Help with byf 42

[Edward Tinker]

Sterling, unless it is looked at in person, it is very hard to tell on a professional reblue. i.e. if someone knows what they are doing?

Of course, it is always possible (and also convienent) to feel that the parts were stamped at the factory that way.

If it was a weimar rework police, this kind of thing did happen...

Ed

[Sterling]

Has it ever been noted for a fact that parts were ever restamped in the factory in the original manufacturing of the gun, to correct a stamping error or for whatever reason, not counting a police rework or any other kind of rework?

[G.W. Gill]

Sterling, My and other BYF 42's I have seen have a distinct line on the front and rear of the gripstraps. I think from being dip blued. I looked for this in your pictures. Maybe I missed them

[RockinWR]

Sterling & All,
* Yawl correct me if I'm wrong; but, my understanding is all Mauser dip blue finishes were applied after parts were S/N'd. Consequently no halo should appear.
* A halo occurs when a stamp is punched through the finish and the unprotected, displaced & work hardened metal (crater) ridge is exposed to wear and air. The stamps "gully" usually shows "bright" or patinad(rust) as it is unfinished also. Don't see halos around any of the other S/N's; but, being neutral & diplomatic, it could be the photos/lighting. Notice the questioned digit "2" does appear to have finish in its recessed "gully". That took some magic if it was done after the overall original finish was applied. Sure there is a halo??
* Further, the position of this toggle number is in a generally protected area from holster(whatever) wear as the toggle knobs are contacted first by any foreign opposing surface.
* Finally, and this may be my eyes helping to support this conclusion, the size of the questioned digit "2" appears correct relative to the initial digit "5"; but, the form (font) of the digit "2" appears different than other "2"'s seen elsewhere on this example. The original Mauser digit "2", as seen in the comparison sideplate cut-in picture, curves around at the top and ends in a short segent virtually vertical or, to say another way, perpendicular to the base horizontal leg of the digit. The questioned digit "2" is a continous arc with the ending segment at the top still at an angle to vertical and not perpendicular to the base horizontal leg.
* When this "corrected" digit was applied is anyones guess. I can hear the old "repair or field armourer" story spooling up next. It is hard to be absolute in pronouncing judgement when distance and pictures are the only mechanism at hand. It may well be, at best, a factory instituted correction or, apparently, an old correction anyway. As uniform as the balance of the finish on this example is, it is a shame to think a careless factory worker error, corrected and passed by the inspectors would condemn this pistol to be forever excluded from collector's consideration.
* There is however the price(value). Suffices for me to say when I'm paying retail or near retail collector's prices, I like my gun to do all the talking, have all the correct answers, and keep me from having to provide "explainations".
* The upside is the seller has been forthcoming and reputable in his dealings. Appears a good deal of honest critical questioning & learning is going on as opposed to more ominous agenda's.
* Just one humble opinion from one rambling, sleepy source. <img border="0" alt="[sleep]" title="" src="graemlins/sleep.gif" />
Respectfully,
Bob

[Frank]

Hi Sterling, it's a shame the Luger Deal didn't work out! It's a nice pistol.

I totally agree with Bob (RockinWR) on his eagle eye comments on the "2". I noticed the same fault. No matter how much the seller wants the story to be true, I would seriously doubt that it came that way from the factory. The Germans weren't that sloppy!!

I think you did the right thing; there will be another nice Luger for sale in the near future!

The only way some knowledgeable collector would buy the Luger at that price might mean he (or she) has access to a toggle part with the correct number. In other words - BOOSTED!!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" />

[Sterling]

Thanks to all you guys for your input. Bob, you're right, the 2 over the 5 is a different style of 2 than all the others...this kind of thing amazes me, the precision. Good enough to fool at least a couple of people in the past.

Meanwhile, my search continues....

[byf42]

The gun is "out of circulation" permanently. I was the seller, and unfortunately the owner. When my friend Sterling called me, he had his money back within the hour. I sure would expect the same from him or anyone else. The gun was purchased in Louisville at the JAG show in late 2002 from a dealer. I have his card, and am going to have a chat this year at the show. As a beginning collector its obvious that a lesson has been learned, however, the good thing is so have 2000+ people from this forum.
I refuse to sell as a shooter due to my fear that someday, someone just like ME will be fooled. I would not wish that on anyone. I am not very deep in the gun, and I guess the good side is what a great holster with two FXO mags. Ouch!!!!!!
I guess the only good thing is if she was reblued than someone went to a lot of trouble and time to do her. I hope they missed the metal and hit their finger with the %*#@ number punch!!!!
I am grateful to the forum for helping my friend, and me.

Mike

[Pete Ebbink]

Hello Mike,

Sterling was right in his first posting...when he called you a "good friend"...!!!

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

[Frank]

Hey Mike, It's guys like you that give Luger Collecting a GOOD name!!! I wish I knew you better, so I could also count you as a friend!!

[John Sabato]

Bravo Mike! That is one of the finest looking shooter Lugers I have ever seen. Don't hide her... keep her active... that was her intended purpose... Folks who have their own parts replaced (like our friend Jerry Burney (lugerholsterrepair) and his hip replacement) are still the same folks under their skin...

Thanks for being part of the Lugerforum and for showing YOUR metal!

[byf42]

I have always kept her put up, except for the 7 rds when she first came home, BUT NOW she is coming out in rare form. As a matter of fact heading to the range to help some friends get ready for an upcoming school, so she is sitting on the table next to a box of ammo. Always wanted to test one at 50 yards, but then again I dont know if I can throw it that far...HAHAHA Just kidding...well not really....
Mike

[Frank]

Mike, you'll be surprised on how well it will do at long range!! With a decent rest, I think I would at least scare the crap out of anyone from at least 125 yards away. At the range where I shoot, we pick out dirt clumps on the birm about 125 yards out and the little devil does a pretty good job!!

Again Good on ya!!

[cactus-one]

I knew this forum was worth joining. All of you guys are great.

[SteveM]

If Mauser wouldn't allow something like that to leave the factory, then why would they allow the die used to stamp the "42" to continually be used.(Take a real close look at the stamp, under the 2). Apparently, my BYF42 was stamped with the same die. Serial number in the "i" block.

[John Sabato]

If you are talking about the surface blemish that I drew the red line around in this photograph...



Then the answer to your question is that this mark (which I presume was made, not by the number die, but by a receiver jig or wrench for installation of the barrel), fell within acceptable tolerances for finish surface blemishes and did not affect proofing, functioning, or readability of the marks placed on the gun intentionally.

Remember that 42 was the very near end of full time production and the urgency of wartime needs let thing like that blemish through that would never have been acceptable on a commercial weapon. If there is one thing that governments are headstrong about, it is accountability of weapons and their production. The mark you point out was probably the result of wear of the receiver holding jig and would have been a very costly thing to replace versus the replacement of a single number die, or a single toggle piece that was unacceptable...

I hope this explanation was helpful. It was not based on any published references, but on 40 years of examining Lugers, ...on my experiences as a gunsmith (many years ago!) and also more recent manufacturing experiences in industrial environments.

[byf42]

I have another 42 with the exact same mark. Same block as the black widow that was sold to sterling.

[byf42]

I will have the byf42 BW at the gun show in Louisville Sat. Morn. I have some people scheduled to take a look at her. Not to sell, just to see it for themselves in person. If anyone is interested I am not hard to miss. The goofy guy with no hair, with the hot pregnant blonde..........

Mike

[SteveM]

John,
I don't doubt a word you're saying but on my Pistol it doesn't look like a blemish; it looks more like a strike of some kind. Nothing like a surface mar..