help

HardBaller · 04-24-2007, 12:18 PM

Gents,

Have a 1917 Artillery that has been "restored". Am pleased with that aspect (not really but I can't afford a 100% condition Arty so...) and I want to add a repro stock unit with holster rig. This Arty is super accurate and what I want is a shooter with the stock rig so...

Options that I currently have are:

1) CMR unit, say they are going to be back in stock in August

2) Numrich Arms (which I have read here is a POC)

3) Odin/Mauser from a local gunshop. About 96% or so, has a small chip in it that would be covered by the holster. Leather on it is horrible.

4) HGCA show is upcomming next month and there are ususally several shown at varying makers/ prices/conditions that will allow me to check fit personally.

5) Key Enterprises, showing in current SGNews, limited numbers they say and pricey but fascimile copies of the 1913 Experimental (which seems to be off in several respects), and others not normally seen.

So...what would you folks suggest?

Any input would be appreciated and thanks in advance.

Tim
Houston, TX

lugerholsterrepair · 04-24-2007, 03:03 PM

Tim, 3) Odin/Mauser from a local gunshop. About 96% or so, has a small chip in it that would be covered by the holster. Leather on it is horrible.

How much does the gun shop owner want for this stock? Depending on price etc. at least you could take your pistol in and see if the stock locks onto it.

Leather can be a problem...Good original leather could run you $300-400. If you can find it and maybe more. You will look a long time to find a carry strap..They were the first thing to go.

Really crappy but useable leather is fairly inexpensive.

5) Key Enterprises, showing in current SGNews, limited numbers they say and pricey but fascimile copies of the 1913 Experimental (which seems to be off in several respects), and others not normally seen.

I would stay away from anything that is not your normal military configuration. This will save you trouble in many respects. Jerry Burney

John Sabato · 04-24-2007, 05:54 PM

( Jerry is Not wanting to toot his own horn...)

But since it is a repro stock you are looking for, the one from ODIN is likely the best quality... and any replacement leather you need for it can be obtained from Jerry Burney (lugerholsterrepair)... what ever he charges you will be worth the quality you receive... there is none finer.

thegundude · 04-24-2007, 09:49 PM

I just went this route not long ago and had to make some very basic decisions. Mainly, cost...

There is a very wide gulf between the Numrich stuff and high quality repro stuff. Stock and repro hoster from Numrich will run you about two bills or so. Everything else seems to start at around five hundred and go up rather sharply.

But if you want the good stuff, Jerry Burney is your man...

HardBaller · 04-25-2007, 08:16 PM

Thanks to all who responded. Jerry, gonna take your advice I think. Will be in touch with you soon about leather for this puppy.

THANKS again to all who responded.

Tim

lugerholsterrepair · 04-25-2007, 08:46 PM

Gentlemen all, Thanks for your support of my humble craft. I do appreciate all of you who praise my work. I am extremly proud of the work I do on Artillery leathers. With one small exception on the boot they are museum quality and made as the Germans made them. Hand hammered rivets and all.
There are poor cheap repro's out there but I do not compete for that market.
Thanks John & Steve! Jerry Burney

HardBaller · 04-27-2007, 02:25 PM

Will probably be in touch sooner than anticipated. I snoozed and "loozed" on the Odin model locally. Dealer wanted $375.00 for same, went back and adios as they say. So...guess I am waiting on CMR in August restock.

Saw the one on Ebay after this post, now over $380.00, wonder how high it will go? 3 days left.

Anyone have thoughts on that one? How much would one of these be "worth"? I know it's worth what you will pay or what another would pay but what would YOU pay for Odin repro vs CMR or others?

Tim

lugerholsterrepair · 04-27-2007, 02:53 PM

Tim, I would be patient. Honestly if I were having to pay 400 or a repro I would kick in another 4 bills and get an original. The way this stuff is shooting up, in 5 years an original will bring 1200. Wouldn't be a bad investment. Repro stocks used to be 50 to a hundred. I have an Odin in the box I use for Artillery leather fittings. Just like money in the bank I guess!
To answer your question..I have never been a fan of the poor workmanship on Sarco stocks. CMR..I have never caught them with one in stock. They always say they will have them but seldom if ever do. I can't say as I remember the quality. I know I've seen one but can't say what the next batch may be like.

