Hermann Goering's Luger??? - Page 2

Johnny C. Kitchens · 06-10-2004, 09:45 PM

I'm not sure what you mean by "but could you explain what you mean", but the gold Luger is suppose to be the famous Hermann Goering Luger...

Ron Wood · 06-10-2004, 10:49 PM

The pictures are of a "replica" of the Herman Goering Luger, that is why you can see it field stripped. Take a look at the engraving and the lettering. They have a "soft" look that is a result of casting. Also if you look at the grip frame, you can see at least three mold sprue marks. Examples of this excellent Japanese repligun have shown up on eBay and other auctions. It is a beautiful display piece, but not the original.

policeluger · 06-10-2004, 11:30 PM

Goering surrendered with a S&W revolver...well documented and filmed.

Dwight Gruber · 06-11-2004, 01:08 AM

There are several examples--color photos--of several similarly decorated presentation Krieghoffs on pp 200-213 of Gibson's "Krieghoff Parabellum". One of them is documented as the GÃ?Â¶ring Luger.

--Dwight

Johnny C. Kitchens · 06-11-2004, 02:30 AM

Thanks Ron!!!

Gotta learn what to look for. Certainly a realistic looking imatation Luger. Looks like you could load it up and shoot it...

Vlim · 06-11-2004, 02:49 PM

Hi,

There is a decent chance that the engraving on the navy is German in origin, but I'd expect it to be some GI's idea of a joke, engraved by a liberated engraver in search for some hard cash.

It having been property of Hermann is just as likely as his Vermeer being genuine...

A similar looking engraved Navy as discussed on Jan's website:

http://www.gunboards.com/luger/uploa...uger1916_3.JPG

Navy · 06-11-2004, 06:29 PM

Gents,

My father-in-law was in the American Constabulary that was a part of the occupation force. He has told me many times of master gunsmithing and engraving done to order for GIs and paid for with a pack or two of ciggies. This would have been about a 3 pack deal circa 1946-47 according to him. The GI would have to furnish the gold for inlay as well as the weapon as all weapons were verboten in the hands of German civilians.

Its *TOUGH* when you lose a big war.

Tom A.

Waschbaer · 06-17-2004, 01:16 AM

Arguably, the workmanship is very good. That said, the scrollwork is distincly Mexican, as are the high relief ivory (?) grips+magazine base. I have to agree with John in saying "What a shame" I for one would have loved to have a navy shooter, even a built up one. If the engraving was Imperial inspired, and I had money to throw away, I might even be mildly interested, but the NSDAP stuff makes my stomach turn. If this "thing" is supposed to have belonged to Goering, it would be the fourth one I've heard of. The man threw away a lot of money, but doubtfully on pistols, and USUALLY in good taste. If it was indeed one of his pistols, then it was a gift, and promptly given away to some adjutant, I cannot picture him keeping such.

Malcolm P. · 10-24-2004, 04:31 PM

I know this is an old thread, but could not resist throwing in my two cents.

I think it is pretty well documented that Goering received a lot of gifts from those seeking some favor from him. He was well known to like guns and as pointed out had some liking for gaudy. Personally, I think it is about an even chance that this is some gun someone presented to Goering as a gift or some GI looking to impress the folks at home upon his return with a "Goering" Luger. It may have even been given to some GI by someone looking for a big favor. But it did take some work by someone skilled to do the engraving. All that said, I don't think Goering would kept an engraved Navy with the cinorrect barrel length and anyone giving him one would have made damn sure the barrel was correct. Otherwise, the whole point and effort in impressing and ingrating would have been for naught. In my humble opinion, this a GI bragging bring back.

unspellable · 10-25-2004, 11:12 AM

It's obviously not Goering's since I have Goering's Luger at home in my desk drawer. (It's nickle plated.) That said, I wonder what the piece shown at the top would be worth on the open market. (For sake of argument assume the internals are in good shape.)

Danny R. Bowles · 10-25-2004, 05:05 PM

You know it really does not look that bad.If only the person who did it did not put that swastika on the front sight. Danny

mm · 10-26-2004, 02:08 AM

Can we create a new category for this site - PIMP MY LUGER!

MM

gunsndogs · 10-30-2004, 03:44 PM

Why don't they try to e-mail Ralph Shattuck?

Ralph@WorldOfLugers.com

http://www.worldoflugers.com/index.htm

Ralph E. Shattuck - WORLD OF LUGERS
19044 N. 98th Lane Peoria, AZ 85382
Phone: 623/566-0551 Fax: 623/566-1683
E-MAIL: Ralph@WorldOfLugers.com

Edward Tinker · 10-30-2004, 08:12 PM

Bernie, contact Ralph for what?

Did I miss something? These don't have anything to do with Ralph???

