Question about Pitting

11-25-2006, 03:22 PM

Hello Guys,

Can someone tell me how a gunsmith can remove light or heavy pits from a pistol? I wonder if there is a "filler" that they use to fill in the pits, and if so where can I obtain this filler. Would it something like "liquid steel" or a product like that? Maybe Thor should answer this question since he has done magic with old pitted Lugers and made them lik new.

Thanks. Bob

Ron Smith · 11-25-2006, 03:38 PM

Bob,

The only cure for pitting is to have it draw filed out or filled by someone very competent with a TIG welder and resurfaced or draw filed back to the original conture. It takes a very fine hand to do it correctly.

Ron

Crotalus · 01-08-2007, 10:47 AM

Hi Ron,
A good friend of mine is a welder and is actually keeping a TIG welder in my workroom. He says he's quite experienced using it, and seing his work I believe he knows what he's doing. He has never used it for pitting so I'm not sure exactly what you have to do for that (although he might anyway). Regardless I am about to get a mismatched shooter with lots of pitting and want to restore it best I can so that I can have something resembeling a pistol that I couldnt otherwise afford at this time (Translation: My wife would say no) as she doesnt understand why 4 old guns and 3 new ones isn't "enough". Anyway, do you have any suggestions on how to remove pitting using a TIG welder?

Ron Smith · 01-08-2007, 11:55 AM

Ken,

All that I know is that the pitting has to be ground down to clean fresh metal to remove all impurities. Using a Fordham tool(Dremel on Steroids)fitted with a burr. Then the hole is filled with weld and resurfaced by draw filing.

policeluger · 01-08-2007, 01:45 PM

there are no fillers, a tig will clean out a small pit as it worked so there is no need for filing as Ron has stated....done a million of 'em....just tig the pits, file to surface correction and blue...

Crotalus · 01-08-2007, 02:13 PM

so would a 9-amp porter cable grinder qualify as a "dremmel on steroids"? Do you just use an ordinary file for metal? Any suggestions are greately appreciated.

Tomathvl · 01-08-2007, 03:14 PM

Howard,
What do you use for filler wire for the TIG weld? I would guess the metallurigical composition of the filler wire would matter so the bluing would match, No?
Tom

Ron Smith · 01-09-2007, 09:19 AM

Tom,

That's what I have heard also. We have a local welder who is about the only one around who will work on guns. He is a genious with a welder, but he always asks if it's okay to test the metal with a jeweler's file so he can judge the properties of the metal in order to know what type of wire to use.

Howard,

I didn't say anything about using "fill". I said it is "filled with weld" , as in welded up.

Ken,

Use a fine cut mill file to draw file it to the original conture. Be sure to clean the file between strokes to prevent it from "loading up". The cuts will be cleaner on each stroke. Another trick is to use lumber chalk (big fat sticks) . Run the file across the chalk periodicaly to prevent it from "loading up" with metal shavings.

.

Ron

SGT Getch · 01-09-2007, 09:39 AM

Anyone ever tell you that you look like Tom Clancy??

SSG Getch
(recent promotion)

policeluger · 01-09-2007, 09:59 AM

ironcross asked about fillers, never said you did friend, sorry for any misunderstanding.

Ron Smith · 01-09-2007, 10:25 AM

Howard,

Sorry, I mis-read(filing vs filling).

Are you saying that there is no need to file it after it has been tigged? I am not familiar with TIG welding first hand. Doesn't it leave a bead that has to be faced off where it has been welded?

Ron

Ron Wood · 01-09-2007, 10:34 AM

Esteemed Ron, Howard said:

Quote:

just tig the pits, file to surface correction and blue

He indicates that the welds must be filed down. Evidently, in his experience there is no need to file the pits beforehand as the heat of welding takes care of any iron oxides in the pits. I would think this would be a function of how deep and large the pit is, with some clean up of a larger pit being necessary to assure a clean weld without any cratering or blow out. Just a thought.

Other Ron

Ron Smith · 01-09-2007, 10:44 AM

Ron,

That's what I was thinking. Thanks for clarifying my attempt at a question.

I know that the metal should be as pure as possible. Free of oil, residue and impurities to prevent a blow out.

policeluger · 01-09-2007, 11:03 AM

thanks to both Rons, the real issue is to be free of blue finish as it will mess up the weld, that would be blue in the area of weld, of course there would be no or little blue at the pit, but you weld will go just past pit and may hit blue.....clear as mud???...well ya know, need to say here it must also be free of any junk someone may have used to fill/treat the pitted area, epoxy/brass brase who know what is out there and may have been done the the gun smith,,,ha

policeluger · 01-09-2007, 11:27 AM

oh....Tom, we use a 70 series (2) low carbon cooper coated 70,000# tensile strong, but this while it works well on Lugers/1911's /BHP and so on, will not work on a double heat treated or high nickle gun, like 1903 and so on.....

