06/73 Grip Retaining Pin ???

sheepherder · 01-08-2019, 09:29 AM

In a current WTS thread, the seller makes reference to -

"Removed the wood ones [grips], as the right grip will be further damaged by the grip-retaining pin (a known issue with these)."

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=39225

I have not seen this issue discussed here. Can anyone shed any light on this 'pin', and where it is located, and why it is an issue???

DonVoigt · 01-08-2019, 03:12 PM

Rich,
it has been in a couple or more threads, maybe on the other luger forum.
But basically, Mauser used a pin to locate the wood grips on the frame with a corresponding hole in the wood grip, it was/is not a satisfactory arrangement and leads to cracking, "wallowing" out the hole, and grips that move around.

A "short cut" that Mauser thought that they could use to reduce mfg. time for the grips, I guess; then it bit them .

sheepherder · 01-08-2019, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

But basically, Mauser used a pin to locate the wood grips on the frame with a corresponding hole in the wood grip, it was/is not a satisfactory arrangement and leads to cracking, "wallowing" out the hole, and grips that move around..

Is this in addition to the grip screw on the bottom, and tucking into the frame on the top, or does it take the place of one or the other???

Does anyone have a pic, maybe from the owners manual, of the parts schematic showing this???

(Gawd, I'm turning into Eric!)

Vlim · 01-08-2019, 03:34 PM

Ok.

The first version used 2 brass pins set into the grip edge.
Drawback was that the grips had to be thick at the edges to provide enough mass to hold the pins.

The second solution was to have a central pin in the frame which would retain the grips. Cheaper to do and allowing the grips to be contoured better.

With age, the grips dry out and develop some play around the retaining pin.

So both solutions eventually proved not to work well. At least they tried

and it was not a short cut.

sheepherder · 01-08-2019, 03:40 PM

My bad; this was discussed here several times before. Once in a post started by me. I guess I am getting old...

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=37169

I'm glad you two pointed this out. I had once again had it in mind to purchase one of these, and once again I've decided against it.

Vlim · 01-08-2019, 04:25 PM

Went though the collection to look for a version with center pin.

...I don't have one of those, only early styles...

Now I have to find one

John Sabato · 01-09-2019, 10:09 AM

If this is a recurring issue, I would offer what would be my "fix" for this problem. I would inlet and epoxy a metal disk of appropriate thickness into the interior of both grips and locate the pin hole in the metal inset. It would be invisible when installed, and much less likely to wear the hole larger than the wood grip.

Just my $0.02, spend it wisely.

sheepherder · 01-09-2019, 10:41 AM

So the backs of the Mauser Parabellum grips are flat (except for the cutouts for the safety/magazine button etc)??? No 'rails' that fit inside the rectangular frame cutouts???

I've seen pics of some members grips that had 'popsicle sticks' glued on the backside of the grips, to fit inside the frame cutout. That might be a 'fix' as well.

I checked Numrich; they show 'cartridge counter' grips for the Mauser Parabellum but not solid grips. I know they used to have the solid grips because I commented on them in another old thread.

DonVoigt · 01-09-2019, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheepherder

So the backs of the Mauser Parabellum grips are flat (except for the cutouts for the safety/magazine button etc)??? No 'rails' that fit inside the rectangular frame cutouts???

Correct Rich, they are flat.
And IMO the change was a "short cut" to make shaping the back of the grip easier than the inletting method of the old grips.

I seldom disagree with Vilm, but have no doubt that some "smart", young engineer at Mauser decided the "old" way was too labor/time intensive and thought he could save a bundle- but didn't. JMHO.

Sieger · 01-10-2019, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

Correct Rich, they are flat.
And IMO the change was a "short cut" to make shaping the back of the grip easier than the inletting method of the old grips.

I seldom disagree with Vilm, but have no doubt that some "smart", young engineer at Mauser decided the "old" way was too labor/time intensive and thought he could save a bundle- but didn't. JMHO.

Don,

Right on!!!

Sieger

01-08-2019, 09:29 AM	#1
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	06/73 Grip Retaining Pin ??? In a current WTS thread, the seller makes reference to - "Removed the wood ones [grips], as the right grip will be further damaged by the grip-retaining pin (a known issue with these)." http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=39225 I have not seen this issue discussed here. Can anyone shed any light on this 'pin', and where it is located, and why it is an issue??? __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...

01-08-2019, 03:12 PM	#2
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,677 Thanks: 1,440 Thanked 4,348 Times in 2,038 Posts	Rich, it has been in a couple or more threads, maybe on the other luger forum. But basically, Mauser used a pin to locate the wood grips on the frame with a corresponding hole in the wood grip, it was/is not a satisfactory arrangement and leads to cracking, "wallowing" out the hole, and grips that move around. A "short cut" that Mauser thought that they could use to reduce mfg. time for the grips, I guess; then it bit them . __________________ 03man(Don Voigt); Luger student and collector. Looking for DWM side plate: 69 ; Dreyse 1907 pistol K.S. Gendarmerie

01-08-2019, 03:34 PM	#4
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,041 Thanks: 1,021 Thanked 3,910 Times in 1,192 Posts	Ok. The first version used 2 brass pins set into the grip edge. Drawback was that the grips had to be thick at the edges to provide enough mass to hold the pins. The second solution was to have a central pin in the frame which would retain the grips. Cheaper to do and allowing the grips to be contoured better. With age, the grips dry out and develop some play around the retaining pin. So both solutions eventually proved not to work well. At least they tried and it was not a short cut. Attached Thumbnails Attached Images

01-08-2019, 03:40 PM	#5
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	My bad; this *was* discussed here several times before. Once in a post started by me. I guess I am getting old... http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=37169 I'm glad you two pointed this out. I had once again had it in mind to purchase one of these, and once again I've decided against it. __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...

01-09-2019, 10:09 AM	#7
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	If this is a recurring issue, I would offer what would be my "fix" for this problem. I would inlet and epoxy a metal disk of appropriate thickness into the interior of both grips and locate the pin hole in the metal inset. It would be invisible when installed, and much less likely to wear the hole larger than the wood grip. Just my $0.02, spend it wisely. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

01-08-2019, 04:25 PM	#6
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,041 Thanks: 1,021 Thanked 3,910 Times in 1,192 Posts	Went though the collection to look for a version with center pin. ...I don't have one of those, only early styles... Now I have to find one

01-09-2019, 10:41 AM	#8
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	So the backs of the Mauser Parabellum grips are flat (except for the cutouts for the safety/magazine button etc)??? No 'rails' that fit inside the rectangular frame cutouts??? I've seen pics of some members grips that had 'popsicle sticks' glued on the backside of the grips, to fit inside the frame cutout. That might be a 'fix' as well. I checked Numrich; they show 'cartridge counter' grips for the Mauser Parabellum but not solid grips. I know they used to have the solid grips because I commented on them in another old thread. __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...