Ed

06-10-2004, 09:45 PM	#21
Johnny C. Kitchens User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Arlington, Texas Posts: 518 Thanks: 0 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	I'm not sure what you mean by "but could you explain what you mean", but the gold Luger is suppose to be the famous Hermann Goering Luger... __________________ Johnny C. Kitchens

06-10-2004, 10:49 PM	#22
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,035 Thanks: 1,106 Thanked 5,242 Times in 1,719 Posts	The pictures are of a "replica" of the Herman Goering Luger, that is why you can see it field stripped. Take a look at the engraving and the lettering. They have a "soft" look that is a result of casting. Also if you look at the grip frame, you can see at least three mold sprue marks. Examples of this excellent Japanese repligun have shown up on eBay and other auctions. It is a beautiful display piece, but not the original. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-11-2004, 02:30 AM	#25
Johnny C. Kitchens User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Arlington, Texas Posts: 518 Thanks: 0 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	Thanks Ron!!! Gotta learn what to look for. Certainly a realistic looking imatation Luger. Looks like you could load it up and shoot it... __________________ Johnny C. Kitchens

10-25-2004, 05:05 PM	#31
Danny R. Bowles User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Southern West Va Posts: 21 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	You know it really does not look that bad.If only the person who did it did not put that swastika on the front sight. Danny __________________ drb

10-26-2004, 02:08 AM	#32
mm User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SFBAY Posts: 82 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Can we create a new category for this site - PIMP MY LUGER! MM __________________ mjm

06-10-2004, 11:30 PM	#23
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	Goering surrendered with a S&W revolver...well documented and filmed.

06-11-2004, 01:08 AM	#24
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,908 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,330 Times in 435 Posts	There are several examples--color photos--of several similarly decorated presentation Krieghoffs on pp 200-213 of Gibson's "Krieghoff Parabellum". One of them is documented as the GÃ?Â¶ring Luger. --Dwight

06-11-2004, 02:49 PM	#26
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Hi, There is a decent chance that the engraving on the navy is German in origin, but I'd expect it to be some GI's idea of a joke, engraved by a liberated engraver in search for some hard cash. It having been property of Hermann is just as likely as his Vermeer being genuine... A similar looking engraved Navy as discussed on Jan's website: http://www.gunboards.com/luger/uploa...uger1916_3.JPG

06-11-2004, 06:29 PM	#27
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Gents, My father-in-law was in the American Constabulary that was a part of the occupation force. He has told me many times of master gunsmithing and engraving done to order for GIs and paid for with a pack or two of ciggies. This would have been about a 3 pack deal circa 1946-47 according to him. The GI would have to furnish the gold for inlay as well as the weapon as all weapons were verboten in the hands of German civilians. Its TOUGH when you lose a big war. Tom A.

06-17-2004, 01:16 AM	#28
Waschbaer User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Arguably, the workmanship is very good. That said, the scrollwork is distincly Mexican, as are the high relief ivory (?) grips+magazine base. I have to agree with John in saying "What a shame" I for one would have loved to have a navy shooter, even a built up one. If the engraving was Imperial inspired, and I had money to throw away, I might even be mildly interested, but the NSDAP stuff makes my stomach turn. If this "thing" is supposed to have belonged to Goering, it would be the fourth one I've heard of. The man threw away a lot of money, but doubtfully on pistols, and USUALLY in good taste. If it was indeed one of his pistols, then it was a gift, and promptly given away to some adjutant, I cannot picture him keeping such.

10-24-2004, 04:31 PM	#29
Malcolm P. User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 57 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I know this is an old thread, but could not resist throwing in my two cents. I think it is pretty well documented that Goering received a lot of gifts from those seeking some favor from him. He was well known to like guns and as pointed out had some liking for gaudy. Personally, I think it is about an even chance that this is some gun someone presented to Goering as a gift or some GI looking to impress the folks at home upon his return with a "Goering" Luger. It may have even been given to some GI by someone looking for a big favor. But it did take some work by someone skilled to do the engraving. All that said, I don't think Goering would kept an engraved Navy with the cinorrect barrel length and anyone giving him one would have made damn sure the barrel was correct. Otherwise, the whole point and effort in impressing and ingrating would have been for naught. In my humble opinion, this a GI bragging bring back.

10-25-2004, 11:12 AM	#30
unspellable User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 768 Thanks: 0 Thanked 19 Times in 11 Posts	It's obviously not Goering's since I have Goering's Luger at home in my desk drawer. (It's nickle plated.) That said, I wonder what the piece shown at the top would be worth on the open market. (For sake of argument assume the internals are in good shape.)

10-30-2004, 03:44 PM	#33
gunsndogs User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Why don't they try to e-mail Ralph Shattuck? Ralph@WorldOfLugers.com http://www.worldoflugers.com/index.htm Ralph E. Shattuck - WORLD OF LUGERS 19044 N. 98th Lane Peoria, AZ 85382 Phone: 623/566-0551 Fax: 623/566-1683 E-MAIL: Ralph@WorldOfLugers.com

10-30-2004, 08:12 PM	#34
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,962 Thanks: 2,063 Thanked 4,592 Times in 2,114 Posts	Bernie, contact Ralph for what? Did I miss something? These don't have anything to do with Ralph??? Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV