WWWII Bring Back

5xchamp · 07-16-2002, 10:19 AM

Hi, just new to the forum and what a comprehensive forum it is. Now have a better understanding of what type of WWWII luger my uncle had willed to me. A 1940 Mauser Banner model 42, has as "M" on the front of the frame just below the barrel and two "M"s on the rear toggle link. Military proofs on right of reciver and left & right proofs on barrel. Also eagle/swastika on breech block. The S/N is 165 with no other lettering except for an upper case K found on the frame hidden under the left side pistol grip.

Does the S/N 165, with no lettering mean that this luger was the 165th off the production line for model and year?

Wonder what the upper case K signifies and whether it's a Police issue? Appreciate any information you can help me with. Thanks Rusty B.

Edward Tinker · 07-16-2002, 12:02 PM

Hello Rusty, welcome to the forum!

Is it possible to either scan in the Luger or take some close digital photos of it? Do you know which proofs it has on it and can tell us from the markings pages on your left? I too have a 42 / 1940 and there were approx 150,000 made.

So under the barrel the serial number is 165 and through the gun there should be the last two digits on many parts.

I think others would be interested in the M's that you see and esp would like to see them scanned in if possible.

Is there a story on how your uncle aquired the pistol? I myself am very interested in that aspect and slowly am putting together a booklet on guns brought back by uncles, dads etc.

If you go to your left, you can get sheets where you can write down all the proofs and markings.

Use this page for markings and telling us what they look like: http://www.lugerforum.com/lugermarkings.html

and this is the ID sheet area: http://www.lugerforum.com/IDsheets.html

Ed

5xchamp · 07-16-2002, 04:31 PM

Hi Ed, there is a story that goes with the luger and I can provide pictures and more info. on markings. It will take me a few days to get back as my Aunt still has the luger. Not a problem though will take pictures with a digital camera at her place. I'm in the process of obtaining a licence to take possession.

Thanks Rusty B.

Edward Tinker · 07-16-2002, 06:44 PM

Hey Rusty that would be great, you can just send me a private message and it'll hit my e-mail.

kidvett · 07-16-2002, 07:26 PM

Hello Rusty,

Good to see other Canadian collectors on the forum....

To check for police use of your LUGER: look carefully at the proofmarks on the right side of the receiver. POLICE issue MAUSER LUGERS usually have Eagle L or Eagle C proofs.

Post some PICS if you can....

And remember the grandfathering laws ( Section 12(6) L.A.F. )for registration of that prohibited handgun....You can send me a private email for legal info....

kidvett [img]wink.gif[/img]

5xchamp · 07-26-2002, 05:51 PM

5xchamp · 07-26-2002, 05:54 PM

Looks like I didn't fiqure it out. Darn, will have to wait until I return Aug. 6

ccmano · 07-28-2002, 11:14 AM

Let's see if this works...

wterrell · 07-28-2002, 12:02 PM

5xchamp,

Could only puzzle out the mistakes on these three pics. In order to avoid 'typos' and case mistakes, I usually copy and paste the upload url to my clipboard after the pic has been transferred to the forum site.
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

5xchamp · 08-06-2002, 02:49 PM

Hi everyone, second time trying more successfull. Hope this will help answer questions from my previous posting.

Does the S/N 165, with no lettering mean that this luger was the 165th off the production line for model and year?

Wonder what the upper case K signifies and whether it's a Police issue? Appreciate any information you can help me with. I'm out of the office for a week and unfortunately can't reply until I return. Thanks Rusty B

Doubs · 08-06-2002, 04:24 PM

5xchamp, the shot of the front of the frame clearly shows that the serial number is 165m. Note the lower case "m" beneath the number.

Your pictures are very good.

Garfield · 08-06-2002, 06:04 PM

Unless my eyes have REALLY gone bad it looks to me as though the serial # is 162 in the m suffix.

Doubs · 08-06-2002, 06:09 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Garfield:
<strong>Unless my eyes have REALLY gone bad it looks to me as though the serial # is 162 in the m suffix.</strong><hr></blockquote>

You have the eyes of a cat, Garfield! I've been betrayed by a rebellious typing finger.

