To shoot, or not to shoot my WW2 Luger
 

Hello Experts,

I inherited a couple German pistols that were originally picked up by a family member in Europe during WW2. I would like to shoot the Luger pictured, but am unsure if that is wise. I would hate to damage it or significantly reduce its value. Any advice is greatly appreciated!

As far as I can tell, it was made by Simpson & Co. and was pre-WW2 manufacture. All the parts have matching serial numbers...almost. The clip does not match and the firing pin is stamped "73", I'm wondering if that was a manufacturer mistake since the other parts are stamped "37".

Your comments are appreciated in advance! Thank you

Should I shoot this Luger?
 

Hello Experts,

This is a duplicate of a post on the WW2 forum. I could not figure out how to move it here. Probably a more appropriate place for this question.

I inherited a couple German pistols that were originally picked up by a family member in Europe during WW2. I would like to shoot the Luger pictured, but am unsure if that is wise. I would hate to damage it or significantly reduce its value. Any advice is greatly appreciated!

As far as I can tell, it was made by Simpson & Co. and was pre-WW2 manufacture. All the parts have matching serial numbers...almost. The clip does not match and the firing pin is stamped "73", I'm wondering if that was a manufacturer mistake since the other parts are stamped "37".

Your comments are appreciated in advance! Thank you

Welcome to the board.
Your question has been addressed countless times- what it comes down to is- it is up to you.
Breaking a numbered part will reduce its value, but if you inherited it- it was free- so not a big issue.

It would be worth more to you as a family related item than anyone else, JMHO.

If the striker(firing pin) also has a small eagle/6 stamped on it, it may be an original Simson part.
If not, it has already been replaced once.

Some folks worry a lot about "breaking" a luger, I don't, if you use regular 115 gr ammo, not +P and not Nato, I would shoot it.

The parts that break more often- but not really often:
ejector
extractor
striker

On a Simson they would all have the small e/6 - parts which are hard to find.
You could always buy spares and replace them before you shoot.

Do a search for shooting my luger, and read all the opinions.

Everyone has one, and they are usually different!

The safest way is to buy a shooter luger and shoot it! :)

By the way, there are no pictures in your post.

If that it what it says, then it is a very poor quality fake... :p

Now Rich, be nice. This is the new collectors forum.
JShark,
what he means is "Simson" as in the luger producer is spelled without the "p".

Someone corrected me in my first post also, something I'll not forget.
There is a "Simpson" luger seller though, in Ill.

Corrected, thank you for the explanation for DonVoigt. And I read your response on my mistake post. I didn't notice the stamp on the firing pin, so I assume it was a replacement.

Don't fret, I have made the same mistake!!

Welcome to the forum. Congrats on your family heirlooms.

Some might say not to fire it; others will say, fire it. It's your gun and you should enjoy it as you choose. It may also depend on your definition of "firing it". I wouldn't suggest you shoot it weekly at the range. There are other guns for that. But, occasionally or rarely shooting a mag or two with your Luger, then that is another scenario. Realize that even shooting it one you take a chance of breaking a numbet part. But, every time you get into your car you roll the dice that you may get into an accident. Taking risks is part of living. I say if you want to enjoy it to fullest you should shoot it.

Let us know what you decide to do.

I need to ask a couple of questions

1. it is 1237 and NOT 1237a?
2. look at the bottom of the stock lug, it should have two eagle 6's

Its in rougher shape, lots of bluing loss, of course I would still buy it if the price was right ;)

I will assume it is 1237, the firing pin being messed up by the factory is very unlikely - much more likely it got swapped accidentally by a soldier or at the company.

Grips should be marked 1237 - which is unusual, most lugers the only have the last two of the serial number.

1237 would have been made in late 1926 or early 1927 for the army - there were a total of less than 12,000 Simson lugers made. BTW, I have accidentally written Simpson - oh well

There were only 12,000 Simson Lugers manufactured between WW-I and about 1933. These are so rare that I personally would not fire one under any circumstances.

Almost every part has an E/6 acceptance stamp, including the grip screws. if you lose or break a part, they are literally made of "unobtainium".

An original Simson firing pin would have a E/6 mark as well as the number. if this is missing, it's a replacement. If it's present it could be original.

Did Simson or any other luger producer besides DWM produce luger ammo?

There you are, just as I said, you have the answers from "shoot it" to "don't shoot it".
Now you decide what you want to do. :)

Democracy

Shoot it

Thanks for all the advice. I love history and these guns are certainly part of it. I don't ever plan on selling this gun, so I'll feed a few rounds through it. I suppose that's why it was made after all. For those of you that like history, I'm told this Luger, along with a P38 pictured above, weee picked up off the battlefield by an uncle of mine. His name was Sgt. Hilliger and he was attached to a forward communication unit. He carried the Luger as a personal sidearm for a few years, until he "found" the P38 and decided to carry it instead.

Here are a few more photos and the holster he carried. I assume the holster was made somewhere in the rear,as it doesn't have any German markings.

One more photo

The firing pin is, in fact, a Simson accepted firing pin.

There are factory "errors" where serial numbers are misstamped. It's more likely that you have something like that.

