Reproduction Snail Drum - progress

[KABAR2]

Originally Posted by G.T.

BTW, in looking over the pictures again, the problem may be the mag release button?... Remove it from the frame, and see if the mag fits unimpeded.... It looks like that, more so than frame issues?..... Also, there is considerable variance in the P.08 mag catch parts as well.... just a thought....GT....

GT,

That was one of the things I did remove the mag release.... Made no difference ended up doing a combination of things

1) miked Luger mag and snail drum nose to have a base line as to clearance
2) squeezed drum nose as suggested this also widened it slightly front to rear so it began binding in new areas
3) smoked mag to see where it was binding
4) stoned polished top area of mag well
5) sanded polished round part of the mag nose
6) sanded polished back corners of top of mag
7) noted some small bit of galling on roll crimp rib at top edge light filing/polishing also polished slot in mag well

What this accomplished was allowing mag to seat and lock up with mag release function tested with 4 dummy rounds worked fine, mag is tight but with firm grip pulls out don't need a mallet to remove it 🙂 ..... I may do a little more polishing after a little range time .... One area that had some high spots/dimples was in the relieved rounded inside part of the mag well these were caused when the front strap was stamped with unit markings these dimples actually had rubmarks from magazines.... So I took these down with a half round needle file will add some photo's when I get time at the computer

Here are the added photo's for this thread:











Success!

[cirelaw]

Genius!!!

[KABAR2]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

They look like nice pictures. It's a shame that future members of this forum will never see them.

Fixed photo's they are now onsite rather than an independent photo host

[KABAR2]

There was one pleasant surprise..... it actually had the "B-slash-N" mark hiding under the lever..... which seems to be missing in all the photo's I have seen of this reproduction mag.





Also I have added photo's to the mag fitting that I described above......

[DonVoigt]

Good work, now the fun starts!

[Eugen]

Kabar2, nice work, photos and report! I hope the rest of us waiting for a GT revised drum don't have to go through that drama. But, if we do we will have your road map.

[KABAR2]

Originally Posted by Eugen

Kabar2, nice work, photos and report! I hope the rest of us waiting for a GT revised drum don't have to go through that drama. But, if we do we will have your road map.

Thanks in past years on gun builders forums I have written on the builds as they progressed.... one build was a semi-auto 1919A6 and another was an AK47 45 caliber carbine using the mag feed way from a demilled Thompson trigger group and Thompson magazines.... so I guess I'm used to doing it with pictures and text in the photo's ..... hopefully those thinking of purchasing one of these drums isn't put off by my experience, remember GT stands behind his work and is there to help.... I was impressed with the drum, I have handled a couple of original drums and this reproduction feels good and solid... whoever made these tried to get it right & GT brought them the rest of the way.... the only thing he can't control is how each Luger to Magazine fits..... but even that can be fixed if your willing to try....

[G.T.]

Hi to all! Well, we've been pretty busy at the Tomek house over the last three months, with doctors, therapy, and hospitals, but I have found some time in the last few days to get back on task on the Numrich drums! As I mentioned before, I have 35 units for Numrich and 5 for customers that are currently undergoing revision and improvements.... I have decided that the very first task in the revision process, to be the most demanding one, and that is the relocation of the magazine catch notch.... It requires welding the notch closed, (.404" brass rod wedged in to retain internal radius, and as a heat soak) Then, I have to jig the drum up in a horizontal mill and cut the outside radius back to stock, then, I have to hand file and sand the radius to it's final dimension, then, I have to cut the top of the mag catch to the correct height, then, I have to plunge cut with a .250" to cut the curved part of the notch... then, I have to clean up the transition with a dremel tool.... I am at the plunge cut stage on all of them! but if you add up the opps at 6 X 40... I handle the drums 240 times! And, that isn't even the half of that parts revision.... Soooo, we're moving slow, but we're moving!.... And we are also trying hard to make every effort to improve every part of these things..... The main reason for the order of revision, is I have to have enough units to afford to have the batch re-black oxide coated.... So sometimes it seems I can't get there from here, but every day is a new start and new challenge!
On the other side, my grand daughter has fully recovered, we are blessed and convinced prayers do work! Carols recovery is considerably more difficult, and we are concerned about long term, both as in regard to mobility, and of course, just dealing with a lifetime of pain..... But, we are alive, and still going! (looks like pretty tough to stop us!) Best to all, and my life long gratitude to the members!.....til....lat'r....GT

[G.T.]

