A Vickers, and a question of propriety

Vlim · 04-08-2003, 12:15 PM

Hi,

The KNIL was not very well funded (to say the least) and most lugers actually weren't used for shooting that much, because the 9mm was on ration

After the Dutch got run over in Indonesia by the japanese in 1942, the Japanese must also have gained control over the arsenals (and probably ransacked a few for 'souvenirs'). In 1944 the British occupied most of the Indonesian islands and only reallowed the Dutch back in in late 1944. The KNIL found itself understaffed, underequipped and virtually not funded and scavenged everything they could find to rearm a number of newly formed divisions.

My theory is that because of scarce 9mm ammo, the lugers were issued to staff, medics and officers (because they wouldn't do much shooting anyway) and the more useful (US/anglo) guns for which there was a decent supply of ammo went to the people who actually had to do some shooting. This would explain why so many dutch lugers that are found nowadays seem to be a jumble of parts (whereby all the parts are actually 'dutch' by nature).

The fact that these guns survived is easily explained by the fact that the KNIL was officially dissolved in 1950 and that surviving weapons were sold off during the following years, since the regular Dutch army had adopted different weapons and most surviving guns were write-offs anyway.

My opinion is that the luger is better of with the DWM toggle, which at least makes it 'time original' (it's latest use being in the 1945 - 1950 timeframe).

My own M1911 consists of parts from gun# 2850 (frame + grips), gun# 11910 (barrel/receiver) and a gun which ended with 11 (the entire toggle bit). Add to that a 55-numbered toggle pin and an unnumbered 'browned' sideplate.

04-08-2003, 12:15 PM	#3
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Hi, The KNIL was not very well funded (to say the least) and most lugers actually weren't used for shooting that much, because the 9mm was on ration After the Dutch got run over in Indonesia by the japanese in 1942, the Japanese must also have gained control over the arsenals (and probably ransacked a few for 'souvenirs'). In 1944 the British occupied most of the Indonesian islands and only reallowed the Dutch back in in late 1944. The KNIL found itself understaffed, underequipped and virtually not funded and scavenged everything they could find to rearm a number of newly formed divisions. My theory is that because of scarce 9mm ammo, the lugers were issued to staff, medics and officers (because they wouldn't do much shooting anyway) and the more useful (US/anglo) guns for which there was a decent supply of ammo went to the people who actually had to do some shooting. This would explain why so many dutch lugers that are found nowadays seem to be a jumble of parts (whereby all the parts are actually 'dutch' by nature). The fact that these guns survived is easily explained by the fact that the KNIL was officially dissolved in 1950 and that surviving weapons were sold off during the following years, since the regular Dutch army had adopted different weapons and most surviving guns were write-offs anyway. My opinion is that the luger is better of with the DWM toggle, which at least makes it 'time original' (it's latest use being in the 1945 - 1950 timeframe). My own M1911 consists of parts from gun# 2850 (frame + grips), gun# 11910 (barrel/receiver) and a gun which ended with 11 (the entire toggle bit). Add to that a 55-numbered toggle pin and an unnumbered 'browned' sideplate.