{unnecessary comment withdrawn}

To each his own.

Your holster is not German military. It was probably not made in Europe either.

Thanks Marc.

I suspect there are many more than 700 or 1400 Simson lugers extant of the original 12k produced;
I have four of them- so they can't be rare, maybe not even scarce!

None of mine are perfect, as these were used when produced/issued and for many years thereafter.

Although I've collected 21 over 2 decades, against advice from others, I test fired my 1914 DWM Artillery and was amazed by the power and kick!

I certainly never thought about the loss of somebody's collectable affected mine in any way.

Unnecessary comment withdrawn... No reason to stir up controversy over opinions... I really don't care what someone else does with their collectible firearms.

In fact, it's really fun to shoot Lugers, and gets attention at the range... I have a shooter Luger with finish issues for shooting...

I'll defer to Ed for the number of extant Simson Lugers versus the 12,000 made. His April 2017 list has 674 known, and there might well be double that number out there.

So... 12% of the Simson Lugers may still exist, and 6% are known to collectors. One more more or less doesn't change that much...

The only reason someone would ask about firing a collectible firearm on a forum like this is that they are anxious about damaging it in the first place, and are looking for some kind of support for firing it. Those that encourage shooting it have the effect of enabling this action.

I really have no objection to someone else doing it. There are photographs and stories of damaged pistols available if someone searches for them. There are probably many more instances of firing a gun a few times with no ill effect. After all, they were made for shooting...

Of course, military organizations fielded a number of armory services to repair firearms. They also did not focus on keeping matching originality in their guns.

We get the questions all the time, and consistently give both answers - shoot and don't shoot. I doubt that will change in the future.

... :p ...

I say shoot because I'm not a collector.

Sorry I couldn't resist.

I vote shoot. The curiosity would kill me very cool pieces!

As I've said on this subject before, I shoot all my Lugers. Matching guns all. But when I take one to the range, I remove the extractor and firing pin and replace those with mismatched spares. Then when I get home to clean it, the originals go back in. That way, I don't risk those 2 most commonly broken parts.

I have two shooter grade Lugers and shoot'em like I hate'em. I can get my Luger "fix" with less anxiety. But, I have shot a few mags in my collectors. The temptation was too great. It's all their fault. They made me do it. :rolleyes:

Thanks all! Great information.

I don't claim to be an expert but your question is a perennial classic and decisions on shooting or not shooting are quite different here as in several other forums I belong to.
Personally I would NEVER shoot any of mine collectibles, especially a Simpson, but the gun is yours, so in the end the decision is only yours.

Another option is to buy a spare toggle train. Swap the toggle train and remove the hold open latch when you want to shoot your Luger. Most of the numbered parts that are likely to break will not then be at risk.

Mines are guns, made to shoot, collectibles or not.

I shot my 1906, 06 Parabellum few times.

Of course I would not shoot thousands of rounds with it, but a few rounds from time to time.

But to shoot more I bought a 06/29 a month ago.

Guns are made for shooting. I will never buy one that I would be too afraid to use for fear of breaking something.

Of course some of the older ones have very very limited use.

A non shooting gun is a way to expensive paperweight for me.

Couldn't resist either.

Attachment 69194

My two expensive paper weights that I would never shoot, 1900 Test or 1902 Fat Barrel! I have a specially assembled shooter to fire! Toggle marks are like luger tatoos, permanent and part of history~

This whole thread reminds me of Hamlet's soliloquy, "To shoot or not to shoot? That is the question".
Personally I don't give a rat's ass if someone shoots his collectible Luger, it's a free country. I don't choose to shoot mine, when I want to shoot I use a Kimber 1911, it's reliable and accurate and has only one numbered part (the frame).
Norm

@ Cirelaw

I would not shoot those either.

And that is why I wouldn't buy them either.

That, and because I couldn't afford them.:D

So, that was a fun thread! Here's another question:

Putting all other things aside, such as the history of the pistol, what sets a Simpson Luger apart from others from the same era?

Darn it! "Simson" it's the iPhone autocorrect, I swear.

There are no other German Military Lugers of the same era.
Norm

Ed likes them, he even wrote a book about them!! http://simsonlugers.com/index.htm

During the Weimar era, SImson of Suhl Germany was the only firm officially allowed to supply the 100,000 man army and the police agencies with Luger handguns. This was imposed by the Allies after they won WW-I.

Erfurt had been taken apart, and DWM was making 7.65mm commercial pistols (and some unofficial 9mm Lugers called "Sneaks"). The Erfurt tooling and gauges went to Simson.

The DWM line was not transferred to Mauser until the early 1930's. Mauser restarted military Luger production in 1934 with the "K" date pistols.

In 1933, the Nazi government seized control from the Weimar and the third age of German government started.

Simson was Jewish owned, and the Nazis were quick to take over and shut down their operations. The tooling and gauges were removed to Krieghoff where Lugers were made for airforce use.

So... Simson was unique in history, and have a very short run during their operations. Perhaps 8-9 years (1925-1933) and just over 1,000 Lugers per year.

So the uniqueness is not because they are built better, but just less made?