New York Police with Lugers

Mike B · 12-06-2010, 07:08 PM

Greetings,
I recently picked up this interesting photo. Initially, I purchased it just because I thought the two Lugers in a vintage picture are kind of cool. However, something caught my eye. Take a look at the Luger in the Officer's left hand. Take a closer look at the muzzle. It apprears to me that it is larger than a standard 9mm barrel. Could this be a 45 he is holding?
Also, any idea what the other object is in his left hand?
Mike

alanint · 12-06-2010, 07:16 PM

I think that the ".45 Luger" is actually an optical illusion where you are seeing the wear on the very edge of the muzzle ring highlighted by the flash, making the muzzle appear larger than it is.
The other object appears to be some sort of leather case with a cover flap and stitched on rings to attach the case to other gear. It is being held upside down, with the flap in the lower right hand side of the object just past the metal ring.

alanint · 12-06-2010, 07:19 PM

Postino,
Mike is referring to the third object. The one I describe above.

Mike is aware there are two Lugers!

sheepherder · 12-06-2010, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanint

Postino,
Mike is referring to the third object. The one I describe above.

Mike is aware there are two Lugers!

Thanks! I see that now...

Hugo Borchardt · 12-06-2010, 07:31 PM

Cool find! WAG: Looks like he was photographed with evidence taken from a crime scene perhaps. Interesting he is not looking at camera - impromptu photo (press?). Note no mag in at least one of the guns. Anything written on the back of the photo or is it Kodak date stamped? Would be interesting to find an expert in police history to date the photo based on the uniform. Most likely mid-50's. At first glance I thought the third object might be a snail drum holster, but it looks more like a binocular case or something probably not luger-related.

Mike B · 12-06-2010, 07:51 PM

Unforunatley, there is nothing on the back. The seller had nothing to add except his/her guess that is an old New York Police uniform.

Mike

Ron Smith · 12-06-2010, 08:26 PM

He's holding a camera case. Possibly for the camera the photo is being taken with. Probaly an evidence photo taken at the scene.

Hugo Borchardt · 12-06-2010, 08:31 PM

Darnit Ron, how obvious. I guess I am Inspector Clouseau to your Holmes.

Ron Wood · 12-06-2010, 08:35 PM

The gun in his left hand is a LP08.

Edward Tinker · 12-06-2010, 09:04 PM

cool photos, I love old photos with lugers in them

Ron Smith · 12-06-2010, 09:21 PM

Clark,

I didn't read the first half of your post completely. Plagiarism isn't my strong suit. I got the phraseology wrong.

Ron

John Sabato · 12-07-2010, 08:12 AM

My Take on the photo:

Since the 1911 Sullivan law in NYC would have made possession of these handguns unlawful (and still does) except for the very privileged... these two Lugers were likely war souveniers or collectibles that were confiscated from a residence during a routine police call or investigation... Even bring back papers wouldn't help you if you got caught with contraband weapons in NYC...

"Mid 1950's" isn't that far removed from WW2 and getting returning combat veterans to turn in their war trophies probably wasn't very easy, regardless of the law...

Hugo Borchardt · 12-07-2010, 09:27 AM

Ron:

Didn't think a thing about it. Still impressed you recognized the third item was a camera case!

Clark

saab-bob · 12-07-2010, 02:56 PM

Speaking of old pictures of lugers.

Did anyone see this picture from E-bay of a gent holding a luger with a Ideal Shoulder stock on his belt?

It looks like a still from a early western movie of some kind.
The luger looks like a American Eagle.
Comments?

Bob

wlyon · 12-07-2010, 11:06 PM

That may well be a camera case but it reminds me of the old nightwatchman's station clock. For those who are to young to remember a watchman carried this clock, at each place he was supposed to be there was a key on a chain. He would insert the key and a record was made in the clock of when this was done. I know from my small home town that our Policeman also carried one when he made his rounds. I must be getting old!! Bill

sheepherder · 12-08-2010, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wlyon

That may well be a camera case but it reminds me of the old nightwatchman's station clock. For those who are to young to remember a watchman carried this clock, at each place he was supposed to be there was a key on a chain. He would insert the key and a record was made in the clock of when this was done. I know from my small home town that our Policeman also carried one when he made his rounds. I must be getting old!! Bill

