7 round hold open

checkfeo · 12-18-2010, 01:46 PM

My 1916 DWM works great, but never loads the 8th round. Always goes to hold open after 7. Rack it back, and the 8th loads, fires, and goes hold open as it should.

My question is this: Is this just a magazine problem, as I think it is, or an indication of something else? The mag is a new Mac-gar made in Italy. Unfortunately its the only one I have.

I have tried to look through all the post on this subject, but none really answer the question. The first round in the magazine looks just like the last round in the magazine, so what is different to make it hold open?

Why does it do this? Need some help..............

Thanks to All Tom

Vlim · 12-18-2010, 02:02 PM

I would attribute this to a weak hold open spring. Due to the increased recoil, caused by the lowered weight of gun + mag + 2 remaining rounds, the hold open jumps up and blocks the toggle prematurely.

Normally the hold open is pushed upwards by the magazine button after the last round. With one round still in the mag, the magazine button is too far down to be able to work the hold-open so I'm pretty sure it is not a magazine issue.

Sieger · 12-19-2010, 02:05 AM

Hi:

Typically, the problem can be traced to a weak hold-open flat spring.

You can obtain a new one from Luger Doc. You might also ask him for instuctions as to how to install it.

Sieger

rivieraranch · 12-19-2010, 08:43 AM

What about bending the spring a little?

Vlim · 12-19-2010, 09:59 AM

You can also remove it for shooting. All it does is keeping the toggle open after the last shot.

checkfeo · 12-19-2010, 10:39 AM

Vlim:

If this is the case, if I load 5 rounds, it should go to hold open after 4, or if I load 3, should go open after 2. Is that what your saying?
I'll have to give this a try on my next range trip and let you know.

How big a deal is it to change the spring, has anyone out there done it, other than Lugerdoc? What I mean is, can the average person do it without too much trouble.

Tom

Vlim · 12-19-2010, 10:49 AM

Hi Tom,

Theoretically, yes. You should have the same consistent problem with 1 rounds left in the magazine.

The leaf spring is pushed into the hold open from the side, it shouldn't be difficult to replace it.

Sieger · 12-19-2010, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rivieraranch

What about bending the spring a little?

That worked for me once for about 5 years of shooting!

You have nothing to loose, as this little spring is not a numbered part.

What you need to know is the correct size punch to punch out the old spring and install the new one. I don't know the correct size, but LugerDoc probably does. With the right punch, the whole operation should take just a few minutes.

Sieger

checkfeo · 12-19-2010, 12:57 PM

Vlim and All:

I get it now. Just took the Luger apart, and really looked to see how it works. I think your right in the problem being the spring on the hold open. I don't see anything else it could be.

After looking at the videos on how to remove the hold open (which I did) and replace the spring, I think it will be an easy job. As Sieger said, finding the right size punch is the hard part, but Lugerdoc should know that when I buy the spring.

I will let you all know after the jobs done if that fixes the problem, but it can't hurt.

Thanks to All Tom

Curss · 12-19-2010, 09:32 PM

Quote:

You can also remove it for shooting. All it does is keeping the toggle open after the last shot.

Vlim's right. One good way to check is to carefully remove it and test fire it.

My father's S/42 Mauser was experiencing severe jamming issues once, the culprit was the hold open spring. After removing it, no more jams. I've got a spring on the way from the Lugerdoc as we speak.

-Chris

Lugerdoc · 12-20-2010, 09:23 AM

Chris, In leiu of a correct sized pin punch, you could try removing the old spring with the rear of HO in a soft jawed vice and using a small bladed screw driver to push it off the HO from right to left. TH

checkfeo · 12-31-2010, 04:41 PM

Vlim and All:

Just installed the new hold open spring I got from Tom Heller. Easy job if you look at the video. (about a five minute job) I could see right away the old spring had flattened out after almost 100 years, and the new one had a nice curve to it.

Put 100 rounds through it, with 2 different mags, and all 8 rounds fired, then went to hold open like it should. Couldn't have worked better.

