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[Proofed]

Found this pistol and have never seen anything like it. I am thinking maybe a fantasy piece but would love to be wrong. Can anyone shed some light on this pistol please, Thanks

https://simpsonltd.com/mauser-luger-1939-banner/

[Vlim]

Fantasy piece.

Priced accordingly.

[joncon]

If it's a fantasy piece, shouldn't Simpson have stated that in their add?

[Vlim]

They describe what they see.

But there is no reason for Mauser to mark a pistol like this and certainly not with their company name on it. They'd be pretty sure they are Mauser and the maker if used in-house.

Prüfung Pistole is also a weird text. Again it is pretty obvious that it is a pistol. Why put it on the side?

Prüfung is a word that would not be used in the context someone is trying to percieve here.

So it looks like it was marked by someone who knew just enough German to think he could fool people.

The R&D department just marked their guns with a V number so they could be registered in their own gun registration book.

But this is a commercial gun from the known v-series block which has nothing to do with R&D.

Besides, what would it be 'Proofing'?

[Yakman]

The left side of the Luger says it is a "TEST PISTOL". On the right side there is clarification as to who is the manufacturer. The "MAUSER" on the toggle apparently was not thought to be enough.

The gun looks like it has been through the mill, so being a test piece is not a stretch to me. It is just not apparent who was doing the testing and made their notations on the pistol in German, unless it was a German entity around the time of the pistol and not something post war, which is my guess.

We all have our many opinions, so it is not surprising to me Simpson does not want to join in with conjecture. His add is of photos and a factual description of the pistol. From that, it's the lookers and buyer who can fantasize about it. Besides, the pistol is a consignment, the consignor usually sets the price. Simpson is just describing what he sees.

Jack

[Vlim]

Mauser would write 'Testpistol' as 'Versuchspistole'.

'Prüfung Pistole' is made up German by a non-German speaker.

Even if Prüfung would be the correct term, the phrase would be 'Prüfungspistole'.

I don't think the Mauser engineers were that daft.

[Yakman]

Vilm,

I concede! My German born and raised, German speaking wife agrees with you.

This alters my thoughts on possibilities. Now I'm at a total loss on this thing.

Jack

[DonVoigt]

Vilm nailed it in two words,
why would you be at a loss ?

Just someone having fun or trying to shuck some buyer!

[Yakman]

I don't know, Don, maybe because nothing factual has been offered, and as you can see from my concession, it doesn't pay to jump to conclusions.

Let's wait and see if there's anything else out there to be said. That gun is new to me, but it might not be to everyone.

Jack

[Vlim]

The Mauser company name on the right side is another good indication of fakery at work. Mauser had lots of roll dies at hand and it would have been dead easy to just roll in the company address quickly with one of them.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by Yakman

I don't know, Don, maybe because nothing factual has been offered, and as you can see from my concession, it doesn't pay to jump to conclusions.

Let's wait and see if there's anything else out there to be said. That gun is new to me, but it might not be to everyone.

Jack

Sometimes the simplest explanation is the correct one.
Even though I'm not a Mauser expert, nothing about the pistol makes sense with regard to the markings.

No mention of anything remotely similar in Mauser Parabellum.

You have two native German linguists that say the words and construction make no sense.

That sounds like facts to me.

[Yakman]

Don,

You haven't said anything I disagree with.

I hope I haven't given you, or anyone else, the idea that I think Mauser had anything to do with the inscriptions on this pistol. To be clear, I don't. I guess the issue is, I think no one here knows who or why anyone did it. You and everyone else, including me, are entitled to our opinions. Mine is, no one knows.

We might differ somewhat on what constitutes a fact, "a thing that is known or proved to be true."
I'm quoting from a dictionary definition.

Don, I'm not trying to "one up" you. I'm just trying to clarify my position since you've asked: "Vilm (sic) nailed it in two words,
why would you be at a loss ?"

Jack

[Heinz]

At least it aappears to have the original finish :-)
And it is highly unlikely that the additional markings are from the Mauser factory. They appear to be either pantographed or off a CNC machine.
So someone marked up a well worn Mauser P08 with a bad German expression. We will never know for sure why but a pretty good guess is profit. Also Simpson's has a consignment nuber on this I believe.

[Proofed]

The only other explanation I've heard is that it could have been in another manufacturers possession as an example of the competition's work for reference and operation.
It is another thing not substantiated by facts in any direction.

As far as Simpson Ltd. Goes, I have bought several pistols and accs. from them and are very happy with them and would not hesitate to do business with them in the future. They have simply presented a pistol for sale and made no claims, that couldn't be proved anyway.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by Yakman

Don,

You haven't said anything I disagree with.

I hope I haven't given you, or anyone else, the idea that I think Mauser had anything to do with the inscriptions on this pistol. To be clear, I don't. I guess the issue is, I think no one here knows who or why anyone did it. You and everyone else, including me, are entitled to our opinions. Mine is, no one knows.

We might differ somewhat on what constitutes a fact, "a thing that is known or proved to be true."
I'm quoting from a dictionary definition.

Don, I'm not trying to "one up" you. I'm just trying to clarify my position since you've asked: "Vilm (sic) nailed it in two words,
why would you be at a loss ?"

Jack

I agree with "no one knows";
I would add "for sure"- as is the case with many of the questions that arise here about specific pistols.

I was under the impression that you thought there was a chance that Mauser made the inscriptions for some unknown, and un-provable reason- so glad you cleared that up.

It really does not matter who did the marking or when; if the consensus is that it is a fake, boosted, or otherwise non-factory marking.

The most telling "evidence" of its lack of authenticity (to me, anyway)- is that Simpson did not make any claim regarding the "unusual" markings.


The facts-known to be true:
-unusual or "non" German grammar/spelling
-one cannot prove a negative, i.e. that the marking is not original

[schutzen-jager]

[ The facts-known to be true:
-unusual or "non" German grammar/spelling
-one cannot prove a negative, i.e. that the marking is not original]


fwiw - parents growing up parents said that i was of German heritage - later learned that we were Gottscheers - language + words used by them were not understood at all by many other native Germans -

[Yakman]

Don,

Well put!

Jack

[Ron Wood]

Originally Posted by schutzen-jager

...fwiw - parents growing up parents said that i was of German heritage - later learned that we were Gottscheers - language + words used by them were not understood at all by many other native Germans -

At one time while in the Army my German was not too bad as I was actually attached to a German unit. But Plattdeutch was way beyond what I could speak or understand. I once stayed at a Gasthaus where the proprietor's wife spoke only Plattdeutch and he had to translate for me what his frau was saying when we gathered in the evenings.
Ron

[Vlim]

When I talk with my father, nobody I know can follow the conversation

Old German and old Dutch share quite a few similarities, same goes for the southern dialects. I find it easier to follow Schwabian dialect than Hochdeutsch sometimes.