Why is it collectors prefer WW2 WW1 weapons/
 

With no imporation stampings/ I know the answer to this question but am having a hard time explaing it to someone, for he owns a century import P-38 that was cipped with imporation stamps, all matching but he got it for 500, . IS there way one of you guys can put it into terms he could understand?

Luger and P.38 collectors value firearms highly when they are as close to the original factory state as possible.

Any modifications, mismatched parts, wear or non German military markings reduce collector interest, and valuation considerably.

Marc

yea, but why the imporation stamps? even though all origina, great finsih, if thye have importation stamps, they seem to think of it as les value, AGAIN, I know hy, i can 't explain, this, and did they dipp P-38's? NO right, maybe after the war, but were they dipped and than sent to battle?

Stamps, proof marks, unit marks tell a story. To me, it's the story behind the firearm. Research is more complete with a proof mark/unit mark. Never been a P-38 fan, doesn't have the History as the P-08 does.

Because it has been "messed with". Once messed with, whether stamped, reblued, or otherwise altered, it leaves the smaller realm of collector guns, and enters the realm of more common, less collectable guns.
I guess it is just a way of maintaining the demand for the select few. Try selling a muscle car with non-matching numbers. Yes you can do it but no you will not get as much. Although it may run as good as or better than original.
But I agree that it is hard to verbalize.
dju

If no importation marks it has a better chance of being a Vet bringback also.

wellllll, it has a better chance, but before 1968, tens of thousands of lugers were imported into the USA.

So, what others said above is true, but here is my 2 cents...

The simple answer is that you have to be a collector to understand, a person who is a shooter or non-collector can not understand WHY importation markings affect value, but it does.

The dipped is for Russian lugers and P38's, they were dipped either before storage or more likely before they were exported to the USA and other countries.

It also depends on the collecting area, really.

Many guns went through refurbishing programmes while in use, anyway.

And there are import markings and import markings. Some are just awfully done, others well hidden out of sight. To me, such markings (which also include dealer markings and proof markings) are useful to trace the history of a gun.

I agree. To me ALL these guns are collectible. Some are just more desirable, due to the purity of their pedigree, (I.E. most closely resembling factory new).

Something similar occurs with Colt 1911s and SAAs. A Colt 1911 that has original finish and features is more desirable than one which has been parked and has A1 upgrades, but they are both still collectible and priced accordingly.

An original 7.5" US marked SAA is more desirable than a US marked Artillery SAA, yet both are collectible and priced accordingly.

They are all history.

Alainint,

"I agree. To me ALL these guns are collectible. Some are just more desirable, due to the purity of their pedigree, (I.E. most closely resembling factory new). "


Thank you, thank you, thank you, I agree completely, I believe the terminology "collector" and "Shooter" is a little misleading but still useful in distinguishing a pistol that has not been changed except through normal wear and tear as it left the factory as opposed to one that may have been repaired, reconditioned or had replacement parts added, but I believe they are all still very collectible.

Lon

Import markings
 

Personally, I do not like import marks and will pass on a Luger with them. Of course, there are other opinions about this and I respect that.

It is permissible to place import marks unobtrusively in the magazine well of a Luger-- making them VERY HARD TO SEE!

This is o.k. with the ATF, and I wish more importers would use it

The problem is the cost. Imagine the labor to disassemble 10,000 imported firearms, stamp them in a discreet spot, then reassemble them, trying to keep all the correct parts together.

Only small "boutique" importers have the time to do this and of course, pass the cost onto you.

Has anyone but me ever purchased a gun for their collection, then later found a tiny very hard to see import marks in some hidden place? Some are like micro printing, they look like scratch. To my surprise, I found I did not mind too much at all. Sure its better with out it but if you can't see it, well who cares. I collect the gun, not the previous travel history.

Yes. It happened to me with a near mint AC41 P-38 pistol. The finish was clearly original. The markings were all very sharp and crisp and the grips had a beautiful wine red color to them. I was very surprised to find an import mark on the bottom flat of the slide when I was cleaning it one day. But considering that someone took a near-mint pistol and simply exported it without altering it in any way, the import stamp made little difference to me.

yes, it has happened to me

I was thinking that in the last 3 or 4 yrs, that import markings were required to be a certain size, but perhaps I am confused?