Crotalus · 01-09-2007, 01:33 PM

My question is for policeluger since you seem to know what type of welding material to use. A good friend of mine (also on this forum) welds quite a bit and has a TIG welder in his garage. I have a heavily pitted mismatched bolo broomhandle that I would like to fix up aesthetically, what would you use for TIG welding on that type of metal?

11-25-2006, 03:22 PM	#1
ironcross4148 Guest Posts: n/a	Question about Pitting Hello Guys, Can someone tell me how a gunsmith can remove light or heavy pits from a pistol? I wonder if there is a "filler" that they use to fill in the pits, and if so where can I obtain this filler. Would it something like "liquid steel" or a product like that? Maybe Thor should answer this question since he has done magic with old pitted Lugers and made them lik new. Thanks. Bob

11-25-2006, 03:38 PM	#2
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Bob, The only cure for pitting is to have it draw filed out or filled by someone very competent with a TIG welder and resurfaced or draw filed back to the original conture. It takes a very fine hand to do it correctly. Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

01-08-2007, 11:55 AM	#4
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Ken, All that I know is that the pitting has to be ground down to clean fresh metal to remove all impurities. Using a Fordham tool(Dremel on Steroids)fitted with a burr. Then the hole is filled with weld and resurfaced by draw filing. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

01-09-2007, 09:19 AM	#8
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Tom, That's what I have heard also. We have a local welder who is about the only one around who will work on guns. He is a genious with a welder, but he always asks if it's okay to test the metal with a jeweler's file so he can judge the properties of the metal in order to know what type of wire to use. Howard, I didn't say anything about using "fill". I said it is "filled with weld" , as in welded up. Ken, Use a fine cut mill file to draw file it to the original conture. Be sure to clean the file between strokes to prevent it from "loading up". The cuts will be cleaner on each stroke. Another trick is to use lumber chalk (big fat sticks) . Run the file across the chalk periodicaly to prevent it from "loading up" with metal shavings. . Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

01-09-2007, 10:25 AM	#11
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Howard, Sorry, I mis-read(filing vs filling). Are you saying that there is no need to file it after it has been tigged? I am not familiar with TIG welding first hand. Doesn't it leave a bead that has to be faced off where it has been welded? Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

01-08-2007, 10:47 AM	#3
Crotalus User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 68 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	Hi Ron, A good friend of mine is a welder and is actually keeping a TIG welder in my workroom. He says he's quite experienced using it, and seing his work I believe he knows what he's doing. He has never used it for pitting so I'm not sure exactly what you have to do for that (although he might anyway). Regardless I am about to get a mismatched shooter with lots of pitting and want to restore it best I can so that I can have something resembeling a pistol that I couldnt otherwise afford at this time (Translation: My wife would say no) as she doesnt understand why 4 old guns and 3 new ones isn't "enough". Anyway, do you have any suggestions on how to remove pitting using a TIG welder?

01-08-2007, 01:45 PM	#5
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	there are no fillers, a tig will clean out a small pit as it worked so there is no need for filing as Ron has stated....done a million of 'em....just tig the pits, file to surface correction and blue...

01-08-2007, 02:13 PM	#6
Crotalus User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 68 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	so would a 9-amp porter cable grinder qualify as a "dremmel on steroids"? Do you just use an ordinary file for metal? Any suggestions are greately appreciated.

01-08-2007, 03:14 PM	#7
Tomathvl User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Milan, IN Posts: 363 Thanks: 3 Thanked 48 Times in 19 Posts	Howard, What do you use for filler wire for the TIG weld? I would guess the metallurigical composition of the filler wire would matter so the bluing would match, No? Tom

01-09-2007, 09:39 AM	#9
SGT Getch User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Standish, Maine Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Anyone ever tell you that you look like Tom Clancy?? SSG Getch (recent promotion)

01-09-2007, 09:59 AM	#10
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	ironcross asked about fillers, never said you did friend, sorry for any misunderstanding.

01-09-2007, 10:44 AM	#13
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Ron, That's what I was thinking. Thanks for clarifying my attempt at a question. I know that the metal should be as pure as possible. Free of oil, residue and impurities to prevent a blow out. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

01-09-2007, 11:03 AM	#14
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	thanks to both Rons, the real issue is to be free of blue finish as it will mess up the weld, that would be blue in the area of weld, of course there would be no or little blue at the pit, but you weld will go just past pit and may hit blue.....clear as mud???...well ya know, need to say here it must also be free of any junk someone may have used to fill/treat the pitted area, epoxy/brass brase who know what is out there and may have been done the the gun smith,,,ha

01-09-2007, 11:27 AM	#15
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	oh....Tom, we use a 70 series (2) low carbon cooper coated 70,000# tensile strong, but this while it works well on Lugers/1911's /BHP and so on, will not work on a double heat treated or high nickle gun, like 1903 and so on.....

01-09-2007, 01:33 PM	#16
Crotalus User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 68 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	My question is for policeluger since you seem to know what type of welding material to use. A good friend of mine (also on this forum) welds quite a bit and has a TIG welder in his garage. I have a heavily pitted mismatched bolo broomhandle that I would like to fix up aesthetically, what would you use for TIG welding on that type of metal?