Help with identifying a luger.

JArmour · 08-13-2009, 12:22 AM

This was my father in-laws and he left it with my wife and I. The story we heard is that his father found it on a soldier in WWI. Not sure if it's the actual story but that's the one we've been told.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1726.JPG
Views: 37
Size: 161.5 KB
ID: 7694

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1727.JPG
Views: 30
Size: 102.2 KB
ID: 7695

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1728.JPG
Views: 34
Size: 91.8 KB
ID: 7696

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1729.JPG
Views: 31
Size: 135.0 KB
ID: 7697

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1731.JPG
Views: 34
Size: 60.2 KB
ID: 7698

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1733.JPG
Views: 39
Size: 92.0 KB
ID: 7699

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1735.JPG
Views: 40
Size: 65.6 KB
ID: 7700

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1737.JPG
Views: 38
Size: 166.9 KB
ID: 7701

Click image for larger version

Name: IMG_1738.JPG
Views: 27
Size: 78.4 KB
ID: 7702

Edward Tinker · 08-13-2009, 01:05 AM

Welcome to the forum. Whats the serial number?

Its a commericial version of a luger, but looks like it has a weimar (possibly) unit marking?

The holster is from 1941, so it couldn''t have come home in WW1

Ed

Ron Wood · 08-13-2009, 01:31 AM

Nice looking gun! Just shooting from the hip here, but my first impression is that is is a railroad security weapon out of Magdeberg.

Ron Smith · 08-13-2009, 08:28 AM

Ron is correct, Reichsbahn Direktorat Magdeberg weapon #87. The Railway Security Police were formed just after WWI.

It is a commercial Luger, probably produced in the 20s. The holster is dated 1941, so it was possibly captured during WWII, it didn't exist during WWI.

JArmour · 08-13-2009, 10:56 AM

Thanks for the replies, I actually meant to add another "I" after the WW as the dates clearly don't match but it was pretty late when I posted. It's been just sitting in a closet for a while and to my knowledge hasn't been shot in quite some time. I have a few hand guns but we certainly aren't collectors. Any idea on value?

Serial number if I am correct is 7709, it's on the barrel and just above the trigger guard. There is also a lower case cursive "n" on both and a upper case "N" with what looks like a crown above it. The upper case N is on the barrel and in the second picture I posted.

On the holster is a faint stamp of what looks like a bird with wings out to the side sitting on top of a picture of the earth maybe? The combination of letters and number underneith of it are W can't make out the second one then A413.

Thanks in advance!

Ron Smith · 08-13-2009, 11:46 AM

Is it a 9MM or 7.65MM (Will a number 2 pencil fit in the barrel)?

It's what is known as an Alphabet Commercial produced in the early to mid 20s for commercial sale, but procured by the Railroad Police. These RBD marked pistols aren't real common, but do pop up from time to time. The last one I saw had a matching marked holster and sold for around $1800.

The market is dragging due to the economy. I would put an "insurance replacement" value with the holster, at around $2000. Actual sale value would be lower. The holster alone would be worth $250+, if it didn't have the holes in the lid. As is, around $125.

The holster has a "Waffenamt"(inspector's acceptance mark) WaA413 and was made in 1941.

alanint · 08-13-2009, 12:43 PM

The holes in the lid apparently once carried decorative pins, most likely Nazi and placed there by the GI who liberated the pistol

JArmour · 08-13-2009, 01:47 PM

Thanks again! It's 9mm.

This has been very cool learning about this weapon. Nice to be able to find this much information from a few pictures.

Don M · 08-13-2009, 08:25 PM

It's odd that it is 9mm. Other Lugers from this Direktion are .30 cal.

JArmour · 08-23-2009, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don M

It's odd that it is 9mm. Other Lugers from this Direktion are .30 cal.

You are correct it is .30 cal. My mistake.

Aaron · 08-23-2009, 10:02 PM

I don't see a stock lug. 1908 commercial?

Lyn Islaub · 08-23-2009, 10:16 PM

Time for new glasses Aaron, as even my tired eyes can see the stock lug. Haven't seen you in a few months, when are you coming through Phoenix again??
Lyn

Don M · 08-24-2009, 10:26 AM

JArmour, thanks for clearing up the caliber issue. It was bugging me!

Aaron · 08-24-2009, 10:44 AM

Lyn, thanks for reminding me of my advancing age. I am almost as old as Orv Reichert and am gaining on him rapidly. May be at the September Crossroads show in Phoenix, but will definitely be at the December SAR show. Look forward to seeing you.

Aaron

JArmour · 08-24-2009, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don M

JArmour, thanks for clearing up the caliber issue. It was bugging me!

No problem! I was on vacation and just got back last night.

JArmour · 08-24-2009, 12:50 PM

So my wife and I have decided to sell the Luger. Being that it was handed down from her grandfather to her father and now her, how would we go about this?

I'm pretty sure UPS ships handguns next day air and I know it has to be sent to someone with an FFL. I just don't want to do anything wrong and end up in legal troubles.

