Are these original byf bakelite grips?

[Quentin]

I think these are original bakelite grips, how do they look to you guys?

I'm fairly certain they are original, the inside surfaces don't look like modern plastic. And when rub my thumb
against the inside to warm the surface, I do notice a musty smell. The material inside looks like what was used
for old pot handles or distributor rotors.

Hopefully these pictures show enough detail.

I don't see any markings inside but the eyes don't focus up close anymore!

Thanks!

Bob

[Dante Di Pietro Jr.]

I would say they are original

[ChannelIsles]

Hi Bob,
I observe the two 'o' appearing on the reverse middle of the right grip as shown.
Earlier threads have supported these markings as original 'byf' '41.
Brendan

[Steinar]

Looks original to me

[HerbZ]

Were these black Bakelite plastic grips only put on the byf 41 as original factory grips?

If on a byf 42, would that be only as replacement grips and never an original?

[Steinar]

I'm not sure what you mean by your first question.. But the bakelite grips where added as a lack of wood and resources in mid 1941, so any 41 or 42 byf made after that period can be issued with bakelite grips.

Btw. I'm glad this thread so far is without the 'B.. W.. '-term. If it does, I will be start calling my byf42 'Pink Panter' from the colour on the 'Gesichert'

[Dante Di Pietro Jr.]

Steinar why is your safety marking pink! mines off white. Maybe yours belonged to a female member of the German armed forces. a rare variation!

[HerbZ]

I think you've answered both my questions. If what you mean is that these plastic grips were used as original grips on both bfy 41 & 42 pistols when first issued. I was concerned that finding such grips on a byf 42 could only mean that they were not what was originally issued and would've been a replacement.

Uh, it's my understanding that the B- W- term was the marketing ploy of one individual but that it has become the generally accepted nomenclature for these pistols ever since.

[Steinar]

Originally posted by Dante Di Pietro Jr.
Steinar why is your safety marking pink! mines off white. Maybe yours belonged to a female member of the German armed forces. a rare variation!

Yes, pink! Probably a super rare female SS variation..
-or the previous owner has been in his wifes makeup set, picking up the pink nail colour. Any way.. what is that stuff made of!? I have soaked it in normal solvent without luck

[HerbZ]

Try Birchwood Casey Gun Solvent/Degreaser, it'll remove just about anything on gun metal that was applied cold, with the possible exception of cold bluing.

[Quentin]

Originally posted by ChannelIsles
Hi Bob,
I observe the two 'o' appearing on the reverse middle of the right grip as shown.
Earlier threads have supported these markings as original 'byf' '41.
Brendan

Thanks for that info Brendan! I'll have to search for those threads.

And you are right, these grips are from my '41. So the "O" is rarer on '42 byfs?

[Quentin]

Originally posted by HerbZ
I think you've answered both my questions. If what you mean is that these plastic grips were used as original grips on both bfy 41 & 42 pistols when first issued. I was concerned that finding such grips on a byf 42 could only mean that they were not what was originally issued and would've been a replacement.

Uh, it's my understanding that the B- W- term was the marketing ploy of one individual but that it has become the generally accepted nomenclature for these pistols ever since.

HerbZ, yes the black (and brown) plastic grips were original issue for many but not all '41 and '42 byfs. Some of course came with wood grips.

And I believe you're correct about that term, too. Funny how something so trivial adds to the mystique and value of these Lugers! Also the plastic grips, though they were produced in hundreds of thousands, definitely are rare today. Probably a large part of that is so many people hated them and replaced them with wood to make their Luger "look like a Luger". And of course the material is somewhat fragile so many broken ones were replaced. Anyway, for many reasons bakelite grips are desireable now. I think more highly of mine than I did when I bought the pistol in 1995. And I remember the price got knocked down a bit because the seller knew I was disappointed in the grips.

[John Sabato]

I would classify these grips as original, based on these photos... take care of them... they seem to go up in price every week.

[Quentin]

Hey thanks everyone for looking. Guess my 41 byf grips are original after all! This byf looks like it was stored away
most of its life. Not much overall wear, very sharp edges with little bluing worn away but there are marks and
pitting here and there. I'd almost swear it's hardly fired, I've never fired it in the ten years I've had it anyway.
Unfortunately the take down lever is dinged up, guess someone didn't know how to field strip the pistol.
Anyway it's probably the nicest Luger I'll ever own. My old shooter gets a lot of use though.


Frank pointed out in another thread that the magazine pictured is post war. I got two magazines with it and the
other one has fxo with 37 under it came with the pistol. I've switched to the fxo now that I know the difference.


Guess it wouldn't hurt to post the images again...

[rttwlrby]

one way to tell if the bakelite grips are original, is to look at the holes on the inside.....they should be threaded, as they were used to hold the screws when shipped.
cheers

[John Sabato]

rttwlrby,

What you state is true, but the Waffenfabrik USA folks have been able to closely duplicate threaded holes in the fakes... it takes a close inspection at high resolution images to be able to tell the fakes from the real thing... technology is our friend ...and our enemy as it becomes more available and cheaper...

What they haven't been able to reproduce (so far!) is the actual material and the affects of age on the material... fake grips look too new to be 60 years + old... and I guess figuring out how to recreate the original material costs more than they are willing to spend... it is much easier to make something close that will fool the unknowledgeable and make a fast buck ( or a couple of hundred) and then slip back under the rock they came out from under...

[grapppa]

These grips look right to me. In addition to the usual things, I look for the tiny 0's on the right grip as well as the fine circular machining marks on the left grip. The finish on the outside of the grips looks right also. You can also do the tap test, that is, tap them together, should have a pitch similar to castinets.