New holster AWM

DavidJayUden · 12-19-2008, 07:28 PM

I just got a 1915 DWM in a brown holster stamped "AWM" over a "3" over a "10" on the outside just beneath the flap cover. I saw the translation of the AWM, but what do the 3 and 10 represent?

And on the inside are inked letters: 7JR (the J could be a T), over LB over MCK (the C could be an 0 or even a G)

Any ideas what it all means?

Thanks!
DJU

mauro · 12-20-2008, 03:36 AM

Hi DJU,
AWM = ArtillerieWerkstatten Munchen
3 is the working group number
10 is 1910.

in the AWM there were several working-groups specialised in production and holster acceptance for the German forces

Hope this helps

Mauro

DavidJayUden · 12-20-2008, 09:04 AM

Thank you Mauro. 1910 mfg. Interesting. This holster is in remarkably good shape. Slightly dry though.
I'm assuming that the inside lettering is unit markings? (I said that they are inked, but they are stencilled or professionally applied, not scribbled by a bored soldier on guard duty.)
DJU

abukafura · 12-20-2008, 10:03 AM

Look again at the "L". Are you sure it is not a "1"? I'd bet that the "O" is a "G", like in "MGC."

DavidJayUden · 12-20-2008, 03:00 PM

I can not be sure but the L could certainly be a 1, and the O very likely is a G, as in MGK.
DJU

abukafura · 12-20-2008, 05:37 PM

OOOPS. I did mean "MGK."

DavidJayUden · 12-20-2008, 06:37 PM

So what would the MGK and 7JR and LB refer to? And what is a "working group"? A factory or cottage industry supplier?
DJU

abukafura · 12-21-2008, 01:15 PM

The 7JR refers to the unit...the 7th Infantry Regiment. The MGK refers to the Machine Gun Kompany (Company) of the regiment. The LB is unknown to me, unless it is a 1B, which could refer to the 1st battalion of the regiment. Depends on whether it is a "1B" or a "LB." Hope this helps.

abukafura · 12-21-2008, 01:19 PM

One more thing....as stated in a previous reply, the 3 refers to the workshop at the Artillery Workshop Munich (AWM) which did leather work, in this case the 3d workshop. The 10 refers to "1910," the year of the work. There wre a number of workshops, each numbered, in this case it was number 3. My personal opinion is that the AWM holsters were the nicest of all the Imperial produced holsters. I really like them and have about a dozen in my collection. Others may want to add to or correct what I have written here.

DavidJayUden · 12-21-2008, 02:47 PM

Thanks for the wisdom of your experience. Now one more question:
The DWM Luger is dated 1915 over the chamber and was brought back, with this holster, by a WW2 vet, probably from France but the details are unclear. Is it possible that this was the correct or issued holster for this gun given about a 5 year difference in build dates?
Again, many thanks!
DJU

wlyon · 12-21-2008, 04:21 PM

We collectors like to match up our lugers with the same date holsters. I am sure the German army was not that fussy, and did not worry about what matched up. Your holster could well be correct, who knows? Bill

George Anderson · 12-21-2008, 05:32 PM

DJU, your holster would have most likely been first matched up with a 1910 or 1908 (first military) as holsters were in very tight supply in 1910. As Bill suggests your pistol could have been matched up with the early holster at any time thereafter. The set could have been put together by the German army an individual German or an American.

Should you want to seperate the two and mate a later holster with the pistol I would be more than happy to help you.

DavidJayUden · 12-21-2008, 06:36 PM

Thank you all once again.
DJU

Navy · 12-22-2008, 11:56 AM

Holsters were issued through clothing channels, i.e. The bekliedungsamt (SP?) while weapons were issued to enlisted through weapons channels. For a landser to have a holster dated the same as the chamber date on the pistol would be purely coincidental and not likely of any concer to the common soldier.