Jerry Burney

Pete Ebbink · 04-27-2007, 03:12 PM

Glad I got my Odin stock in box for $ 150 about 1.5 years ago...

lugerholsterrepair · 04-27-2007, 03:22 PM

Pete, I keep pretty close tabs on stocks..As well as other Luger accoutrements. This stuff has taken a giant leap in one and a half years. Supply and demand.
One thing I have noticed...less original stuff shows up on eBay and the repro stuff is going up because of that.
Jerry Burney

HardBaller · 04-27-2007, 04:21 PM

Pete,

Thanks for rubbin it in.

. Think I am going to see what the upcomming HGCA will bring. Here is the "issue" for me (OH GREAT, another "issue" from a newbie).

I have a really nice (IMO) "restored" 1917 Arty from, drum roll please, Lugerman (dahn, dahn, dahhnnnn). Have heard various reports of his work but Eugene did better than good by me on this one. From the posts here (various tutorials, sticky's, and posts) it is really hard to tell this one has been redone. Edges are VERY sharp, all markings/proofs/numbers are where they should be and are clear and sharp. Only thing that really stands out is it is rustblued to the muzzle and it looks "too good". I have been told that the metal was durn near perfect in condition but that it had almost no finish left when project was started.

Will post pics when I can get around to it and let you guys pick me apart but the point is that I really like this gun. I wanted a "as close to new" Arty for a shooter, this one came up on GB, and I think the pricing I got if for was much more than fair (under 1500.00). In short, this thing looks like a zillion bucks to me and shoots WAY better than I am ever going to be able to, and I don't have to lose sleep about ruining something that has HUGE collector value.

But...it seems that pricing is going looney on these items. My thoughts were to add a high quality repro stock, go with a high quality repro leather set up, and have a nice shootin rig that really turns heads (just like my C96 does when stocked up and rockin). Maybe I am better off adding original items to Mr. Arty? What do you guys think on that? Jerry's response on patience is very duly noted and holds a lot of appeal. My bad that I did not get this particular bug earlier but I am dumping some super prime Smiths and prewar Colts to feed my addiction.

So what is the "harm" done if I add original items (anyone have stock iron 3933 out there?)? And is there any "harm" done to either use repro or restored items mixed with originals? What about Trommels? Would it not detract value to have one restored? Does that same hold true for wooden items like stocks? I would think that leather restoration would be a GOOD thing too but I am new here and seeking the light in the wilderness.

Thanks for the help to date and keep your thoughts coming. I may definately be billed for the therapy.

Tim

thegundude · 04-28-2007, 03:04 PM

Tim, IMHO, the short answer to most of your question is that it's all good. Whatever level you want to take it to is up to you.

In my case, my Artillery Luger has an all matching top and an all matching bottom, they just don't match each other.

So, for me to spend a lot of money on some "stuff" to make it a nice rig just didn't make sense. So, I spent about $200 and made a nice rig, for me.

If it was all matching and in 90% condition, I'd definately have had to sink the money into and all original holster and stock. No doubt.

If it were somewhere in between those conditions, maybe I'd have gone with the high dollar repros from Jerry. I think each case deserves that individual attention and can only be made by each individual collector.

But that's just me...

RBorecky · 07-13-2007, 11:20 AM

I would like to find some stock iron to have fun making a stock for myself and one for my father. I have been working on wood for many years now and this would be enjoyable for me. Is there anywhere to get the metal?? Thanks,,Rick B { A.K.A. Stock Doc }

Pete Ebbink · 07-13-2007, 11:34 AM

"Revshop" on eBay (aka Ken Kontos, MidWest Firearms) is selling these offerings.

http://search.ebay.com/search/search...ron&category0=

Might do well to 'search' the term "revshop" on the LF search feature...

Another iron is offered on eBay here :

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

vtwoodchuck · 07-13-2007, 02:52 PM

I bought an Artillery and a Navy holster/strap/pouch set from CMR last fall and was pleased with the quality and workmanship of them. They may not be spot on as to an exact repro but they were close enough for me. I haven't tried one of their stocks yet. Shipping seemed high. Doug

George Anderson · 07-13-2007, 09:05 PM

There are 1920's commercial stocks that can be had at times for less than $700. They are perfect. There are excellent repro holsters that can be had for $300-? they are excellent. For attaching leather there is no better source than jerry Burney.

Since you have a reworked shooter LP08 that you want to outfit and shoot, I feel that you would be upside-down in putting original stuff on it as it would have greater value than the pistol and be in greater liklihood of being damaged.

