1903 Springfield Armory tests

08-10-2001, 06:31 PM

In the recent past, I examined an interesting Luger which I suspect was involved in the July 1903 US tests at Springfield Armory. It is an old model, dished toggles, long frame with a 4 3/4 " fat 9mm barrel. It has about 60% of well used original finish but is in perfect mechanical condition otherwise with a quite good bore. The serial number is in the 10000B prototype series and is 10028B. There are no markings anywhere except for the all matching serial numbers in the commerical manner and the DWM script on top of the toggle. The number 28 on the grip safety has been engraved rather then stamped.

It is stated in a letter dated July 2, 1903 by Colonel Frank H. Phipps (I really can't read the spelling of the last name), Ord. Dept. that 3 pistols were used with 3 different barrel lengths - 3 7/8, 4 11/16, and 5 13/16 - in order to test the different velocities from each barrel. I suspect that 10028B may be the 4 11/16 inch example. Two other examples in existance, 10030B, 4 3/4" barrel and 10031B 5 7/8 " barrel have also been tied to the trials by letters from Springfield Armory which came along with 10030B when it was purchased from the Armory many years ago. Could the 3 guns have had back-ups?

I have only seen photos of 10030B and it appears in rather fine condition, unlike a gun which had been vigorously tested. Maybe 10030B has been refinished. Anyone know? Any comments on 10028B's participation in the trials would be greatly appreciated.

Ciao,

Bill S. (ALFA2NINE@aol.com)

Johnny Peppers · 08-10-2001, 10:56 PM

I believe that by this time the decision had been made that the .30 Luger cartridge was inadequate for a sidearm, and the 9mm was in development. The different barrel lengths were ordered to test the effects of barrel length on the 9mm cartridge.

The 10000 range serial numbers contain many interesting pistols both in the ns and B suffix pistols. A friend of mine owns serial number 10031 (no B suffix) which has a 7" barrel and standard sights. The pistol is complete with the matching number stock and the original holster.

08-11-2001, 12:20 AM

John,

I also have examined a Commerical 1900 serial number 10007(no B) which is a standard sight, 7 inch 1900 in 7.65. It seems at commerical number 10000 a small number, (around 50?), of the 7 inch 1900s were manufactured which were the first Lugers to have a detachable shoulder stock. Some had standard sights and some had adjustable rear sights similar to the prototype carbine. The stocks were of the early screw tightening design. These are in the commerical serial number range and are not strictly prototypes with the capital B. It seems that DWM had a special affinity with the number 10000, as in the prototype 10000B series, so maybe they wanted to make something special when they reached 10000 commerically.

These do not impact on the tests at Springfield Armory. I still would like any information on 10028B if anyone can help.

Johnny Peppers · 08-11-2001, 10:50 AM

In the 9100 range there were some carbines built with a C suffix, and then the numbers jump to the 10000 range with a C suffix rather than the B.

08-10-2001, 06:31 PM	#1
Bill S. Guest Posts: n/a	1903 Springfield Armory tests In the recent past, I examined an interesting Luger which I suspect was involved in the July 1903 US tests at Springfield Armory. It is an old model, dished toggles, long frame with a 4 3/4 " fat 9mm barrel. It has about 60% of well used original finish but is in perfect mechanical condition otherwise with a quite good bore. The serial number is in the 10000B prototype series and is 10028B. There are no markings anywhere except for the all matching serial numbers in the commerical manner and the DWM script on top of the toggle. The number 28 on the grip safety has been engraved rather then stamped. It is stated in a letter dated July 2, 1903 by Colonel Frank H. Phipps (I really can't read the spelling of the last name), Ord. Dept. that 3 pistols were used with 3 different barrel lengths - 3 7/8, 4 11/16, and 5 13/16 - in order to test the different velocities from each barrel. I suspect that 10028B may be the 4 11/16 inch example. Two other examples in existance, 10030B, 4 3/4" barrel and 10031B 5 7/8 " barrel have also been tied to the trials by letters from Springfield Armory which came along with 10030B when it was purchased from the Armory many years ago. Could the 3 guns have had back-ups? I have only seen photos of 10030B and it appears in rather fine condition, unlike a gun which had been vigorously tested. Maybe 10030B has been refinished. Anyone know? Any comments on 10028B's participation in the trials would be greatly appreciated. Ciao, Bill S. (ALFA2NINE@aol.com)

08-10-2001, 10:56 PM	#2
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: 1903 Springfield Armory tests I believe that by this time the decision had been made that the .30 Luger cartridge was inadequate for a sidearm, and the 9mm was in development. The different barrel lengths were ordered to test the effects of barrel length on the 9mm cartridge. The 10000 range serial numbers contain many interesting pistols both in the ns and B suffix pistols. A friend of mine owns serial number 10031 (no B suffix) which has a 7" barrel and standard sights. The pistol is complete with the matching number stock and the original holster.

08-11-2001, 12:20 AM	#3
Bill S. Guest Posts: n/a	Re: 1903 Springfield Armory tests John, I also have examined a Commerical 1900 serial number 10007(no B) which is a standard sight, 7 inch 1900 in 7.65. It seems at commerical number 10000 a small number, (around 50?), of the 7 inch 1900s were manufactured which were the first Lugers to have a detachable shoulder stock. Some had standard sights and some had adjustable rear sights similar to the prototype carbine. The stocks were of the early screw tightening design. These are in the commerical serial number range and are not strictly prototypes with the capital B. It seems that DWM had a special affinity with the number 10000, as in the prototype 10000B series, so maybe they wanted to make something special when they reached 10000 commerically. These do not impact on the tests at Springfield Armory. I still would like any information on 10028B if anyone can help.

08-11-2001, 10:50 AM	#4
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: 1903 Springfield Armory tests In the 9100 range there were some carbines built with a C suffix, and then the numbers jump to the 10000 range with a C suffix rather than the B.