Kimberly-Clark guards still used them up until 1981, at least in Niagara Falls. I was a millwright in their NF plant and the clock stations were all over the place. You could occasionally see the guards scurrying about (we got called in at all odd hours) but they never seemed to pay attention to anything...too busy hurrying on to the next station...

regul · 12-08-2010, 05:02 PM

Chesapeake Corp. in West Point, VA used them up until the mid 70's when I worked there on the student college progrom(my father was a millright on the woodyard) then the mill was sold to St, Laurent and they later sold it to Smurfit-Stone which has gone through some tough times lately. No body knows what paper company(by name, if any) they may work for here from week to week.
Now the guards use bar code scanners on there routes.

Sieger · 12-15-2010, 12:09 AM

Hi to all:

The third item looks like the leather case to an LP-08 drum magazine to me.

Sieger

wlyon · 12-15-2010, 12:38 PM

Sieger
The only problem with that is apparently there wasn't such a thing. Just the repro ones sold now. Bill

sej-gun · 12-15-2010, 02:17 PM

Now we are whit old photos.
I here have a drawing from a Danish newspaper ”Rosklide Tidende” it is from 1969.
It shows a Luger in the front, and gangsters whit revolvers in the background.
The “story” is: that there are too many private owned pistols in the USA, make it nearly to the dangeroust
place on earth. A little bit funny that the newspaper had used a Luger to illustrate this “story”
I guess that the journalist was a little bit “red”
Is there something about drawings and Denmark "hmm"

Reg. Jes

12-06-2010, 07:08 PM	#1
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	New York Police with Lugers Greetings, I recently picked up this interesting photo. Initially, I purchased it just because I thought the two Lugers in a vintage picture are kind of cool. However, something caught my eye. Take a look at the Luger in the Officer's left hand. Take a closer look at the muzzle. It apprears to me that it is larger than a standard 9mm barrel. Could this be a 45 he is holding? Also, any idea what the other object is in his left hand? Mike Attached Thumbnails

12-06-2010, 07:16 PM	#2
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	I think that the ".45 Luger" is actually an optical illusion where you are seeing the wear on the very edge of the muzzle ring highlighted by the flash, making the muzzle appear larger than it is. The other object appears to be some sort of leather case with a cover flap and stitched on rings to attach the case to other gear. It is being held upside down, with the flap in the lower right hand side of the object just past the metal ring. Last edited by alanint; 12-06-2010 at 09:53 PM.

12-06-2010, 07:31 PM	#5
Hugo Borchardt User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 370 Thanks: 338 Thanked 131 Times in 47 Posts	Cool find! WAG: Looks like he was photographed with evidence taken from a crime scene perhaps. Interesting he is not looking at camera - impromptu photo (press?). Note no mag in at least one of the guns. Anything written on the back of the photo or is it Kodak date stamped? Would be interesting to find an expert in police history to date the photo based on the uniform. Most likely mid-50's. At first glance I thought the third object might be a snail drum holster, but it looks more like a binocular case or something probably not luger-related. __________________ My militaria collection is dedicated to the memory of my Grandfather, Marine Gunnery Sergeant Dave Hill, Jr., wounded in action at The Assault of the Second Marine Division on Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll, 20-23 November, 1943. http://www.tarawa1943.com/pages/casualties%20tarawa.htm

12-06-2010, 08:26 PM	#7
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	He's holding a camera case. Possibly for the camera the photo is being taken with. Probaly an evidence photo taken at the scene. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said... Last edited by Ron Smith; 12-06-2010 at 09:19 PM.

12-06-2010, 08:31 PM	#8
Hugo Borchardt User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 370 Thanks: 338 Thanked 131 Times in 47 Posts	Darnit Ron, how obvious. I guess I am Inspector Clouseau to your Holmes. __________________ My militaria collection is dedicated to the memory of my Grandfather, Marine Gunnery Sergeant Dave Hill, Jr., wounded in action at The Assault of the Second Marine Division on Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll, 20-23 November, 1943. http://www.tarawa1943.com/pages/casualties%20tarawa.htm

12-06-2010, 07:19 PM	#3
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Postino, Mike is referring to the third object. The one I describe above. Mike is aware there are two Lugers!