Hi to all, Well, finally got the mag catch notches cut and also the friction traps cut out of the shell interiors... and the current batch just went to the Black Oxide shop! When I dropped off my meager number of mag shells, I saw barrels and barrels of magazine shells from a major mag manufacture... The place I took my stuff to says he does over 2.2 million magazine shells a year for several major vendors?... While I was there I saw about 10 50 gal drums full of M1 carbine 30 round mag shells in the white... I told the owner I wished I owned his place and the mag manufactures place as well?..... He said, carful for what you wish for.... ... Anyway, with some recent trial and error efforts, I have been able to reduce the labor per mag from ludicrous to just ridiculous!!!! Polish internally seems to be the key... still... I am still trying different combinations of lube and any other idea I can think of to reduce friction... going to 400 W/D on this bunch, we shall see?.... Best to all, til.....lat'r....GT

[Edward Tinker]

GT, I need to send your snap caps back.

GT does stand behind his work, always has and always will

My magazine makes for a nice display ey?

[Eugen]

Originally Posted by Edward Tinker

My magazine makes for a nice display ey?

Yes, Tink, that rig is drool worthy for sure!
Thanks for making us all terminally jealous. LOL

[Lugerdoc]

Ed, Your photo reminded me of a 1930s Jimmy Cagney movie, where he was the bad guy with a full auto luger carbine with a drum. just another Hollywood error. I wonder how the new Trommel mags would function with 30 luger ammo? TH

[lugerholsterrepair]

I wonder how the new Trommell mags would function with 30 Luger ammo? TH Tom, I was asked that by George Fortier several years back so I loaded up a drum, stepped out to the pistol range beside my leather shop and let er rip. Worked just like 9MM.

[Vlim]

Just a thought. In the line of a possible ban on magazines with a capacity of more than 20 rounds in the European Union: would it be possible to re-engineer a drum mag to a maximum of 20 rounds?

[lugerholsterrepair]

Gerben, I think it would be very simple. Open up the drum and weld in a stop at 20. Might hinder the wind up to lock in though..GT would know.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by Vlim

Just a thought. In the line of a possible ban on magazines with a capacity of more than 20 rounds in the European Union: would it be possible to re-engineer a drum mag to a maximum of 20 rounds?

As Jerry said, a fairly "easy" mod; instead of a block, I would extend the arm to limit the space for the rounds. Add a curved section to the "pusher" area.

Then the Arm would lock into the original location of the button latch.

Number of rounds markings would be incorrect, though they could be "fixed" with some more effort.

[G.T.]

Don is correct, I believe all you would have to do is add a curved spacer that is welded to the internal swing arm of the correct dimensions to take up the 12 rounds not needed... One might need to also fashion a stop tab on the extended arm to combat over rotation of the spacer addition?... Basically an L shaped pad on the end.... ...GT

[lugerholsterrepair]

GT..better file a patent!

[G.T.]

Hello to all! I've really been busy with the drum revisions lately, and with the latest batches, I am confident that they will hold up, and feed as required.... I've found that there is no such thing as smooth enough.... and interior (bullet path only!) polishing is still the biggest and most important improvement challenge...
If you use WW white box 115 gr. the only malfunctions that still linger from time to time, is the occasional "smoke stack " or "stovepipe" stoppages on empty casings?... It is a combination of... weak extractors, and / or, slow bullet advancement in the drum... It can change from string to string on just ammo deviations... BUT, if your luger ain't perfect mechanically... it's probably going to jam occasionally... If you use the wrong ammo.. it will jam every time!!! ... Sooooo, I have been sending them 6 drums a week/ 2 week period, and will do so for another 24 units.... I have revised 28 so far... They are listed in NUMRICH's as a G.T. Edition.... ... I will stand behind any drum with the GT on it! I really want these things to work for all of you! .... BTW, it is getting better as we go along.. I am always learning.. and there is always another way to "get it done!".... best to all, til.,..lat'r....GT

[G.T.]

Hi to all, well, I've been sending 6 GT marked drums and loaders a week back to NUMRICH for sale, but as of yet, had little interest, or feedback, or both?.... But, no problem, time will tell if we were successful or not on the revisions performed... I have found thru testing, that if there is a weak point on your Luger, the drum will bring it out fast! ........Most definitely, if your Luger has a weak extractor spring, failure to eject, and smoke stack, stove pipe jams are going to be the norm... A rounded extractor nose will show the same problems??.. The drums I've sent out, are all now lubricated with red tacky grease... pretty much like all the originals I've cleaned and re-lubed... Dry lubes will probably work fine, and are a lot less mess, but the grease works and is easy to clean out and change if desired.. bottom line, lube of some type is required... One thing, if loaded with commercial ammo, the grease can, and probably will kill the primers?? It has on some of the live test rounds I used repeatedly... But, the most important BOTTOM LINE, is you're going to have jams!! Mostly failure to eject! BE CARFULL!!!! Safety first, STOP, WAIT,and then, clear the jam.. Its a thought process thing.. you learn it fast when things go wrong all of the time!!! I'm certainly not here to preach, as most of you have far more experience than I, but I would feel pretty sad if someone got hurt messing with items I've had a hand in repairing! Best to all, and let's hear about the success and or failure of our quest!... Best to all, til...lat'r....GT