KrauseWerke .45 Caliber Luger

lfid · 03-29-2007, 01:26 AM

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=68787257

interesting auction

enjoy
Bill

Sieger · 03-29-2007, 01:32 PM

Hi All:

I'm wondering if anyone out there in Luger land actually owns and shoots on of these?

If would be a lot of fun to really study and develop proper loads for one of these.

Sieger

tracyp · 03-29-2007, 05:49 PM

Maybe we should have another poll. Which would you rather have, a KrauseWerke .45 or one of the new reproduction Krieghoffs? They are about the same price. I'd take the .45

Tracy

Navy · 03-29-2007, 08:40 PM

I'd opt for the Krieg...they are a finite commodity.

Tom A

Ron Wood · 03-29-2007, 09:07 PM

I would opt for the Krause .45...and did.

Dwight Gruber · 03-29-2007, 09:14 PM

As soon as someone admits to buying one of the Krieghoffs we need a complete manufacturing characteristics report...

--Dwight

Sieger · 03-30-2007, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron Wood
I would opt for the Krause .45...and did.

Dear Ron:

It's a reproduction if made after 1918!

Do you shoot your masterpiece or do you just admire it?

I saw a surviving original DWM .45 displayed at a Gun Show in Lakeland Florida in 1986 or so. I actually was allowed to handle it. I understand that Mike used this actual pistol to reverse engineer his modern creation.

I'd love to handel one and actually shoot one. Oh well, perhaps in my next life.

As to the Krieghoff and Krause question, I'd vote for the Krause. After all, the Krieghoff is simply the recreation of a common P-08, whereas the Krause is a recreation of a rare masterpiece.

Sieger

Ron Wood · 03-30-2007, 01:32 AM

Bob,
So far it is just an object of admiration. Perhaps someday I will launch a few rounds, but right now I am content to let it rest comfortably as a display piece since it is a repro (and an expensive one at that!).

Lugerdoc · 03-30-2007, 09:54 AM

Ron, I'd be interested in learning your firing results. For what I've heard, neither the original M1907 .45 or Mike's repro of it, were designed to function well with US .45 loads. TH

Pete Ebbink · 03-30-2007, 12:20 PM

Doc,

Didn't the Harry Jones family shoot 150 or so rounds through one of the .45 Lugers back in 1960...the one that ended up in the Norton Gallery collection ?

If I am not mistaken, those rounds were Rem-USA .45 bullets.

tracyp · 03-30-2007, 12:28 PM

Ron,

Could you post some pictures of your Krause 45? Does anyone own a Krause Baby Luger?

Tracy

Sieger · 03-30-2007, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lugerdoc
Ron, I'd be interested in learning your firing results. For what I've heard, neither the original M1907 .45 or Mike's repro of it, were designed to function well with US .45 loads. TH

Hi:

I remember reading that Luger had to make specially loaded DWM .45 ammo available for the U.S. Army trials. In fact, this was one of the objections of the testing board, that special ammo was needed and that the powder loaded in those cartridges was not available to the U.S. market from DWM.

As to the Krause Lugers functioning with "regular" .45 American ammo, I can't see the .45 model being anymore forgiving as to its ammo than its 9mm and 7.65 cousins. I'm sure the AOL and powder charge variables would be just as critical with the .45 design.

Sieger

Sieger · 03-30-2007, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron Wood
Bob,
So far it is just an object of admiration. Perhaps someday I will launch a few rounds, but right now I am content to let it rest comfortably as a display piece since it is a repro (and an expensive one at that!).

Ron:

You must be a stronger man than I am, as I just couldn't resist putting this little treasure though its paces.

Sieger

Sieger · 03-30-2007, 11:34 PM

Hi:

Yes, I have that magazine here somewhere. They even had to repair the little critter a bit in the firing pin region, I do recall.

Seems to me that they had no problem with off of the shelf .45 U.S. Military surplus ammo. I think two magazines were shot through it.