Thanks again!

Edward Tinker · 08-24-2009, 02:16 PM

emailed and/or pm'd you

08-13-2009, 12:22 AM	#1
JArmour User Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Help with identifying a luger. This was my father in-laws and he left it with my wife and I. The story we heard is that his father found it on a soldier in WWI. Not sure if it's the actual story but that's the one we've been told. Any help is appreciated. Thanks!

08-13-2009, 01:05 AM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,962 Thanks: 2,063 Thanked 4,592 Times in 2,114 Posts	Welcome to the forum. Whats the serial number? Its a commericial version of a luger, but looks like it has a weimar (possibly) unit marking? The holster is from 1941, so it couldn''t have come home in WW1 Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-13-2009, 01:31 AM	#3
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,035 Thanks: 1,106 Thanked 5,242 Times in 1,719 Posts	Nice looking gun! Just shooting from the hip here, but my first impression is that is is a railroad security weapon out of Magdeberg. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

08-13-2009, 08:28 AM	#4
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Ron is correct, Reichsbahn Direktorat Magdeberg weapon #87. The Railway Security Police were formed just after WWI. It is a commercial Luger, probably produced in the 20s. The holster is dated 1941, so it was possibly captured during WWII, it didn't exist during WWI. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

08-13-2009, 11:46 AM	#6
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Is it a 9MM or 7.65MM (Will a number 2 pencil fit in the barrel)? It's what is known as an Alphabet Commercial produced in the early to mid 20s for commercial sale, but procured by the Railroad Police. These RBD marked pistols aren't real common, but do pop up from time to time. The last one I saw had a matching marked holster and sold for around $1800. The market is dragging due to the economy. I would put an "insurance replacement" value with the holster, at around $2000. Actual sale value would be lower. The holster alone would be worth $250+, if it didn't have the holes in the lid. As is, around $125. The holster has a "Waffenamt"(inspector's acceptance mark) WaA413 and was made in 1941. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

08-13-2009, 10:56 AM	#5
JArmour User Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for the replies, I actually meant to add another "I" after the WW as the dates clearly don't match but it was pretty late when I posted. It's been just sitting in a closet for a while and to my knowledge hasn't been shot in quite some time. I have a few hand guns but we certainly aren't collectors. Any idea on value? Serial number if I am correct is 7709, it's on the barrel and just above the trigger guard. There is also a lower case cursive "n" on both and a upper case "N" with what looks like a crown above it. The upper case N is on the barrel and in the second picture I posted. On the holster is a faint stamp of what looks like a bird with wings out to the side sitting on top of a picture of the earth maybe? The combination of letters and number underneith of it are W can't make out the second one then A413. Thanks in advance!

08-13-2009, 12:43 PM	#7
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,917 Times in 1,193 Posts	The holes in the lid apparently once carried decorative pins, most likely Nazi and placed there by the GI who liberated the pistol

08-13-2009, 01:47 PM	#8
JArmour User Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks again! It's 9mm. This has been very cool learning about this weapon. Nice to be able to find this much information from a few pictures.

08-13-2009, 08:25 PM	#9
Don M Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 1,429 Thanks: 67 Thanked 292 Times in 191 Posts	It's odd that it is 9mm. Other Lugers from this Direktion are .30 cal. __________________ Regards, Don donmaus1@aol.com Author of History Writ in Steel: German Police Markings 1900-1936 http://www.historywritinsteel.com

08-23-2009, 10:02 PM	#11
Aaron Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 1,008 Thanks: 0 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts	I don't see a stock lug. 1908 commercial?

08-23-2009, 10:16 PM	#12
Lyn Islaub Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 435 Thanks: 3 Thanked 152 Times in 72 Posts	Time for new glasses Aaron, as even my tired eyes can see the stock lug. Haven't seen you in a few months, when are you coming through Phoenix again?? Lyn

08-24-2009, 10:26 AM	#13
Don M Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 1,429 Thanks: 67 Thanked 292 Times in 191 Posts	JArmour, thanks for clearing up the caliber issue. It was bugging me! __________________ Regards, Don donmaus1@aol.com Author of History Writ in Steel: German Police Markings 1900-1936 http://www.historywritinsteel.com

08-24-2009, 10:44 AM	#14
Aaron Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 1,008 Thanks: 0 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts	Lyn, thanks for reminding me of my advancing age. I am almost as old as Orv Reichert and am gaining on him rapidly. May be at the September Crossroads show in Phoenix, but will definitely be at the December SAR show. Look forward to seeing you. Aaron

08-24-2009, 12:50 PM	#16
JArmour User Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	So my wife and I have decided to sell the Luger. Being that it was handed down from her grandfather to her father and now her, how would we go about this? I'm pretty sure UPS ships handguns next day air and I know it has to be sent to someone with an FFL. I just don't want to do anything wrong and end up in legal troubles. Thanks again!

08-24-2009, 02:16 PM	#17
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,962 Thanks: 2,063 Thanked 4,592 Times in 2,114 Posts	emailed and/or pm'd you