<img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />

Lonnie Zimmerman · 08-07-2002, 12:09 AM

The M on the gun are the initials of a German inspector. They are also on P.38"s. I believe it is intertwined with an R. I have a BYF 43 P.38 with the same mark
Lonnie

Lonnie Zimmerman · 08-07-2002, 12:12 AM

MY MISTAKE!! It is RW.
Lonnie

John Sabato · 08-07-2002, 12:53 PM

[quote] The M on the gun are the initials of a German inspector. <hr></blockquote>

Lonnie, I presume you are speaking of the mark under the toggle (shown circled in red in my photo) rather than the 'm' suffix letter on the frame...

Am I correct?

and does anyone know who inspector "RW" might have been?

kidvett · 08-07-2002, 12:53 PM

Hi Rusty,

Check your message box.....

kidvett [img]cool.gif[/img]

Lonnie Zimmerman · 08-07-2002, 06:35 PM

John; yes; that is the M I meant. His name was Rudolf(?) Weiss. He was there before the war started until at least 1944.
Lonnie

Stu · 08-07-2002, 07:03 PM

An interesting coincidence; this same question came up on the P38 forum and a well respected member there had this to say;

Hello Orv,
I hate to contradict. But this stamp was often misinterpreted as the initials of an inspector. It should read "WR" and stands for "Werksrevision".
Dieter.

The stamps depicted are identical but the P38 is on an SVW45 French P38.

Always interesting to get the different opinions going !

Lonnie Zimmerman · 08-07-2002, 07:40 PM

My information came from Buxton"s, vol. 3. I was interested because I have a BYF 43 Mauser (P.38) that has this mark on the locking block. Did the fellow who disputed this say where his information came from?
Lonnie

07-16-2002, 10:19 AM	#1
5xchamp User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	WWWII Bring Back Hi, just new to the forum and what a comprehensive forum it is. Now have a better understanding of what type of WWWII luger my uncle had willed to me. A 1940 Mauser Banner model 42, has as "M" on the front of the frame just below the barrel and two "M"s on the rear toggle link. Military proofs on right of reciver and left & right proofs on barrel. Also eagle/swastika on breech block. The S/N is 165 with no other lettering except for an upper case K found on the frame hidden under the left side pistol grip. Does the S/N 165, with no lettering mean that this luger was the 165th off the production line for model and year? Wonder what the upper case K signifies and whether it's a Police issue? Appreciate any information you can help me with. Thanks Rusty B.

07-16-2002, 12:02 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	Hello Rusty, welcome to the forum! Is it possible to either scan in the Luger or take some close digital photos of it? Do you know which proofs it has on it and can tell us from the markings pages on your left? I too have a 42 / 1940 and there were approx 150,000 made. So under the barrel the serial number is 165 and through the gun there should be the last two digits on many parts. I think others would be interested in the M's that you see and esp would like to see them scanned in if possible. Is there a story on how your uncle aquired the pistol? I myself am very interested in that aspect and slowly am putting together a booklet on guns brought back by uncles, dads etc. If you go to your left, you can get sheets where you can write down all the proofs and markings. Use this page for markings and telling us what they look like: http://www.lugerforum.com/lugermarkings.html and this is the ID sheet area: http://www.lugerforum.com/IDsheets.html Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

07-16-2002, 06:44 PM	#4
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	Hey Rusty that would be great, you can just send me a private message and it'll hit my e-mail. __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

07-28-2002, 12:02 PM	#9
wterrell User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,096 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	5xchamp, Could only puzzle out the mistakes on these three pics. In order to avoid 'typos' and case mistakes, I usually copy and paste the upload url to my clipboard after the pic has been transferred to the forum site. <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" /> __________________ Noli me vocare, ego te vocabo, wes --------------------

08-07-2002, 12:09 AM	#14
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	The M on the gun are the initials of a German inspector. They are also on P.38"s. I believe it is intertwined with an R. I have a BYF 43 P.38 with the same mark Lonnie __________________ Lonnie Zimmerman

07-16-2002, 04:31 PM	#3
5xchamp User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi Ed, there is a story that goes with the luger and I can provide pictures and more info. on markings. It will take me a few days to get back as my Aunt still has the luger. Not a problem though will take pictures with a digital camera at her place. I'm in the process of obtaining a licence to take possession. Thanks Rusty B.

