New police Luger

TheRomanhistorian · 09-26-2013, 10:20 PM

So, I saw this at my local gun shop for $500 and I snapped her up at such a good deal. The pistol has no date, DWM toggle, and is all matching. Serial number 7799 and M on the frame. Buffed and refinished with mismatched magazine and aftermarket grips.

The grip says SP. Bn. 251. (which is crossed out) and then 1920. is stamped in.

DavidJayUden · 09-26-2013, 10:26 PM

Interesting location for the property stamp.
Nice find.
dju

Don M · 09-27-2013, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidJayUden

Interesting location for the property stamp.

That's not a property stamp. It's a reassigned inventory number. See Table 17-2 of HWIS for adjacent inventory numbers of the Bremen Schupo.

rolandtg · 09-26-2013, 11:08 PM

Nice price for an attractive, interesting shooter! Looks like a nice magazine too.

TheRomanhistorian · 09-27-2013, 08:18 AM

To be fair, there was some sheen of surface rust on some of the internals but a good strip down and cleaning as well as oiling took care of that. Seems like the last owner was just a bit neglectful? Pretty though definitely a shooter.

I read the markings as Schutzpolizei Bremen (formerly gun number) 251. No sign of any Russian capture marks (which could have been buffed out) and no sign of importer marks.

Don M · 09-27-2013, 11:33 AM

Michael, is there any evidence that 7,65 stamped on the chamber was removed? Many of these pistols were used by the Bremen Schupo for a period of time in their original caliber before being converted to 9 mm.

Jack Lawman · 09-27-2013, 01:29 PM

Your Bremen pistol is of the "SP." marked variety. Others are marked "S.P."

I don't believe the reason for this is known.

Does your pistol bear the number "251" on the rear of the frame?

Here are two other examples:
http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=31211

Jack

Don M · 09-27-2013, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Lawman

Your Bremen pistol is of the "SP." marked variety. Others are marked "S.P." I don't believe the reason for this is known.

Jack, you are correct although I suspect that S.P. may have been initiated by the Sicherheitspolizei and it was later changed to SP. after they were merged to form the Schutzpolizei. Just a guess, however.

Michael, although most of the Bremen Alphabet Commercials are reported as having a canceled 7,65 on the chamber, not all are so reported. The standard approach appears to have been to x-out this number when the gun was reworked, so perhaps yours never had it.

TheRomanhistorian · 09-27-2013, 01:54 PM

Jack - No, there's nothing on the rear of the frame. I can't tell if it's because of the buffing for refinishing (some areas are heavily buffed like parts of the toggle).

Don - I'm not seeing any sign of that but I could also just not be looking closely enough, either.

09-26-2013, 10:20 PM	#1
TheRomanhistorian User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 301 Thanks: 170 Thanked 88 Times in 64 Posts	New police Luger So, I saw this at my local gun shop for $500 and I snapped her up at such a good deal. The pistol has no date, DWM toggle, and is all matching. Serial number 7799 and M on the frame. Buffed and refinished with mismatched magazine and aftermarket grips. The grip says SP. Bn. 251. (which is crossed out) and then 1920. is stamped in. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Michael Nos morituri te salutant - Supposed saying of the gladiators to the emperor ('We, who are about to die, salute you.') 'We are the lantern bearers, my friend; for us to keep something burning, to carry what light we can forward into the darkness and the wind' - From Rosemary Sutcliff's The Lantern Bearers

09-27-2013, 08:18 AM	#5
TheRomanhistorian User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 301 Thanks: 170 Thanked 88 Times in 64 Posts	To be fair, there was some sheen of surface rust on some of the internals but a good strip down and cleaning as well as oiling took care of that. Seems like the last owner was just a bit neglectful? Pretty though definitely a shooter. I read the markings as Schutzpolizei Bremen (formerly gun number) 251. No sign of any Russian capture marks (which could have been buffed out) and no sign of importer marks. __________________ Michael Nos morituri te salutant - Supposed saying of the gladiators to the emperor ('We, who are about to die, salute you.') 'We are the lantern bearers, my friend; for us to keep something burning, to carry what light we can forward into the darkness and the wind' - From Rosemary Sutcliff's The Lantern Bearers

09-27-2013, 11:33 AM	#6
Don M Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 1,429 Thanks: 67 Thanked 292 Times in 191 Posts	Michael, is there any evidence that 7,65 stamped on the chamber was removed? Many of these pistols were used by the Bremen Schupo for a period of time in their original caliber before being converted to 9 mm. __________________ Regards, Don donmaus1@aol.com Author of History Writ in Steel: German Police Markings 1900-1936 http://www.historywritinsteel.com

09-27-2013, 01:29 PM	#7
Jack Lawman User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Near NYC Posts: 428 Thanks: 30 Thanked 64 Times in 37 Posts	Your Bremen pistol is of the "SP." marked variety. Others are marked "S.P." I don't believe the reason for this is known. Does your pistol bear the number "251" on the rear of the frame? Here are two other examples: http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=31211 Jack __________________ Why do you guys hate black circles so much?

09-27-2013, 01:54 PM	#9
TheRomanhistorian User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 301 Thanks: 170 Thanked 88 Times in 64 Posts	Jack - No, there's nothing on the rear of the frame. I can't tell if it's because of the buffing for refinishing (some areas are heavily buffed like parts of the toggle). Don - I'm not seeing any sign of that but I could also just not be looking closely enough, either. __________________ Michael Nos morituri te salutant - Supposed saying of the gladiators to the emperor ('We, who are about to die, salute you.') 'We are the lantern bearers, my friend; for us to keep something burning, to carry what light we can forward into the darkness and the wind' - From Rosemary Sutcliff's The Lantern Bearers

09-26-2013, 10:26 PM	#2
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Interesting location for the property stamp. Nice find. dju

09-26-2013, 11:08 PM	#4
rolandtg User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 479 Thanks: 389 Thanked 265 Times in 114 Posts	Nice price for an attractive, interesting shooter! Looks like a nice magazine too.