Seven Artillery Lugers for sale

Lugers down under · 02-27-2004, 11:18 PM

If anyone is interested,

There are seven (7) artilleries (PO8 Longe) comming up in auctions here down under in the next six weeks. They range from average to excellent and one is an absolute complete rig all matching and with straps and spare mag pouch.
I will be going to all of the auctions and could go shopping if you can import them into the USA.
Let me know and I will post some details and descriptions. They are mostly 1917 DWM of which we have a large number down here.
The prices will be about two thirds of what you would normally pay. Our dollar is very strong at the moment.
<img border="0" alt="[icon107]" title="" src="graemlins/icon107.gif" />

tudorbug · 02-28-2004, 10:11 AM

I would be interested in one that is excellent and all matched but I have no idea how to jump over the import hurdles. They are probably considerable. Does anyone else know what is involved?

Also, the shipping cost is liable to be considerable, I would think.

Lugers down under · 02-28-2004, 03:44 PM

I dont know about the import hurdles into the USA but there are NONE to get it out of New Zealand.
The Airparcel post and Insurance would be about US$25.00

tudorbug · 02-28-2004, 04:01 PM

Hurdle here would probably occur at United States customs, where it would have to adhere to whatever restrictions, if any, that apply to foreign weapons. Perhaps an import fee and the need to have a certain license.

But, I'm speculating and don't have any experience in this area. I would love to learn tho'.

I am amazed that air shipment might be as inexpensive as US$25, I admit.

Imperial Arms · 02-28-2004, 05:56 PM

Tudorbug,

It is most likely that any LP-08, which are classified as military weapons even though they fall in the category of a curio and relic, would have to be imported into the US by a licensed importer and the pistol would probably have to be stamped with the dealer's import stamp. Import duties into the US are 10%.

Unfortunately, the BATF makes importation of military curio and relics difficult, but that is the bureaucracy which exists in the US.

Albert

tudorbug · 02-28-2004, 06:31 PM

Albert, thanks! This is the sort of hurdle, or one of a sequence of hurdles, that I contemplated having to face.

Pete Ebbink · 02-28-2004, 07:17 PM

Bob and Brad Simpson's shop still offers importation services. Here is a web site link and some info. :

http://www.simpsonltd.com/import_services.htm

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Big Norm · 02-28-2004, 07:20 PM

Luger Down Under,
What about ORIGINAL artillery/navy holsters and stocks with all the leather attachments? How great a varity of dates of manufacture could you find? I don't believe that there would be any problem bringing them into the USA. If the Lugers are gone then the accessories are still good.
Big Norm

Vlim · 02-29-2004, 07:50 AM

An interesting fact is that in either NZ or Australia, the presence of evacuated Dutch lugers may exist as well.

Remember, the Indonesian islands which formed the main area of KNIL presence are just a good rowing distance away

Several Dutch troops, ships and aircraft evacuated towards Australia during 1942, when the japanese were on a winning streak so theoretically there may be some 'dutchies' lurking there.

tudorbug · 02-29-2004, 12:11 PM

Pete, thank you for the link to import services by Simpsons.

Shows it can be done by it is expensive and time consuming and there is a risk, I suppose, that BATF would decline to approve a license.

tudorbug · 02-29-2004, 12:17 PM

Lugers Down Under, I have sent you a private email, when you have time. Thank you.

Imperial Arms · 02-29-2004, 12:47 PM

Tudorbug,

You are correct in mentioning that it would be expensive to import a military LP-08 in the US. It would probably cost $200-$300 for the services of a licensed importer and the 10% US Customs duty. In regards to time, it takes the BATF at least three months to just sign the import application!

I shall tell you something which is surprising. It probably takes 20 minutes to complete the three ATF Form 6 import applications in copy without any fee payable by the (import) dealer which he charges $200+ for this type of simple paperwork! Capitalism at its finest!

If the Luger was a commercial model, then any dealer such as your local gun shop could submit the form to the BATF.

Someday I plan to diplomatically dispute against some of the illogical regulations created by the BATF Imports Department. In some cases, I do not understand why they do not modify the regulations in favor of the importation of C&R firearms which usually have a collectors significance and value even if some of those firearms are military models. By placing a few unnecessary restrictions, it spoils the fun of collecting for many collectors who wish to collect history.

When I decide to undertake such a mission to present a case, I hope that I shall have the support of all the members on this forum.

Cheers,
Albert

Lugers down under · 02-29-2004, 02:33 PM

Last year, it took me one week to obtain an import licence from our New Zealand Police (who handle all applications) at a huge cost of zero dollars, sorry wrong! it cost $0.40 cents for the stamp,for an 1900 American Eagle .
It took one year for the export documents from the BAtF and in fact they never arrived!
In the end I just went to the US and picked up the gun myself.
Artillery Holsters,stocks etc turn up very regularly but! most guys do tend to buy them to make up rigs.
Dutch Lugers turn up but are usually Vickers manufacture as they came out of south east asia after the Japs ran amok.
I have a Dutch Vickers but not in excellent condition, but at least I have one.

Pete Ebbink · 02-29-2004, 02:35 PM

Hello Murray !