Sieger

The Wizard · 04-07-2007, 02:46 PM

I have a Krausewerk New Model Luger Automatic Pistol caliber .45 ACP, serial number 10 and I have shot it. It is more of a single shot pistol than a magazine feed semi-automatic. Did not do much trouble shooting but I think that the magazine springs outside diameter is too large and binds inside the magazine. only put seven rounds through it.

lugerholsterrepair · 04-07-2007, 02:50 PM

Douglas, How was the accuracy? Jerry Burney from Salida CO.

Sieger · 04-07-2007, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Wizard
I have a Krausewerk New Model Luger Automatic Pistol caliber .45 ACP, serial number 10 and I have shot it. It is more of a single shot pistol than a magazine feed semi-automatic. Did not do much trouble shooting but I think that the magazine springs outside diameter is too large and binds inside the magazine. only put seven rounds through it.

Dear Wizard:

Wow, I would have thought that little problems like the one you describe would have been addressed and taken care of at the factory!!

To me, this is an unforgivable blunder, especially at these prices!!

I had a similar problem with a Winchester 1886 Rifle recreation I purchased just a few years ago. Here, the rifle wouldn't fire reliably, because the mainspring was too weak. The factory was clueless, but I fixed the problem by replacing the spring with one out of an original Model 71 Winchester. They were astonished!!

To me, it is amazing the level of incompetence that seems to reign in the world of engineering now a days!!

Sieger

Edward Tinker · 04-07-2007, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pete Ebbink
Doc,

Didn't the Harry Jones family shoot 150 or so rounds through one of the .45 Lugers back in 1960...the one that ended up in the Norton Gallery collection ?

If I am not mistaken, those rounds were Rem-USA .45 bullets.

I have one of the spent cartridges shot through the 45 Luger, with a letter from Mike Jones attesting to it being original.

Ed

The Wizard · 04-07-2007, 07:19 PM

Didn't really think about the accuracy. I was think about if it was going to function. I should have known something was wrong when loading the magazine was really hard. And when it failed to feed I just wanted to unload the magazine. I did consider talking to Krausewerk about the problem but my life got real complicated and I just didn't have time to deal with it. Any advice about how to handle the problem would be reviewed. Got to say it is ONE FINE LOOKING PISTOL!!!!!!!!!! If it shot it would be perfect.

Pete Ebbink · 04-07-2007, 07:20 PM

TAC,

FYI...the Krause retail gun shop in San Mateo, CA has a sizeable machine shop below the retail shop...along the ground floor. Krausewerk occupies a 2-story L-shaped apartment building, built in the 1950's or 1960's that was converted to his gun/trade business. I would guess the original apartment building had 15-18 units, originally.

I would guestimate that the machine shop and storage areas have 8,000 sq. ft. or so and looks like it is a full service machine shop for the gun trade. Other machinist(s) work along side Krause as well.

Considering several if not many .45 Luger pistols and .32 ACP Baby Lugers have been made by Krausewerk since the 1980's...it may be considered a 'factory'...IMO.

03-29-2007, 01:26 AM	#1
lfid Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wichita, KS USA Posts: 453 Thanks: 573 Thanked 96 Times in 53 Posts	KrauseWerke .45 Caliber Luger http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=68787257 interesting auction enjoy Bill

03-29-2007, 01:32 PM	#2
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,575 Thanks: 2,124 Thanked 400 Times in 249 Posts	.45 Luger Hi All: I'm wondering if anyone out there in Luger land actually owns and shoots on of these? If would be a lot of fun to really study and develop proper loads for one of these. Sieger

03-29-2007, 09:07 PM	#5
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	I would opt for the Krause .45...and did. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

03-30-2007, 01:32 AM	#8
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	Bob, So far it is just an object of admiration. Perhaps someday I will launch a few rounds, but right now I am content to let it rest comfortably as a display piece since it is a repro (and an expensive one at that!). __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

