1918 DWM Proof Marks

[roy]

I have a 1918 DWM Luger I just bought and I can't id some of the proof marks.

There is one very, very, very small stamp just in front of the rear site that looks like a small circle with alot of short lines [ like a drawing of someones hair standing up after they put their finger in a lite socket] from the 11:00 o-clock psn. to the 1:00 o-clock psn. Then at the 2,3,4,5, o-clock psn. there are longer lines, at the 6 is a Captial D with another long line at the 7 o-clock psn and nothing else back to 11:00.

A dealer said he thought it was a East German mark however this can't be because the guy I bought it from took it off a dead German bomber pilot that had crashed close by in 1944. He came home in 1945 and brought the gun with him and it has never been out of his sight until he sold it to me.

Does anyone have any info on the stamp?

Thanks Roy

[Edward Tinker]

Roy, can you provide pictures of it? It does sound like a post war proofing / marking, but a good picture or two would help very much,

Have you looked through the proofs and markings on this site to see if any match?

go to www.lugerforum.com then technical and then proof markings and take a look.

Also, not to doubt the vet or you, but I have heard stories of "this is the gun I brought back" and it couldn't be, because it has wrong proofs etc., on it.

Ed

[roy]

I can't get a photo of it because it is so small. With out a magnifing glass you can't hardly see it. One person said it might be Danzig police marking.
He has a Constanzo Proof book but I don't have one.

I have already look in the technical section and it is not there.

The gun has 1918 on top of the receiver, on the right side of the receiver it has the proof markings of DWM [as shown in Luger at Large, page 39,mark number 15], all the parts are numbered to the serial number[2182]
In the German WWII alpha codes, under the Bs, it has the center b under the sn on the front of the frame.
It came with the No.1 and No.2 mags and both are serial numbered to the gun. Will this information help?

Thank you for you help, anything else you can I will appreciate.
roy

[Lugerdoc]

Roy, If the two "matching" mags numbered 1 & 2 are of the extruded Schmeisser type (any markings on the bodies?) with an off center pin in the middle of the aluminum bottom, chanches are these were DDR additions. Th

[roy]

Ed
I screwed up. [had a senior monment] When I refered to the [b] I said it was a German alpha code, thats wrong. As I understand it, it is part of the serial number of the gun. in my case my complete number is 22182. Would that be correct?

This is my first Luger, and I am trying to learn all I can about the gun. I collect Thompsons and they are confusing but nothing like this.

I have a friend that has a camra that might be able to get a photo of this stamp and I will also try the scanner.

I also have some stamp marks in the grips. In the right grip is a 5 and a circle with a astrick looking thing on top of it and a L extending down from the left side of the circle. The left grip has a D and a letter N. Do you know what these mean?

Thanks again for all your help. Have a great New Year.

roy

[roy]

Th

Both mags are Schmeisser, No. 1 is blued or black, has Haenel in the arrow and Schmeisser, and patent on the side of the body. The disassembly pin is in the center of the button.

The number 2 is stainless and has Haenel in the arrow with Schmeisser printed above it and a stamp of a flower or somthing like it below. The disassembly pin is on the back edge of the body.

Thank You for your help, Have a great New Year.

roy

[Edward Tinker]

hey roy, I have senior moments all the time

Interior markings on grips, well of the magazine, etc., usually are rework or manufacturing marks, it is unknown what they mean, but not overly pertnant.

The serial number you gave is for a commerical, and early, so maybe good pictures of it, both sides, etc., would help very much.

Ed

[Ron Wood]

I am not sure, but I think when Roy stated his serial number is 22182 he was taking in to account the "b" suffix (20,000), so the serial number is 2182b making it a military and not an early commercial. Also, commercials are not dated and he has indicated it is a 1918.

[Vlim]

Hi,

The description sounds like a sunburst police property mark.

[saxman]

He thinks 2218b is 22182 because 'b' is the second letter of the alphabet. 2218b is of course the actual serial number, although it is only unique to the 1918 DWM production.

[roy]

Here are the pictures;

roy














Picture of what the last picture is of:

[policeluger]

Costanzo ID'ed this as a proof used in the "Danzig sector for police". Police "PTV" proofed and Simson E/6. only thing wrong with this gun is it's not in my collection.....a great gun.

[Edward Tinker]

Hey, Howard I was going to say that! ((that it should be in my collection and not yours )

[jcoe]

Roy,
I enjoyed seeing your Danzig police proofed P08. A similar sunburst/D is found in similar location on DWM P08 #2645m dated 1917/1920 with an added police sear and mag safety.
WOL (Costanzo) does not show this Danzig police marking in this place (toggle) so I would presume this placement is unusual and it was nice to see another example. P08 2645m also is stamped with PTV/E on barrel right and E/43,E/49 on barrel left.
FWIW similar to your P08, #2645m was a LP08 and its new barrel also was marked with a â??4â?� on bottom Here is a picture of the Danzig proof if I can work the system.
John



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[saxman]

I'm guessing the barrel was changed out for the conversion to 9mm, but what's up with the overstruck serial number on mag #2?

[Edward Tinker]

The first one looks good to me, but the 2nd, well, some armorer or later dude wanted it to match...

I wonder if it looks so obvious in real-life? Because I have one that a close up with a camera makes it look like heck, but real-life, looks "ok".

[policeluger]

As nothing was wasted, this over strike looks good, and would not stop me if I was buying....

[roy]

John:
Thanks for the photo of your gun with the Danzig Police stamp, its nice to know there are others out there.
I have a question about the stamp. On June,28 1919, when Germany sign the treaty, they agreed to the "corridor" that gave Poland access to the port of Danzig and allowed them to have the 100,000 man army, was this when these guns were given to the police?

Also were there other parts of Germany where the police had guns with a starburst but a different letter [.Frankfurt would have a F under the starburst]?

I also have a holster that has " C LESCHEN & CO with 1918 stamped under it and COLN-NIPPES under the date. On the back is L Z with a Eagle under it and J. COLN under the eagle.

Would this be the holster issued with the gun when they gave them to the police?

[Edward Tinker]

unknown

It is unknown if the letters stand for a city, that is a guess by Costanzo and others...

It is also unknown when guns were turned over, there are a few instances, but most guns that were in storage were turned over as needed, and after 1929, many new guns were bought and put into service.

Ed

[jcoe]

Roy,
If you can pick up a copy of Costanzoâ??s â??World of Lugersâ?�, I am sure you would enjoy looking through the mind-boggling array of police and other stamps/marks etc that he recorded and also named. The real meaning/identification of some of these marks is an ongoing controversial topic.
John