Of course now that you mentioned it, you do need to post some photos of your Dutch Vickers luger...when you have the time, of course...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Big Norm · 03-01-2004, 03:14 PM

Albert,
Go, big guy, go! While some of the BATF people are good and cooperative, a number of them are stuck in the quagmire of politics of the time. The comparatively recent cooperation by the BATF regarding the legalization of stocks for the artillery and navy model Lugers indicates, to me at least, that the goverment may be in an understanding mood with regard to collectors.

Once, I tried to get an import permit (not a license) for an artillery from Canada. The BATF guy promised to help me and was very nice about it. The deal feel flat on the floor when I lost contact with the Canadian guy.
Big Norm

PS
Oh my gosh! I actually said something nice about the government. I gotta change my coffee brand.

Big Norm · 03-01-2004, 03:27 PM

Murray,
I watched the Academy Awards in Hollywood last night. With the 11 awards given to a New Zealand film and all the thank you's that were given to everyone in NZ, I think that you guys ought this give those seven artilleries to us. Starting with me. New Zealand stole the show.
Big Norm

PS
I could use a 1914,1917 and/or a 1918 artillery holster with all the attaching leather. (hint! hint!) ;&gt

Lugers down under · 03-08-2004, 04:58 AM

Sorry Norm for the late reply but the day after the awards my laptop got wacked by a virus so thus I am now using the wifes computer.
For those of you who are interested, Dan Hanna (Oscar for best Art Diretor)is a friend of mine and is a mad keen gun collector,
Peter Jackson, (Oscar for Best Diector) is one on New Zealands best gun collectors)
Most of the crew, regardless if they are Hobbits or Orc's are gun nuts or collectors.
Now that is the real reason all the films are being made down here and not in "left right out" liberal democrat Hollywood.
Gosh! have I gone too far!

Vlim · 03-08-2004, 08:10 AM

In that case, let Peter know he's the best candidate for a movie about Georg Luger's life

John Sabato · 03-08-2004, 10:16 AM

Murry, if all those guys are really gun nuts like us, WHY THE HECK are they so LIBERAL when it comes to national elections... that just doesn't make sense...

Navy · 03-08-2004, 10:23 AM

When contemplating importation, be advised you will have virtually no recourse if the goods are not as expected. Been there, done that and it took over a year...

Tom A.

02-27-2004, 11:18 PM	#1
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Seven Artillery Lugers for sale If anyone is interested, There are seven (7) artilleries (PO8 Longe) comming up in auctions here down under in the next six weeks. They range from average to excellent and one is an absolute complete rig all matching and with straps and spare mag pouch. I will be going to all of the auctions and could go shopping if you can import them into the USA. Let me know and I will post some details and descriptions. They are mostly 1917 DWM of which we have a large number down here. The prices will be about two thirds of what you would normally pay. Our dollar is very strong at the moment. <img border="0" alt="[icon107]" title="" src="graemlins/icon107.gif" /> __________________ Lugers down under

02-28-2004, 03:44 PM	#3
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	I dont know about the import hurdles into the USA but there are NONE to get it out of New Zealand. The Airparcel post and Insurance would be about US$25.00 __________________ Lugers down under

02-29-2004, 02:33 PM	#13
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Last year, it took me one week to obtain an import licence from our New Zealand Police (who handle all applications) at a huge cost of zero dollars, sorry wrong! it cost $0.40 cents for the stamp,for an 1900 American Eagle . It took one year for the export documents from the BAtF and in fact they never arrived! In the end I just went to the US and picked up the gun myself. Artillery Holsters,stocks etc turn up very regularly but! most guys do tend to buy them to make up rigs. Dutch Lugers turn up but are usually Vickers manufacture as they came out of south east asia after the Japs ran amok. I have a Dutch Vickers but not in excellent condition, but at least I have one. __________________ Lugers down under

03-08-2004, 04:58 AM	#17
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Sorry Norm for the late reply but the day after the awards my laptop got wacked by a virus so thus I am now using the wifes computer. For those of you who are interested, Dan Hanna (Oscar for best Art Diretor)is a friend of mine and is a mad keen gun collector, Peter Jackson, (Oscar for Best Diector) is one on New Zealands best gun collectors) Most of the crew, regardless if they are Hobbits or Orc's are gun nuts or collectors. Now that is the real reason all the films are being made down here and not in "left right out" liberal democrat Hollywood. Gosh! have I gone too far! __________________ Lugers down under

03-08-2004, 10:16 AM	#19
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,151 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Murry, if all those guys are really gun nuts like us, WHY THE HECK are they so LIBERAL when it comes to national elections... that just doesn't make sense... __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

02-28-2004, 10:11 AM	#2
tudorbug Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 387 Thanks: 0 Thanked 40 Times in 29 Posts	I would be interested in one that is excellent and all matched but I have no idea how to jump over the import hurdles. They are probably considerable. Does anyone else know what is involved? Also, the shipping cost is liable to be considerable, I would think.

