6" .30 Luger barrel, 1900 style

[Lugerdoc]

Lifer, The first 9mmP barrels were the M1902 "Fat" barrels. I believe that these pistols had a heavier flat recoil spring, than the 7.65mm M1900s, so if installing a 9mm barrel using the 7.65mm recoil spring, I suggest a low power load in 9mms to be used. TH

[ithacaartist]

Tom,

Would it not also be possible to swap out the flat leaf system and replace with the coil spring system? I know, the components are slightly different between rear toggle and spring, but changing everything over from the rear link on down would do it? I'd add the adjustable guide, too!

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

Tom,

Would it not also be possible to swap out the flat leaf system and replace with the coil spring system? I know, the components are slightly different between rear toggle and spring, but changing everything over from the rear link on down would do it? I'd add the adjustable guide, too!

I'm not Tom (Tom doesn't take pics) but I see two problems: The small bulkhead that the coil spring bears against, and the lack of metal for the recoil lever pin...

...What adjustable guide???...

[Ron Wood]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

Tom,

Would it not also be possible to swap out the flat leaf system and replace with the coil spring system?

It is not only possible, it has been done. There are a number of authentic experimental and presentation Lugers that have had this modification (I even have done it )

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

It is not only possible, it has been done. There are a number of authentic experimental and presentation Lugers that have had this modification (I even have done it )

Ron, I'm comparing your 1900 frame to mine and I don't quite see where your 'insert' starts & ends...Is it welded in???

Yours has a stock lug...Is that a late 1900 frame???

[ithacaartist]

I see that it's more than simply changing parts...

[Ron Wood]

It starts and ends inside the red circle, and it is silver soldered in. Perhaps you can see the dovetails of the insert in this photo

P.S. It isn't mine...I wish it was. It is a GL marked transitional piece with the improved breech block and made from a 1904 Navy frame which explains the stock lug.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

It starts and ends inside the red circle, and it is silver soldered in. Perhaps you can see the dovetails of the insert in this photo.

I see something on the inside grip, but I can't envision what it is that is soldered in...Dave, can you see it???

Is it something maybe one inch in diameter and shaped to fit the cavity???

[ithacaartist]

[QUOTE=sheepherder;253071Dave, can you see it???

Is it something maybe one inch in diameter and shaped to fit the cavity???[/QUOTE]

The solder joint at the front of the insert is fairly visible, and if you look closely, a seam is evident in the material b elow the newly-created place for the pin. It would appear that the unit is slipped into the cavity in the frame, and the dovetails on the face of it assure that it won't be torqued around. The closer the fit of the joint, the better the solder bond; so I'd imagine a lot of work in fitting the piece to be patched in. The concept seems simple, otherwise. Thanks for the pics Ron.

I'd like to have a 1900 shooter someday. Changing over the recoil system would eliminate any worries about breaking a flat spring. This modification is semi-permanent (could be restored with a bunch more work) but the theoretical pistol would be a shooter.

Rich, I was referring to the adjustable recoil spring guide in another thread.

[Ron Wood]

Richard,
The entire web (or bulkhead as you call it) and the support for the recoil lever pin has been fabricated and set into the 1900 frame with dovetails at the front (see inset) and rear. Charlie Kenyon provided detailed line drawings of the insert in one of his articles in the series he wrote for "The Gun Report" some years back. It is the same device that was in a prototype piece that has been attributed to the Dutch, in fact some give the Dutch credit for inventing the coil spring action (but was probably something developed by DWM in response to the Dutch request for improvements).

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Richard,
The entire web (or bulkhead as you call it) and the support for the recoil lever pin has been fabricated and set into the 1900 frame with dovetails at the front (see inset) and rear. Charlie Kenyon provided detailed line drawings of the insert in one of his articles in the series he wrote for "The Gun Report" some years back.

I guess you have to be on top of it to see them...But that's OK, I have no plans for them. I don't have Kenyon's article. Maybe Dave would be interested...

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Richard,
The entire web (or bulkhead as you call it)...

Yes...It's the old salt in me showing through...

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Charlie Kenyon provided detailed line drawings of the insert in one of his articles in the series he wrote for "The Gun Report" some years back.

Ron, I was asked if I could look at those drawings and give an opinion on making the insert. I was told it might be in the Aug 2000 issue of 'The Gun Report". I can't find this magazine or article on eBay or on Jan's site.

Would you have a copy of the drawings? (Or the entire article?)

Dave, I did read your comment on the adjustable coil mainspring. I even downloaded the 12-page patent application. It seems pretty simple except for the means of adjustment. There's not a lot of room for a spanner. A slotted nut would require a hole. The nut could be notched or drilled with a series of holes to be turned with a teeny rod.

[Lugerdoc]

LIfer, I've also seen an example of this conversion. In addition to adding the bulkhead and recoil lever, you'd also have to exchange the M1900 "S" shaped connecting link for a standard PO8 type. TH

[Ron Wood]

Richard,
I have a copy of that article around somewhere...I will dig it out later and scan and post some of it. In the meantime here is a project I started over 30 years ago while I was still in the Army and I have never gotten around to finishing it. It is a hybrid 1900/1906 Baby. The modification for the coil spring insert is pretty crude in comparison to the DWM factory mod, but in my defense I am not a machinist and I did it all with hand tools.

[Ron Wood]

Here are some additional photos. GT made me some ivory insert magazine bottoms with fancy walnut to match my grips another craftsman made for me many years ago. Once again, I haven't gotten around to modifying some mag bodies to attach them to (I just stuck one not attached to a magazine in the gun for these photos). The magazine in the gun in the first photos is some aftermarket item I hacked up just to see if I could do it.

[sheepherder]

Very interesting conversion. I can sympathize with the hand tools; that's all I really have too!

You haven't done a short spring yet? Your 'baby' needs a barrel; there were a couple 'baby barrels' on GB last year...

[Ron Wood]

I have made a shortened mainspring and guide, it just isn't installed in the photo (I can install and remove mainsprings but it is still a pain in the butt for me...weak hands I guess). Once (if and when) I get all the pieces completed and put together it will require "tuning" of the mainspring to get it to cycle reliably with standard ammo. I plan (ha!) to make it a 9mm.
One of the things holding up the barrel installation is getting a "long" threaded shank barrel to match the long receiver on the gun. I finally got one but as I told you in the PM there are still some hurdles to overcome.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

One of the things holding up the barrel installation is getting a "long" threaded shank barrel to match the long receiver on the gun. I finally got one but as I told you in the PM there are still some hurdles to overcome.

Here's what you need to clean up those pesky threads, Ron!

[Ron Wood]

Wow, beautiful! It didn't take you long to knock that out! Do you have to harden the cutting edges?