Using a P1 Sight as a Higher Luger Sight

Sharpsdressed Man · 02-01-2019, 07:15 PM

I had a problem with the point of impact on my 1940 "42" Mauser Luger. I was getting impacts 8-10" high at 25 yards and it was driving me nuts. Seeking any original or aftermarket high front sights to correct the problem seemed impossible. I happened to have an older P1 sight, which has no white dot and is a little narrower than the later P1 sights, and has a similar, although wider, dovetail base. Careful filing reduced the P1 dovetail to that of the Luger, and the resulting height is an almost perfect correction for my POI problem. I believe that anyone with a similar problem might find this as a nice fix, with no alteration to the gun. It puts a square sight post in view of the rear "v", but it is useable. I even tried to file a square notch into the rear, but it is apparently hardened so much that it was dulling my file, so I left it alone.

ithacaartist · 02-02-2019, 02:54 AM

Yep, your notch will need to be ground. Contemplating the possible setup provokes visions of "Rube Goldbergs" to dance in my head, but your shop is much better-equipped.

Olle · 02-02-2019, 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharpsdressed Man

II even tried to file a square notch into the rear, but it is apparently hardened so much that it was dulling my file, so I left it alone.

Whooa..

Sieger · 02-02-2019, 09:28 AM

Sharps,

GT has your issue covered with his taller front Luger sight.

You may wish to contact him on this site.

Luger Doc also carries them, I believe.

Please do not modify your rear sight in any way, as this would lessen any collector's value your pistol may have.

Sieger

DonVoigt · 02-02-2019, 09:40 AM

As Seiger said,
your problem has been addressed!
Lugerdoc, who you can PM on this board, has the sights in several heights for sale.
These are GT's sights, sales by Lugerdoc.

Measure the exact height of the sight above the sight base flat and buy one close.
I believe the sights are available from .225 to .300" in 0.025" steps

Sharpsdressed Man · 02-02-2019, 09:49 PM

To clarify, my 1940 is a shooter: mostly brown at this point, little original finish but an excellent bore. Honestly battle worn, not neglected and otherwise well maintained, but not at the top of collectibles. I feel the Luger suffers from mediocre sights, and often, difficult (heavy, creepy) trigger pulls. Mine has a great trigger, but at 66, my eyes need slightly better sights. I did not have to modify the front sight dovetail slot, only reduce the P1 dovetail to fit the Luger. The old sight can easily be re-installed. As noted, the rear "V" sight is also intact, as it was so hard, it was removing metal from my file. I know most of you would NEVER modify a Luger, but I acquired a much nicer condition 1937 S/42 (worse trigger, though), so having a shooter to really SHOOT is something I'd rather do with the lesser gun. I can barely index the rear V with the now-square front sight, but I will make do. Shooting after installing the P1 sight put my POI about 2" high at 25 yards instead of 10-12". MUCH better! GT are your front sights square, or inverted "V"? I really think nice square sights make precision shooting a little faster and precise, although are not keeping with the "vintage" and historical points that collectors demand. I do have a spare toggle that could be machined to provide the square rear sight without modifying the original, matching toggle.

Sharpsdressed Man · 02-02-2019, 09:53 PM

PS: Thanks to all for your comments. I cannot believe this 1940 Luger was so far off POI with the original sights, as the S/37 is almost right on. PPS: A very nice Luger front sight tool is being marketed on Ebay from Poland for $100. I thought that it was a bargain, especially if you have more than one Luger to adjust.

DonVoigt · 02-02-2019, 09:58 PM

GT's sights are the same profile as the original.

Your gun, modify as much as you want!

I know about seeing those sights, ain't easy. I have a couple shooters with entirely different sights and sight pictures. Helps some but nothing will give back my vision of 50 years ago.

G.T. · 02-02-2019, 09:59 PM

HI Sharp dressed! My replacement sights are as Don described them, and made as close as possible to a P.08 profile, regardless of height. The tops though, are square, or better term, flat, not rounded like the originals.. My sights are more for target then for combat?... All sizes available thru Lugerdoc… Good luck, let us know how you turn out... best to all, til….lat'r…...GT

Rick W. · 02-02-2019, 10:09 PM

SDM,

One would suspect that Luger shooter guys have been using Mauser front sights for generations. They fit the dovetail, and the squarish profile is touched by the user for their specific needs.