04-24-2007, 12:18 PM	#1
HardBaller User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Republic of Texas Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Need Repro Stock Help Gents, Have a 1917 Artillery that has been "restored". Am pleased with that aspect (not really but I can't afford a 100% condition Arty so...) and I want to add a repro stock unit with holster rig. This Arty is super accurate and what I want is a shooter with the stock rig so... Options that I currently have are: 1) CMR unit, say they are going to be back in stock in August 2) Numrich Arms (which I have read here is a POC) 3) Odin/Mauser from a local gunshop. About 96% or so, has a small chip in it that would be covered by the holster. Leather on it is horrible. 4) HGCA show is upcomming next month and there are ususally several shown at varying makers/ prices/conditions that will allow me to check fit personally. 5) Key Enterprises, showing in current SGNews, limited numbers they say and pricey but fascimile copies of the 1913 Experimental (which seems to be off in several respects), and others not normally seen. So...what would you folks suggest? Any input would be appreciated and thanks in advance. Tim Houston, TX __________________ Better to Die On Your Feet Than Live On Your Knees

04-24-2007, 03:03 PM	#2
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,775 Thanks: 4,995 Thanked 3,133 Times in 1,439 Posts	Tim, 3) Odin/Mauser from a local gunshop. About 96% or so, has a small chip in it that would be covered by the holster. Leather on it is horrible. How much does the gun shop owner want for this stock? Depending on price etc. at least you could take your pistol in and see if the stock locks onto it. Leather can be a problem...Good original leather could run you $300-400. If you can find it and maybe more. You will look a long time to find a carry strap..They were the first thing to go. Really crappy but useable leather is fairly inexpensive. 5) Key Enterprises, showing in current SGNews, limited numbers they say and pricey but fascimile copies of the 1913 Experimental (which seems to be off in several respects), and others not normally seen. I would stay away from anything that is not your normal military configuration. This will save you trouble in many respects. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

04-24-2007, 05:54 PM	#3
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	( Jerry is Not wanting to toot his own horn...) But since it is a repro stock you are looking for, the one from ODIN is likely the best quality... and any replacement leather you need for it can be obtained from Jerry Burney (lugerholsterrepair)... what ever he charges you will be worth the quality you receive... there is none finer. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

04-24-2007, 09:49 PM	#4
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	I just went this route not long ago and had to make some very basic decisions. Mainly, cost... There is a very wide gulf between the Numrich stuff and high quality repro stuff. Stock and repro hoster from Numrich will run you about two bills or so. Everything else seems to start at around five hundred and go up rather sharply. But if you want the good stuff, Jerry Burney is your man... __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

04-25-2007, 08:16 PM	#5
HardBaller User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Republic of Texas Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks to all who responded. Jerry, gonna take your advice I think. Will be in touch with you soon about leather for this puppy. THANKS again to all who responded. Tim __________________ Better to Die On Your Feet Than Live On Your Knees

04-25-2007, 08:46 PM	#6
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,775 Thanks: 4,995 Thanked 3,133 Times in 1,439 Posts	Gentlemen all, Thanks for your support of my humble craft. I do appreciate all of you who praise my work. I am extremly proud of the work I do on Artillery leathers. With one small exception on the boot they are museum quality and made as the Germans made them. Hand hammered rivets and all. There are poor cheap repro's out there but I do not compete for that market. Thanks John & Steve! Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

04-27-2007, 02:25 PM	#7
HardBaller User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Republic of Texas Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Will probably be in touch sooner than anticipated. I snoozed and "loozed" on the Odin model locally. Dealer wanted $375.00 for same, went back and adios as they say. So...guess I am waiting on CMR in August restock. Saw the one on Ebay after this post, now over $380.00, wonder how high it will go? 3 days left. Anyone have thoughts on that one? How much would one of these be "worth"? I know it's worth what you will pay or what another would pay but what would YOU pay for Odin repro vs CMR or others? Tim __________________ Better to Die On Your Feet Than Live On Your Knees

04-27-2007, 02:53 PM	#8
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,775 Thanks: 4,995 Thanked 3,133 Times in 1,439 Posts	Tim, I would be patient. Honestly if I were having to pay 400 or a repro I would kick in another 4 bills and get an original. The way this stuff is shooting up, in 5 years an original will bring 1200. Wouldn't be a bad investment. Repro stocks used to be 50 to a hundred. I have an Odin in the box I use for Artillery leather fittings. Just like money in the bank I guess! To answer your question..I have never been a fan of the poor workmanship on Sarco stocks. CMR..I have never caught them with one in stock. They always say they will have them but seldom if ever do. I can't say as I remember the quality. I know I've seen one but can't say what the next batch may be like. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

04-27-2007, 03:12 PM	#9
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Glad I got my Odin stock in box for $ 150 about 1.5 years ago...