12-06-2010, 07:51 PM	#6
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	Unforunatley, there is nothing on the back. The seller had nothing to add except his/her guess that is an old New York Police uniform. Mike

12-06-2010, 08:35 PM	#9
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,987 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,090 Times in 1,675 Posts	The gun in his left hand is a LP08. Attached Images __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

12-06-2010, 09:04 PM	#10
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	cool photos, I love old photos with lugers in them __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

12-06-2010, 09:21 PM	#11
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Clark, I didn't read the first half of your post completely. Plagiarism isn't my strong suit. I got the phraseology wrong. Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

12-07-2010, 08:12 AM	#12
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	My Take on the photo: Since the 1911 Sullivan law in NYC would have made possession of these handguns unlawful (and still does) except for the very privileged... these two Lugers were likely war souveniers or collectibles that were confiscated from a residence during a routine police call or investigation... Even bring back papers wouldn't help you if you got caught with contraband weapons in NYC... "Mid 1950's" isn't that far removed from WW2 and getting returning combat veterans to turn in their war trophies probably wasn't very easy, regardless of the law... __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

12-07-2010, 09:27 AM	#13
Hugo Borchardt User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 370 Thanks: 338 Thanked 131 Times in 47 Posts	Ron: Didn't think a thing about it. Still impressed you recognized the third item was a camera case! Clark __________________ My militaria collection is dedicated to the memory of my Grandfather, Marine Gunnery Sergeant Dave Hill, Jr., wounded in action at The Assault of the Second Marine Division on Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll, 20-23 November, 1943. http://www.tarawa1943.com/pages/casualties%20tarawa.htm

12-07-2010, 02:56 PM	#14
saab-bob User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: So Cal Posts: 459 Thanks: 774 Thanked 143 Times in 87 Posts	Speaking of old pictures of lugers. Did anyone see this picture from E-bay of a gent holding a luger with a Ideal Shoulder stock on his belt? It looks like a still from a early western movie of some kind. The luger looks like a American Eagle. Comments? Bob Attached Thumbnails __________________ "I think,therefore I own guns"

12-07-2010, 11:06 PM	#15
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,615 Thanks: 3,140 Thanked 2,522 Times in 940 Posts	That may well be a camera case but it reminds me of the old nightwatchman's station clock. For those who are to young to remember a watchman carried this clock, at each place he was supposed to be there was a key on a chain. He would insert the key and a record was made in the clock of when this was done. I know from my small home town that our Policeman also carried one when he made his rounds. I must be getting old!! Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

12-08-2010, 05:02 PM	#17
regul Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: VA Posts: 96 Thanks: 19 Thanked 57 Times in 20 Posts	Chesapeake Corp. in West Point, VA used them up until the mid 70's when I worked there on the student college progrom(my father was a millright on the woodyard) then the mill was sold to St, Laurent and they later sold it to Smurfit-Stone which has gone through some tough times lately. No body knows what paper company(by name, if any) they may work for here from week to week. Now the guards use bar code scanners on there routes.

12-15-2010, 12:09 AM	#18
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,575 Thanks: 2,124 Thanked 400 Times in 249 Posts	Hi to all: The third item looks like the leather case to an LP-08 drum magazine to me. Sieger

12-15-2010, 12:38 PM	#19
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,615 Thanks: 3,140 Thanked 2,522 Times in 940 Posts	Sieger The only problem with that is apparently there wasn't such a thing. Just the repro ones sold now. Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

12-15-2010, 02:17 PM	#20
sej-gun User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Denmark Posts: 99 Thanks: 26 Thanked 16 Times in 7 Posts	Now we are whit old photos. I here have a drawing from a Danish newspaper ”Rosklide Tidende” it is from 1969. It shows a Luger in the front, and gangsters whit revolvers in the background. The “story” is: that there are too many private owned pistols in the USA, make it nearly to the dangeroust place on earth. A little bit funny that the newspaper had used a Luger to illustrate this “story” I guess that the journalist was a little bit “red” Is there something about drawings and Denmark "hmm" Reg. Jes Attached Thumbnails