French made Walther PP

Grasshopper · 12-03-2008, 12:11 PM

I just bought a Walther PP in 7.65 mm (.32 ACP). On the left side, it has the markings of Manurhin - Made in France. It also states 'MANUFACTURE DE MACHINES - Du Haut-rhin.

The importer is C.A.I. Georgia VT., and the s.n. is 865XX.

I have two questions regarding this pistol:

The first question is, what is the date, or approximate date of manufacture?

The second question regards ammo. In .32 ACP, I usually shoot Wolf fmj (brass), or Magtech fmj. I also just picked up some Blazer fmj. However, I also have some S&B fmj which is a bit hotter (according to the ballistic charts). I've therefore been reluctant to shoot it in any of my older .32 ACP pistols. Would the standard S&B fmj be too hot for this Walther?

Any info will be greatly appreciated.

THANKS!

Edward Tinker · 12-03-2008, 01:05 PM

There are PP guys here on the forum, but our sister website is devoted to P38's and PP/PPK's; www.p38forum.com

Ed

Grasshopper · 12-03-2008, 03:04 PM

Thanks! I will check them out.

Lugerdoc · 12-05-2008, 09:58 AM

Rather than debate with the "Tac man" here, I think that you will get more accurate info at www.P38forum.com TH

John Sabato · 12-05-2008, 10:12 AM

Huh? ...debate? ...what debate?

Vlim · 12-05-2008, 10:28 AM

Well,

Actually Mauser was occupied by the French and made pistols in their own company, mainly using available spare parts between 1945 and 1948. So the 'French Mausers' were all made in Oberndorf am Neckar in the original Mauser plant. There is still some debate over a small batch of French P08's that may have been assembled outside Mauser but no documented proof has surfaced about that piece of history (yet).

After WW2, the military contractors like Walther and Mauser were forbidden to make guns in certain (military) calibers. Walther focused on air guns and Mauser was kindly put out of business by the French, for they blew up most of the buildings and shipped out the machinery.

Manurhin indeed started producing the Walther PP/K under license from Walther with the understanding that, once the ban on German gun production was over, Walther would resume production themselves.

Manurhin later stepped in as a production partner for Mauser, producing most parts of the HSc pistols in the 1970s.

Grasshopper · 12-05-2008, 04:54 PM

Well, I've had the post in on the other site for a couple of days now, and I've not yet received a response. I guess we will see....

Lugerdoc · 12-06-2008, 10:29 AM

Grasshopper, Per the info in Dieter Marschall's book, your pistol was made about 1960. Post WW2 all of the PP & PPK pistol parts were made in France by Manurhin beginning in 1986 some of these parts were shipped to Germany to be marked and assembled as Walthers. TH

Grasshopper · 12-03-2008, 05:14 PM

Tac, thank you for the information, that helps! It IS in fact in very good condition, and I'm looking forward to shooting it soon...

THANKS!

12-03-2008, 12:11 PM	#1
Grasshopper User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Tennessee Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	French made Walther PP I just bought a Walther PP in 7.65 mm (.32 ACP). On the left side, it has the markings of Manurhin - Made in France. It also states 'MANUFACTURE DE MACHINES - Du Haut-rhin. The importer is C.A.I. Georgia VT., and the s.n. is 865XX. I have two questions regarding this pistol: The first question is, what is the date, or approximate date of manufacture? The second question regards ammo. In .32 ACP, I usually shoot Wolf fmj (brass), or Magtech fmj. I also just picked up some Blazer fmj. However, I also have some S&B fmj which is a bit hotter (according to the ballistic charts). I've therefore been reluctant to shoot it in any of my older .32 ACP pistols. Would the standard S&B fmj be too hot for this Walther? Any info will be greatly appreciated. THANKS! __________________ "You ain't gonna git outta this life alive."

12-03-2008, 01:05 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,963 Thanks: 2,064 Thanked 4,592 Times in 2,114 Posts	There are PP guys here on the forum, but our sister website is devoted to P38's and PP/PPK's; www.p38forum.com Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

12-03-2008, 03:04 PM	#3
Grasshopper User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Tennessee Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks! I will check them out. __________________ "You ain't gonna git outta this life alive."

12-05-2008, 09:58 AM	#4
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	Rather than debate with the "Tac man" here, I think that you will get more accurate info at www.P38forum.com TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

12-05-2008, 10:12 AM	#5
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,155 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	Huh? ...debate? ...what debate? __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

12-05-2008, 10:28 AM	#6
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Well, Actually Mauser was occupied by the French and made pistols in their own company, mainly using available spare parts between 1945 and 1948. So the 'French Mausers' were all made in Oberndorf am Neckar in the original Mauser plant. There is still some debate over a small batch of French P08's that may have been assembled outside Mauser but no documented proof has surfaced about that piece of history (yet). After WW2, the military contractors like Walther and Mauser were forbidden to make guns in certain (military) calibers. Walther focused on air guns and Mauser was kindly put out of business by the French, for they blew up most of the buildings and shipped out the machinery. Manurhin indeed started producing the Walther PP/K under license from Walther with the understanding that, once the ban on German gun production was over, Walther would resume production themselves. Manurhin later stepped in as a production partner for Mauser, producing most parts of the HSc pistols in the 1970s.

12-05-2008, 04:54 PM	#7
Grasshopper User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Tennessee Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Well, I've had the post in on the other site for a couple of days now, and I've not yet received a response. I guess we will see.... __________________ "You ain't gonna git outta this life alive."

12-06-2008, 10:29 AM	#8
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	Grasshopper, Per the info in Dieter Marschall's book, your pistol was made about 1960. Post WW2 all of the PP & PPK pistol parts were made in France by Manurhin beginning in 1986 some of these parts were shipped to Germany to be marked and assembled as Walthers. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

12-03-2008, 05:14 PM	#9
Grasshopper User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Tennessee Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Tac, thank you for the information, that helps! It IS in fact in very good condition, and I'm looking forward to shooting it soon... THANKS! __________________ "You ain't gonna git outta this life alive."