04-27-2007, 03:22 PM	#10
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,775 Thanks: 4,995 Thanked 3,133 Times in 1,439 Posts	Pete, I keep pretty close tabs on stocks..As well as other Luger accoutrements. This stuff has taken a giant leap in one and a half years. Supply and demand. One thing I have noticed...less original stuff shows up on eBay and the repro stuff is going up because of that. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

04-27-2007, 04:21 PM	#11
HardBaller User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Republic of Texas Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Pete, Thanks for rubbin it in. . Think I am going to see what the upcomming HGCA will bring. Here is the "issue" for me (OH GREAT, another "issue" from a newbie). I have a really nice (IMO) "restored" 1917 Arty from, drum roll please, Lugerman (dahn, dahn, dahhnnnn). Have heard various reports of his work but Eugene did better than good by me on this one. From the posts here (various tutorials, sticky's, and posts) it is really hard to tell this one has been redone. Edges are VERY sharp, all markings/proofs/numbers are where they should be and are clear and sharp. Only thing that really stands out is it is rustblued to the muzzle and it looks "too good". I have been told that the metal was durn near perfect in condition but that it had almost no finish left when project was started. Will post pics when I can get around to it and let you guys pick me apart but the point is that I really like this gun. I wanted a "as close to new" Arty for a shooter, this one came up on GB, and I think the pricing I got if for was much more than fair (under 1500.00). In short, this thing looks like a zillion bucks to me and shoots WAY better than I am ever going to be able to, and I don't have to lose sleep about ruining something that has HUGE collector value. But...it seems that pricing is going looney on these items. My thoughts were to add a high quality repro stock, go with a high quality repro leather set up, and have a nice shootin rig that really turns heads (just like my C96 does when stocked up and rockin). Maybe I am better off adding original items to Mr. Arty? What do you guys think on that? Jerry's response on patience is very duly noted and holds a lot of appeal. My bad that I did not get this particular bug earlier but I am dumping some super prime Smiths and prewar Colts to feed my addiction. So what is the "harm" done if I add original items (anyone have stock iron 3933 out there?)? And is there any "harm" done to either use repro or restored items mixed with originals? What about Trommels? Would it not detract value to have one restored? Does that same hold true for wooden items like stocks? I would think that leather restoration would be a GOOD thing too but I am new here and seeking the light in the wilderness. Thanks for the help to date and keep your thoughts coming. I may definately be billed for the therapy. Tim __________________ Better to Die On Your Feet Than Live On Your Knees

04-28-2007, 03:04 PM	#12
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	Tim, IMHO, the short answer to most of your question is that it's all good. Whatever level you want to take it to is up to you. In my case, my Artillery Luger has an all matching top and an all matching bottom, they just don't match each other. So, for me to spend a lot of money on some "stuff" to make it a nice rig just didn't make sense. So, I spent about $200 and made a nice rig, for me. If it was all matching and in 90% condition, I'd definately have had to sink the money into and all original holster and stock. No doubt. If it were somewhere in between those conditions, maybe I'd have gone with the high dollar repros from Jerry. I think each case deserves that individual attention and can only be made by each individual collector. But that's just me... __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

07-13-2007, 11:20 AM	#13
RBorecky User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cleveland,Ohio Posts: 115 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I would like to find some stock iron to have fun making a stock for myself and one for my father. I have been working on wood for many years now and this would be enjoyable for me. Is there anywhere to get the metal?? Thanks,,Rick B { A.K.A. Stock Doc }

07-13-2007, 11:34 AM	#14
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	"Revshop" on eBay (aka Ken Kontos, MidWest Firearms) is selling these offerings. http://search.ebay.com/search/search...ron&category0= Might do well to 'search' the term "revshop" on the LF search feature... Another iron is offered on eBay here : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

07-13-2007, 02:52 PM	#15
vtwoodchuck User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Morrisville, Vermont Posts: 68 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	I bought an Artillery and a Navy holster/strap/pouch set from CMR last fall and was pleased with the quality and workmanship of them. They may not be spot on as to an exact repro but they were close enough for me. I haven't tried one of their stocks yet. Shipping seemed high. Doug __________________ Doug

07-13-2007, 09:05 PM	#16
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,773 Thanked 2,531 Times in 788 Posts	There are 1920's commercial stocks that can be had at times for less than $700. They are perfect. There are excellent repro holsters that can be had for $300-? they are excellent. For attaching leather there is no better source than jerry Burney. Since you have a reworked shooter LP08 that you want to outfit and shoot, I feel that you would be upside-down in putting original stuff on it as it would have greater value than the pistol and be in greater liklihood of being damaged.