Next, after seeing the worn out spring, I'm going to order a Wolf spring kit and change all the others just for good measure.

Thanks so much for all the good information, you were spot on.

Tom checkfeo

12-18-2010, 01:46 PM	#1
checkfeo User Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Georgia Posts: 41 Thanks: 1 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	7 round hold open My 1916 DWM works great, but never loads the 8th round. Always goes to hold open after 7. Rack it back, and the 8th loads, fires, and goes hold open as it should. My question is this: Is this just a magazine problem, as I think it is, or an indication of something else? The mag is a new Mac-gar made in Italy. Unfortunately its the only one I have. I have tried to look through all the post on this subject, but none really answer the question. The first round in the magazine looks just like the last round in the magazine, so what is different to make it hold open? Why does it do this? Need some help.............. Thanks to All Tom

12-20-2010, 09:23 AM	#11
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Chris, In leiu of a correct sized pin punch, you could try removing the old spring with the rear of HO in a soft jawed vice and using a small bladed screw driver to push it off the HO from right to left. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

12-31-2010, 04:41 PM	#12
checkfeo User Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Georgia Posts: 41 Thanks: 1 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	Hold Open Spring Vlim and All: Just installed the new hold open spring I got from Tom Heller. Easy job if you look at the video. (about a five minute job) I could see right away the old spring had flattened out after almost 100 years, and the new one had a nice curve to it. Put 100 rounds through it, with 2 different mags, and all 8 rounds fired, then went to hold open like it should. Couldn't have worked better. Next, after seeing the worn out spring, I'm going to order a Wolf spring kit and change all the others just for good measure. Thanks so much for all the good information, you were spot on. Tom checkfeo

12-18-2010, 02:02 PM	#2
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,049 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,958 Times in 1,200 Posts	I would attribute this to a weak hold open spring. Due to the increased recoil, caused by the lowered weight of gun + mag + 2 remaining rounds, the hold open jumps up and blocks the toggle prematurely. Normally the hold open is pushed upwards by the magazine button after the last round. With one round still in the mag, the magazine button is too far down to be able to work the hold-open so I'm pretty sure it is not a magazine issue.

12-19-2010, 02:05 AM	#3
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,575 Thanks: 2,124 Thanked 400 Times in 249 Posts	Hi: Typically, the problem can be traced to a weak hold-open flat spring. You can obtain a new one from Luger Doc. You might also ask him for instuctions as to how to install it. Sieger

12-19-2010, 08:43 AM	#4
rivieraranch User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: South Florida Posts: 101 Thanks: 4 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts	What about bending the spring a little?

12-19-2010, 09:59 AM	#5
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,049 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,958 Times in 1,200 Posts	You can also remove it for shooting. All it does is keeping the toggle open after the last shot.

12-19-2010, 10:39 AM	#6
checkfeo User Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Georgia Posts: 41 Thanks: 1 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	Vlim: If this is the case, if I load 5 rounds, it should go to hold open after 4, or if I load 3, should go open after 2. Is that what your saying? I'll have to give this a try on my next range trip and let you know. How big a deal is it to change the spring, has anyone out there done it, other than Lugerdoc? What I mean is, can the average person do it without too much trouble. Tom

12-19-2010, 10:49 AM	#7
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,049 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,958 Times in 1,200 Posts	Hi Tom, Theoretically, yes. You should have the same consistent problem with 1 rounds left in the magazine. The leaf spring is pushed into the hold open from the side, it shouldn't be difficult to replace it.

12-19-2010, 12:57 PM	#9
checkfeo User Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Georgia Posts: 41 Thanks: 1 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	Vlim and All: I get it now. Just took the Luger apart, and really looked to see how it works. I think your right in the problem being the spring on the hold open. I don't see anything else it could be. After looking at the videos on how to remove the hold open (which I did) and replace the spring, I think it will be an easy job. As Sieger said, finding the right size punch is the hard part, but Lugerdoc should know that when I buy the spring. I will let you all know after the jobs done if that fixes the problem, but it can't hurt. Thanks to All Tom