Lugers can be mavericks as to POI. I have a nice 30 that is a high shooter, but a beater VOPO, shoots right to the point of aim. Of course, sight picture, and ammo comes into play as you well know.

Lots of folks, well a few maybe, used to remove the front sight and install a Marbles #27 gold bead front sight, then use a round file to convert the v notch on the toggle to a "u". I suspect the Marbles #27 is long gone with the Schwinn, but examples show up on ebay etc. Just something to ponder, and see if it works out etc........

G.T. has several front sights available for Luger guys. As I recall........and talk with him if so interested, my memory is shot; about heights and the profile. G.T. is the man for sights. New manufacture to old specs with some of his engineering prowess thrown in.

Yeah, tis a pleasure to have a Luger that shoots right to the point of aim.............tis fun stuff huh?..........

One can venture into adjustable rear sights on the luger toggle, but is a tough environment. A few here have mounted optics to Lugers over the years. I think Lonnie Z. had the best overall optics package, a small red dot on an arty barrel that would stand the racket..

One can consider carbide or diamond tooling to change the rear notch if needbe.

Rick

Sharpsdressed Man · 02-04-2019, 09:18 PM

The Luger will never die. I think I saw one as a base for a weapon in Rogue One (Star Wars). They modified them, long, long ago, in galaxies far, far away........

02-01-2019, 07:15 PM	#1
Sharpsdressed Man User Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 34 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 7 Posts	Using a P1 Sight as a Higher Luger Sight I had a problem with the point of impact on my 1940 "42" Mauser Luger. I was getting impacts 8-10" high at 25 yards and it was driving me nuts. Seeking any original or aftermarket high front sights to correct the problem seemed impossible. I happened to have an older P1 sight, which has no white dot and is a little narrower than the later P1 sights, and has a similar, although wider, dovetail base. Careful filing reduced the P1 dovetail to that of the Luger, and the resulting height is an almost perfect correction for my POI problem. I believe that anyone with a similar problem might find this as a nice fix, with no alteration to the gun. It puts a square sight post in view of the rear "v", but it is useable. I even tried to file a square notch into the rear, but it is apparently hardened so much that it was dulling my file, so I left it alone.

02-02-2019, 09:40 AM	#5
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,681 Thanks: 1,441 Thanked 4,350 Times in 2,040 Posts	As Seiger said, your problem has been addressed! Lugerdoc, who you can PM on this board, has the sights in several heights for sale. These are GT's sights, sales by Lugerdoc. Measure the exact height of the sight above the sight base flat and buy one close. I believe the sights are available from .225 to .300" in 0.025" steps __________________ 03man(Don Voigt); Luger student and collector. Looking for DWM side plate: 69 ; Dreyse 1907 pistol K.S. Gendarmerie

02-02-2019, 09:58 PM	#8
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,681 Thanks: 1,441 Thanked 4,350 Times in 2,040 Posts	GT's sights are the same profile as the original. Your gun, modify as much as you want! I know about seeing those sights, ain't easy. I have a couple shooters with entirely different sights and sight pictures. Helps some but nothing will give back my vision of 50 years ago. Attached Thumbnails Attached Images __________________ 03man(Don Voigt); Luger student and collector. Looking for DWM side plate: 69 ; Dreyse 1907 pistol K.S. Gendarmerie

02-02-2019, 09:59 PM	#9
G.T. Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chandler Arizona Posts: 3,507 Thanks: 1,318 Thanked 3,653 Times in 1,004 Posts	GT replacement sights HI Sharp dressed! My replacement sights are as Don described them, and made as close as possible to a P.08 profile, regardless of height. The tops though, are square, or better term, flat, not rounded like the originals.. My sights are more for target then for combat?... All sizes available thru Lugerdoc… Good luck, let us know how you turn out... best to all, til….lat'r…...GT