02-28-2004, 04:01 PM	#4
tudorbug Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 387 Thanks: 0 Thanked 40 Times in 29 Posts	Hurdle here would probably occur at United States customs, where it would have to adhere to whatever restrictions, if any, that apply to foreign weapons. Perhaps an import fee and the need to have a certain license. But, I'm speculating and don't have any experience in this area. I would love to learn tho'. I am amazed that air shipment might be as inexpensive as US$25, I admit.

02-28-2004, 05:56 PM	#5
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Tudorbug, It is most likely that any LP-08, which are classified as military weapons even though they fall in the category of a curio and relic, would have to be imported into the US by a licensed importer and the pistol would probably have to be stamped with the dealer's import stamp. Import duties into the US are 10%. Unfortunately, the BATF makes importation of military curio and relics difficult, but that is the bureaucracy which exists in the US. Albert

02-28-2004, 06:31 PM	#6
tudorbug Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 387 Thanks: 0 Thanked 40 Times in 29 Posts	Albert, thanks! This is the sort of hurdle, or one of a sequence of hurdles, that I contemplated having to face.

02-28-2004, 07:17 PM	#7
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Bob and Brad Simpson's shop still offers importation services. Here is a web site link and some info. : http://www.simpsonltd.com/import_services.htm Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

02-28-2004, 07:20 PM	#8
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Luger Down Under, What about ORIGINAL artillery/navy holsters and stocks with all the leather attachments? How great a varity of dates of manufacture could you find? I don't believe that there would be any problem bringing them into the USA. If the Lugers are gone then the accessories are still good. Big Norm

02-29-2004, 07:50 AM	#9
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,046 Thanks: 1,034 Thanked 3,946 Times in 1,197 Posts	An interesting fact is that in either NZ or Australia, the presence of evacuated Dutch lugers may exist as well. Remember, the Indonesian islands which formed the main area of KNIL presence are just a good rowing distance away Several Dutch troops, ships and aircraft evacuated towards Australia during 1942, when the japanese were on a winning streak so theoretically there may be some 'dutchies' lurking there.

02-29-2004, 12:11 PM	#10
tudorbug Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 387 Thanks: 0 Thanked 40 Times in 29 Posts	Pete, thank you for the link to import services by Simpsons. Shows it can be done by it is expensive and time consuming and there is a risk, I suppose, that BATF would decline to approve a license.

02-29-2004, 12:17 PM	#11
tudorbug Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 387 Thanks: 0 Thanked 40 Times in 29 Posts	Lugers Down Under, I have sent you a private email, when you have time. Thank you.

02-29-2004, 12:47 PM	#12
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Tudorbug, You are correct in mentioning that it would be expensive to import a military LP-08 in the US. It would probably cost $200-$300 for the services of a licensed importer and the 10% US Customs duty. In regards to time, it takes the BATF at least three months to just sign the import application! I shall tell you something which is surprising. It probably takes 20 minutes to complete the three ATF Form 6 import applications in copy without any fee payable by the (import) dealer which he charges $200+ for this type of simple paperwork! Capitalism at its finest! If the Luger was a commercial model, then any dealer such as your local gun shop could submit the form to the BATF. Someday I plan to diplomatically dispute against some of the illogical regulations created by the BATF Imports Department. In some cases, I do not understand why they do not modify the regulations in favor of the importation of C&R firearms which usually have a collectors significance and value even if some of those firearms are military models. By placing a few unnecessary restrictions, it spoils the fun of collecting for many collectors who wish to collect history. When I decide to undertake such a mission to present a case, I hope that I shall have the support of all the members on this forum. Cheers, Albert

02-29-2004, 02:35 PM	#14
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hello Murray ! Of course now that you mentioned it, you do need to post some photos of your Dutch Vickers luger...when you have the time, of course... Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

03-01-2004, 03:14 PM	#15
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Albert, Go, big guy, go! While some of the BATF people are good and cooperative, a number of them are stuck in the quagmire of politics of the time. The comparatively recent cooperation by the BATF regarding the legalization of stocks for the artillery and navy model Lugers indicates, to me at least, that the goverment may be in an understanding mood with regard to collectors. Once, I tried to get an import permit (not a license) for an artillery from Canada. The BATF guy promised to help me and was very nice about it. The deal feel flat on the floor when I lost contact with the Canadian guy. Big Norm PS Oh my gosh! I actually said something nice about the government. I gotta change my coffee brand.

03-01-2004, 03:27 PM	#16
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Murray, I watched the Academy Awards in Hollywood last night. With the 11 awards given to a New Zealand film and all the thank you's that were given to everyone in NZ, I think that you guys ought this give those seven artilleries to us. Starting with me. New Zealand stole the show. Big Norm PS I could use a 1914,1917 and/or a 1918 artillery holster with all the attaching leather. (hint! hint!) ;&gt

03-08-2004, 08:10 AM	#18
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,046 Thanks: 1,034 Thanked 3,946 Times in 1,197 Posts	In that case, let Peter know he's the best candidate for a movie about Georg Luger's life

03-08-2004, 10:23 AM	#20
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	When contemplating importation, be advised you will have virtually no recourse if the goods are not as expected. Been there, done that and it took over a year... Tom A.