Norinco 9mm

[Vlim]

Not wanting to throw oil on the fire here, but I can confirm that just about all sources I've come across mention the same velocities for the P08 / 9x19 para combo: about 320m/s.

I have some extensive ammunition test lists from the proof house in Ulm. They tested several brands of 9x19 para in the 1970s in order to come up with a suitable reference round for Mauser's post war production. When Mauser tested, they found the average v of modern ammo to be a tad higher (around 340 - 350m/s).

I've attached some test results from Mauser themselves, dating from around 1975, hope that helps:

Hersteller = Producer
Geschossgewichte = bullet weight in grams.
Geschosstype = bullet type (vollmantel = FMJ, Hohlspitzgeschoss = hollow point, panzerbrechend = armour piercing)

V measured with a 6" barrel, 5 meters away from the muzzle.

An additional report from the Mauser engineers:
b. Winchester, lot number 7658 DF 1.
The average gas pressure of these rounds is some 2177 bar and shows deviations of +124 / - 112 bar. This ammunition was used without problems and gave good results, undoubtedly because of the accurate production.

c. Norma, lot number 08915.
The average gas pressure of these rounds is some 2515 bar and shows deviations of +128 / -411 bar. The ammunition functions some 25% above user gas pressure and shoots very high as a result (highest sight needed)

d. Geco, lot number march 1971.
The average gas pressure of this round is some 1815 bar and shows deviations of +136 / -185. With this ammunition constant good results were had.

Interesting is that both Geco and Winchester produced a v of some 350 m/s on average and that, with much higher chamber pressures, Norma averaged at a lower v of some 344 m/s.

[Vlim]

Just for completeness sake, here is an interesting box of Geco 9x19 para from the 1980s. It was custom loaded for former NWM manager Henk Visser's personal use.

The V on the overlabel is given as 280 m/s, which is quite mild for P08 standards, as the commercial Geco is already a pretty mild round.

And some scans from a 1953 DDR manual on pistol and rifle rounds with v for the WW2 ammunition they were still using those days.

[Sieger]

Originally Posted by Vlim

Just for completeness sake, here is an interesting box of Geco 9x19 para from the 1980s. It was custom loaded for former NWM manager Henk Visser's personal use.

The V on the overlabel is given as 280 m/s, which is quite mild for P08 standards, as the commercial Geco is already a pretty mild round.

And some scans from a 1953 DDR manual on pistol and rifle rounds with v for the WW2 ammunition they were still using those days.

Dear Vlim:

Thank you for your contribution.

Around 320 m/sec, out of a 100mm (4 inch) barrel, seems to be the normal German Army load I've also been able to identify (see above post).

I hope you are having better weather than my friends in Berlin are having!!

Thanks again!

Sieger