02-02-2019, 10:09 PM	#10
Rick W. User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 339 Thanks: 81 Thanked 359 Times in 198 Posts	SDM, One would suspect that Luger shooter guys have been using Mauser front sights for generations. They fit the dovetail, and the squarish profile is touched by the user for their specific needs. Lugers can be mavericks as to POI. I have a nice 30 that is a high shooter, but a beater VOPO, shoots right to the point of aim. Of course, sight picture, and ammo comes into play as you well know. Lots of folks, well a few maybe, used to remove the front sight and install a Marbles #27 gold bead front sight, then use a round file to convert the v notch on the toggle to a "u". I suspect the Marbles #27 is long gone with the Schwinn, but examples show up on ebay etc. Just something to ponder, and see if it works out etc........ G.T. has several front sights available for Luger guys. As I recall........and talk with him if so interested, my memory is shot; about heights and the profile. G.T. is the man for sights. New manufacture to old specs with some of his engineering prowess thrown in. Yeah, tis a pleasure to have a Luger that shoots right to the point of aim.............tis fun stuff huh?.......... One can venture into adjustable rear sights on the luger toggle, but is a tough environment. A few here have mounted optics to Lugers over the years. I think Lonnie Z. had the best overall optics package, a small red dot on an arty barrel that would stand the racket.. One can consider carbide or diamond tooling to change the rear notch if needbe. Rick Last edited by Rick W.; 02-03-2019 at 09:11 AM.

02-02-2019, 02:54 AM	#2
ithacaartist Twice a Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY Posts: 3,347 Thanks: 7,285 Thanked 2,578 Times in 1,365 Posts	Yep, your notch will need to be ground. Contemplating the possible setup provokes visions of "Rube Goldbergs" to dance in my head, but your shop is much better-equipped. __________________ "... Liberty is the seed and soil, the air and light, the dew and rain of progress, love and joy."-- Robert Greene Ingersoll 1894

02-02-2019, 09:28 AM	#4
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,575 Thanks: 2,124 Thanked 400 Times in 249 Posts	Sharps, GT has your issue covered with his taller front Luger sight. You may wish to contact him on this site. Luger Doc also carries them, I believe. Please do not modify your rear sight in any way, as this would lessen any collector's value your pistol may have. Sieger

02-02-2019, 09:49 PM	#6
Sharpsdressed Man User Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 34 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 7 Posts	To clarify, my 1940 is a shooter: mostly brown at this point, little original finish but an excellent bore. Honestly battle worn, not neglected and otherwise well maintained, but not at the top of collectibles. I feel the Luger suffers from mediocre sights, and often, difficult (heavy, creepy) trigger pulls. Mine has a great trigger, but at 66, my eyes need slightly better sights. I did not have to modify the front sight dovetail slot, only reduce the P1 dovetail to fit the Luger. The old sight can easily be re-installed. As noted, the rear "V" sight is also intact, as it was so hard, it was removing metal from my file. I know most of you would NEVER modify a Luger, but I acquired a much nicer condition 1937 S/42 (worse trigger, though), so having a shooter to really SHOOT is something I'd rather do with the lesser gun. I can barely index the rear V with the now-square front sight, but I will make do. Shooting after installing the P1 sight put my POI about 2" high at 25 yards instead of 10-12". MUCH better! GT are your front sights square, or inverted "V"? I really think nice square sights make precision shooting a little faster and precise, although are not keeping with the "vintage" and historical points that collectors demand. I do have a spare toggle that could be machined to provide the square rear sight without modifying the original, matching toggle.

02-02-2019, 09:53 PM	#7
Sharpsdressed Man User Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 34 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 7 Posts	PS: Thanks to all for your comments. I cannot believe this 1940 Luger was so far off POI with the original sights, as the S/37 is almost right on. PPS: A very nice Luger front sight tool is being marketed on Ebay from Poland for $100. I thought that it was a bargain, especially if you have more than one Luger to adjust.

02-04-2019, 09:18 PM	#11
Sharpsdressed Man User Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 34 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 7 Posts	The Luger will never die. I think I saw one as a base for a weapon in Rogue One (Star Wars). They modified them, long, long ago, in galaxies far, far away........