07-16-2002, 07:26 PM	#5
kidvett User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 584 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Hello Rusty, Good to see other Canadian collectors on the forum.... To check for police use of your LUGER: look carefully at the proofmarks on the right side of the receiver. POLICE issue MAUSER LUGERS usually have Eagle L or Eagle C proofs. Post some PICS if you can.... And remember the grandfathering laws ( Section 12(6) L.A.F. )for registration of that prohibited handgun....You can send me a private email for legal info.... kidvett [img]wink.gif[/img]

07-26-2002, 05:51 PM	#6
5xchamp User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

07-26-2002, 05:54 PM	#7
5xchamp User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Looks like I didn't fiqure it out. Darn, will have to wait until I return Aug. 6

07-28-2002, 11:14 AM	#8
ccmano User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Denver Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Let's see if this works...

08-06-2002, 02:49 PM	#10
5xchamp User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi everyone, second time trying more successfull. Hope this will help answer questions from my previous posting. Does the S/N 165, with no lettering mean that this luger was the 165th off the production line for model and year? Wonder what the upper case K signifies and whether it's a Police issue? Appreciate any information you can help me with. I'm out of the office for a week and unfortunately can't reply until I return. Thanks Rusty B

08-06-2002, 04:24 PM	#11
Doubs User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Byron, Georgia Posts: 1,670 Thanks: 769 Thanked 1,614 Times in 525 Posts	5xchamp, the shot of the front of the frame clearly shows that the serial number is 165m. Note the lower case "m" beneath the number. Your pictures are very good.

08-06-2002, 06:04 PM	#12
Garfield User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A little SE of Nome Posts: 239 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Unless my eyes have REALLY gone bad it looks to me as though the serial # is 162 in the m suffix.

08-06-2002, 06:09 PM	#13
Doubs User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Byron, Georgia Posts: 1,670 Thanks: 769 Thanked 1,614 Times in 525 Posts	[quote]Originally posted by Garfield: <strong>Unless my eyes have REALLY gone bad it looks to me as though the serial # is 162 in the m suffix.</strong><hr></blockquote> You have the eyes of a cat, Garfield! I've been betrayed by a rebellious typing finger. <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />

08-07-2002, 12:12 AM	#15
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	MY MISTAKE!! It is RW. Lonnie __________________ Lonnie Zimmerman

08-07-2002, 12:53 PM	#16
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	[quote] The M on the gun are the initials of a German inspector. <hr></blockquote> Lonnie, I presume you are speaking of the mark under the toggle (shown circled in red in my photo) rather than the 'm' suffix letter on the frame... Am I correct? and does anyone know who inspector "RW" might have been? __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

08-07-2002, 06:35 PM	#18
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	John; yes; that is the M I meant. His name was Rudolf(?) Weiss. He was there before the war started until at least 1944. Lonnie __________________ Lonnie Zimmerman

08-07-2002, 07:03 PM	#19
Stu User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Atlanta GA Posts: 451 Thanks: 4 Thanked 25 Times in 16 Posts	An interesting coincidence; this same question came up on the P38 forum and a well respected member there had this to say; Hello Orv, I hate to contradict. But this stamp was often misinterpreted as the initials of an inspector. It should read "WR" and stands for "Werksrevision". Dieter. The stamps depicted are identical but the P38 is on an SVW45 French P38. Always interesting to get the different opinions going !

08-07-2002, 07:40 PM	#20
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	My information came from Buxton"s, vol. 3. I was interested because I have a BYF 43 Mauser (P.38) that has this mark on the locking block. Did the fellow who disputed this say where his information came from? Lonnie __________________ Lonnie Zimmerman