Tom A

12-19-2008, 07:28 PM	#1
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	New holster AWM I just got a 1915 DWM in a brown holster stamped "AWM" over a "3" over a "10" on the outside just beneath the flap cover. I saw the translation of the AWM, but what do the 3 and 10 represent? And on the inside are inked letters: 7JR (the J could be a T), over LB over MCK (the C could be an 0 or even a G) Any ideas what it all means? Thanks! DJU

12-20-2008, 03:36 AM	#2
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Hi DJU, AWM = ArtillerieWerkstatten Munchen 3 is the working group number 10 is 1910. in the AWM there were several working-groups specialised in production and holster acceptance for the German forces Hope this helps Mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service. Last edited by mauro; 12-20-2008 at 03:58 AM.

12-21-2008, 04:21 PM	#11
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,619 Thanks: 3,144 Thanked 2,530 Times in 943 Posts	We collectors like to match up our lugers with the same date holsters. I am sure the German army was not that fussy, and did not worry about what matched up. Your holster could well be correct, who knows? Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

12-20-2008, 09:04 AM	#3
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Thank you Mauro. 1910 mfg. Interesting. This holster is in remarkably good shape. Slightly dry though. I'm assuming that the inside lettering is unit markings? (I said that they are inked, but they are stencilled or professionally applied, not scribbled by a bored soldier on guard duty.) DJU

12-20-2008, 10:03 AM	#4
abukafura Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Northeast Wisconsin, near Greeen Bay Posts: 327 Thanks: 1,314 Thanked 89 Times in 57 Posts	Look again at the "L". Are you sure it is not a "1"? I'd bet that the "O" is a "G", like in "MGC."

12-20-2008, 03:00 PM	#5
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	I can not be sure but the L could certainly be a 1, and the O very likely is a G, as in MGK. DJU

12-20-2008, 05:37 PM	#6
abukafura Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Northeast Wisconsin, near Greeen Bay Posts: 327 Thanks: 1,314 Thanked 89 Times in 57 Posts	OOOPS. I did mean "MGK."

12-20-2008, 06:37 PM	#7
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	So what would the MGK and 7JR and LB refer to? And what is a "working group"? A factory or cottage industry supplier? DJU

12-21-2008, 01:15 PM	#8
abukafura Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Northeast Wisconsin, near Greeen Bay Posts: 327 Thanks: 1,314 Thanked 89 Times in 57 Posts	The 7JR refers to the unit...the 7th Infantry Regiment. The MGK refers to the Machine Gun Kompany (Company) of the regiment. The LB is unknown to me, unless it is a 1B, which could refer to the 1st battalion of the regiment. Depends on whether it is a "1B" or a "LB." Hope this helps.

12-21-2008, 01:19 PM	#9
abukafura Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Northeast Wisconsin, near Greeen Bay Posts: 327 Thanks: 1,314 Thanked 89 Times in 57 Posts	One more thing....as stated in a previous reply, the 3 refers to the workshop at the Artillery Workshop Munich (AWM) which did leather work, in this case the 3d workshop. The 10 refers to "1910," the year of the work. There wre a number of workshops, each numbered, in this case it was number 3. My personal opinion is that the AWM holsters were the nicest of all the Imperial produced holsters. I really like them and have about a dozen in my collection. Others may want to add to or correct what I have written here.

12-21-2008, 02:47 PM	#10
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Thanks for the wisdom of your experience. Now one more question: The DWM Luger is dated 1915 over the chamber and was brought back, with this holster, by a WW2 vet, probably from France but the details are unclear. Is it possible that this was the correct or issued holster for this gun given about a 5 year difference in build dates? Again, many thanks! DJU

12-21-2008, 05:32 PM	#12
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,772 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	DJU, your holster would have most likely been first matched up with a 1910 or 1908 (first military) as holsters were in very tight supply in 1910. As Bill suggests your pistol could have been matched up with the early holster at any time thereafter. The set could have been put together by the German army an individual German or an American. Should you want to seperate the two and mate a later holster with the pistol I would be more than happy to help you.

12-21-2008, 06:36 PM	#13
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Thank you all once again. DJU

12-22-2008, 11:56 AM	#14
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Holsters were issued through clothing channels, i.e. The bekliedungsamt (SP?) while weapons were issued to enlisted through weapons channels. For a landser to have a holster dated the same as the chamber date on the pistol would be purely coincidental and not likely of any concer to the common soldier. Tom A