my profile |
register |
faq |
search upload photo | donate | calendar |
|
11-12-2009, 06:12 AM | #1 |
User
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: South America
Posts: 948
Thanks: 598
Thanked 584 Times in 254 Posts
|
Vlim,
That's a very interesting story. Very pleasent to read at morning before going to work. Thanks, Douglas |
03-30-2017, 09:08 AM | #2 |
Moderator
Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Europe
Posts: 5,045
Thanks: 1,034
Thanked 3,941 Times in 1,196 Posts
|
Well, I think it's time to revive this rather old thread, with good reason:
The quality of the Luger group photo was quite bad, it was first published in the 1940s editions of 'Moderne Faustfeuerwaffen' and probably lifted from that book to be reused in Fred Datig's 'Luger' book. Just recently, I was able to lay my hands on one of the original prints of the photograph that was used in Bock's and Datig's books. Since these old negatives are very, very good and sharp, it's possible to show the entire view in much more detail. It is possible to work out that Georg Luger Jr. is holding a luger pistol equipped with a toggle lock, while Heinrich Hoffmann is holding one without a toggle lock. It is also clear that Baurat Meyer (sitting) is holding a revolver of some sort, as well as his doggy. Georg Luger Sr. is only armed with an umbrella. |
The following 5 members says Thank You to Vlim for your post: |
03-30-2017, 09:36 AM | #3 |
Super Moderator
Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North of Spokane, WA
Posts: 15,915
Thanks: 1,989
Thanked 4,506 Times in 2,080 Posts
|
what does the cardboard man look like in the photo?
|
03-30-2017, 10:06 AM | #4 |
Moderator
Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Europe
Posts: 5,045
Thanks: 1,034
Thanked 3,941 Times in 1,196 Posts
|
Flat and reasonably white
When looking at images of Mr. August Meyer, it appears that somewhere during the identification process 2 persons were swapped. The man who is holding the cigar looks like August Meyer, while the man who is sitting down and was identified as Meyer doesn't look like him. So most probably, the sitting man is Prof. Tschoepke and the man with the cigar is Baurat Meyer. |
03-30-2017, 12:34 PM | #5 |
Moderator
2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso
Posts: 6,988
Thanks: 1,067
Thanked 5,099 Times in 1,676 Posts
|
Gerben,
You started this thread with “…there is no authenticated image of Hugo Borchardt known”. That may very well still be the case. But in 2012 Mobray Publishing put out a large format (8 ½”X11”) paperback book “The Evolution of Military Automatic Pistols / Self-loading Pistol Designs of Two World Wars and the Men who Invented Them” by Gorden Bruce. There are 24 designs presented with biographical sketches of the inventors. The first article is on Hugo Borchardt and includes two photos that are identified as Hugo. I was very excited with this revelation and after a bit of digging through Mobray I was able to contact the author. He of course did not know me so he was not very forthcoming with information, but he did avow the photos were of Borchardt and that he had acquired them from an un-named source in Poland several years ago. That was the extent of the information I could obtain, so there remains a question if these photos are actually Borchardt, but they might be. Ron
__________________
If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction |
The following 8 members says Thank You to Ron Wood for your post: |
03-30-2017, 01:30 PM | #6 |
FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Belgium
Posts: 1,535
Thanks: 106
Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts
|
Dear All,
This topic already pointed out that the personal relationship between Georg Luger and Borchardt was very bad for well known reason. Also the relationship between Paul Mauser and Georg Luger was very bad. On the contrary the relationship between Paul Mauser and Borchardt was a good one. In our last book: Paul Mauser - His Life, Company, and Handgun Development 1838 - 1914 we discussed about the relationship of Paul Mauser with Luger and Borchardt based upon original documents and letters. I think it is a very good read and I am sure you will find it interesting. Additionally, you will see a handmade toggle drawing made by Hugo Borchardt and kept in the Paul Mauser Archive. Also funny, you will see in an Original Mauser sale book, the sale of a Borchardt pistol, most probably a pistol acquired by Mauser for testing purposes and then sold when not necessary anymore. Good read, Mauro
__________________
Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service. |
The following 3 members says Thank You to mauro for your post: |
03-30-2017, 07:52 PM | #7 |
Super Moderator - Patron
LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA
Posts: 3,900
Thanks: 1,372
Thanked 3,094 Times in 1,503 Posts
|
Mauro and Gerben's book includes the letter that introduced Luger to Mauser, and some hard evidence of what Mauser really thought of Luger... At the time, Mauser was paying Luger royalties on an invention originally created by Mauser... That's an interesting story...
__________________
Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war. |
The following member says Thank You to mrerick for your post: |
03-30-2017, 08:55 PM | #8 |
Lifer
Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA
Posts: 12,216
Thanks: 6,209
Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts
|
Thank You All~ and the late, Fred Datig~
|
|
|