03-30-2007, 09:54 AM	#9
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Ron, I'd be interested in learning your firing results. For what I've heard, neither the original M1907 .45 or Mike's repro of it, were designed to function well with US .45 loads. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

03-29-2007, 05:49 PM	#3
tracyp User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Peoples Republic of Kalifornia Posts: 391 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Maybe we should have another poll. Which would you rather have, a KrauseWerke .45 or one of the new reproduction Krieghoffs? They are about the same price. I'd take the .45 Tracy

03-29-2007, 08:40 PM	#4
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	I'd opt for the Krieg...they are a finite commodity. Tom A

03-29-2007, 09:14 PM	#6
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,889 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,281 Times in 423 Posts	As soon as someone admits to buying one of the Krieghoffs we need a complete manufacturing characteristics report... --Dwight

03-30-2007, 12:20 PM	#10
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Doc, Didn't the Harry Jones family shoot 150 or so rounds through one of the .45 Lugers back in 1960...the one that ended up in the Norton Gallery collection ? If I am not mistaken, those rounds were Rem-USA .45 bullets.

03-30-2007, 12:28 PM	#11
tracyp User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Peoples Republic of Kalifornia Posts: 391 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Ron, Could you post some pictures of your Krause 45? Does anyone own a Krause Baby Luger? Tracy

03-30-2007, 11:34 PM	#14
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,575 Thanks: 2,124 Thanked 400 Times in 249 Posts	.45 Luger Shooting Hi: Yes, I have that magazine here somewhere. They even had to repair the little critter a bit in the firing pin region, I do recall. Seems to me that they had no problem with off of the shelf .45 U.S. Military surplus ammo. I think two magazines were shot through it. Sieger

04-07-2007, 02:46 PM	#15
The Wizard User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado Posts: 67 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I have a Krausewerk New Model Luger Automatic Pistol caliber .45 ACP, serial number 10 and I have shot it. It is more of a single shot pistol than a magazine feed semi-automatic. Did not do much trouble shooting but I think that the magazine springs outside diameter is too large and binds inside the magazine. only put seven rounds through it. __________________ The Wizard Air Dropable AND Ground Recoverable Necat omnes! Deus suos agnoscet. The application of the proper amount of high explosives can solve any problem. War is an act of force and to the application of that force there is no limit! So say the philosophers (Carl von Clausewitz b 1780 d 1831) of war.

04-07-2007, 02:50 PM	#16
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Douglas, How was the accuracy? Jerry Burney from Salida CO. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

04-07-2007, 07:19 PM	#19
The Wizard User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado Posts: 67 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Didn't really think about the accuracy. I was think about if it was going to function. I should have known something was wrong when loading the magazine was really hard. And when it failed to feed I just wanted to unload the magazine. I did consider talking to Krausewerk about the problem but my life got real complicated and I just didn't have time to deal with it. Any advice about how to handle the problem would be reviewed. Got to say it is ONE FINE LOOKING PISTOL!!!!!!!!!! If it shot it would be perfect. __________________ The Wizard Air Dropable AND Ground Recoverable Necat omnes! Deus suos agnoscet. The application of the proper amount of high explosives can solve any problem. War is an act of force and to the application of that force there is no limit! So say the philosophers (Carl von Clausewitz b 1780 d 1831) of war.

04-07-2007, 07:20 PM	#20
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	TAC, FYI...the Krause retail gun shop in San Mateo, CA has a sizeable machine shop below the retail shop...along the ground floor. Krausewerk occupies a 2-story L-shaped apartment building, built in the 1950's or 1960's that was converted to his gun/trade business. I would guess the original apartment building had 15-18 units, originally. I would guestimate that the machine shop and storage areas have 8,000 sq. ft. or so and looks like it is a full service machine shop for the gun trade. Other machinist(s) work along side Krause as well. Considering several if not many .45 Luger pistols and .32 ACP Baby Lugers have been made by Krausewerk since the 1980's...it may be considered a 'factory'...IMO.