Advice on Luger purchase requested

[wterrell]

John D., I was politely suggesting........

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by wes:
<strong>John D., I was politely suggesting........</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hey Wes....!!!

You know me - don't EVER politely suggest [img]smile.gif[/img] Just come out and say it..!!! [img]eek.gif[/img] You know I don't beat around the bush (I bet some would wish I did..).. And nope - I will not close down this thread.

Ask me how I really feel..???!!! Pete's reply above captures the sentiment - but if pressed, I'll put it in my own words. [img]rolleyes.gif[/img]

Best to you,

John

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by Edward Tinker:
<strong>...as I know Wes and you (John) would rather do that than comment on comments of others [img]smile.gif[/img] </strong><hr></blockquote>

Hi Ed,

I would rather comment publicly on Lugers (Well - HK's to be exact) then worry about other folks that post and worry about how they have alienated new-comers to this hobby. Ask me why I reply privately?

I guess I'm not alone.

John D.

[Steve Richards]

After all that has been said, if this realy is a Luger and Alex can look at any of the photos posted to tell if it is, BUY IT. At that price, if it cycles and is not a pile of rust you cannot go wrong. Hopefully, you know enough about guns in general to know if it apears to be in reasonable condition. For the price of $175.00 I would not care what model, year, etc it is. All I would be concerned with is "does it apear to be in sound mechanical condition?" Good luck and welcome to the forum. <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

[Edward Tinker]

So Steve, we should start a new and real thread on LuGaRs, [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

But, I have seen upper receivers go for $150 with barrel and the same for lower receivers, so just for the beat up body of anything would be worth it to play with. Do as some have done and practice your bluing skills or cutting down the barrel or frame.

[crgkstnr]

Is there a trend here? A tendency to gang up on knowledgeable collectors because we don't like what they say or the way they say it? First Klaus Schad then Jan Still, and now Garfield? What will we be left with if they all go?
Craig

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by crgkstnr:
<strong>Is there a trend here? A tendency to gang up on knowledgeable collectors because ...</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hmmmm.....

I reckon that you are fair game. I am not certain which of the two of you, Garfield or you, is the more ignorant.

~~~

Now how do you feel?

Is it OK that I reply to your post this way - or are you saying it's OK for Bill to treat a new comer that way on their first post? Is there a difference?

Is so - please tell me how?

Oh - has Jan been telling folks I banned him, again? For the record - he isn't banned. He chooses not to post. That is his decision, not mine.

John D.

[Roadkill]

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by Roadkill:
<strong>Common sense and the fact that I don't have a dog in this fight tells me to stay out...</strong><hr></blockquote>

But your words are full of wisdom....

I believe you are right. Right on target - at 500 yards, still staying out of the fire-fight, you hit the bullseye and the X ring. Couldn't have done better with my H-BAR at the LE Colt Cup....

Well said RK.... Thanks....

JD

[wterrell]

Roadkill,

I would suggest just the opposite. It seems more like a coup d'etat. The coming of the new guard. We must have a little introspection and divine our motives (if we understand human nature).

'Arrogant superiority' exists where there is no superiority. Conceded and demonstrable superiority would not fall into the same catagory as conceit.

[ToggleTop]

As an outside observer I really believe this thread should have been moderated long before getting this far. I hate to waste my time reading this useless rhetoric. It should have been stopped sooner.
All of you are good at what you write, it's just not worth anything.

[wterrell]

Flame on!

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by ToggleTop:
<strong>As an outside observer I really believe this thread should have been moderated long before getting this far. ....</strong><hr></blockquote>

So - given your insight and comments - at which post exactly, would you have moderated it?

Just interested....

John D.

[ToggleTop]

John D.,
When the word ignorant was used I would have began deleting at that point. You know as well as I do we do not need that on this forum. It is not for us to judge one's ignorance!

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by ToggleTop:
<strong>John D.,
When the word ignorant was used !</strong><hr></blockquote>

You know what - I agree 100% with you.... My apologies for not moderating this thread sooner, as I think you are right....

Unfortunatley, there are those who may disagree with both of us, and therefore the wasted bandwidth after the point when moderation should have taken place...

My Best to you - and my thanks. And again, my apology for not hopping on this thread sooner....

John D.

[ToggleTop]

John D.,
We are very fortunate to have you as Site Moderator. I am only here to learn and contribute what I can, and it don't cost me a dime. I don't want to mess it up!

[John D.]

[quote]Originally posted by ToggleTop:
<strong>I don't want to mess it up!</strong><hr></blockquote>

You certainly haven't..!!! In fact - it's folks like you that this Forum is all about. Read RoadKills Post above, and Pete's, and Alex's and RJennings posts.... You folks are what this is about....

In my mind - it's not about the old guard, hidden agenda's, secret handshakes to collecting and what "should be" given a hidden code word...

Rather - this Forum should be about what "is" and "can" be given this tremendous hobby. And you are a very important part of that. And for that - you have my, and many others from the "silent" community - well, you have our combined thanks....

And yes - you are right - I should have moderated this thread sooner. You are right. My thanks for that as well....

John

[MauserLugers]

Roadkill,
I feel your comments are totally uncalled for. You have made it perfectly clear on many occassions that you are a shooter, not a collector, have no desire to be a collector, and you dispise collectors. In my opinion your comments about collectors and their attitude are not even close to the way it is. Collectors have spent years trying to acquire the knowledge to tell the difference between variations, fakes, and reblue's, and share this information with you, so you can read a book and quote their passages. The collectors I know do not feel or act higher or better than anyone. They are willing to share information, but instead of welcoming them and accepting them, they are questioned and challenged on all posts with requirements to produce documentation. The experts try to stay current with information, which you do not, and are constantly trying to share this new information because you are still passing on 50 yr old wrong information. When they do try to help you, you label them as trying to be better or above you. There is a major problem here with people posting wrong answers and if you correct them you get "the wraith of Roadkill" with comments of being power hungry and acting above everyone. Your attitude is as much a problem as anyones! And yes, I do think the true experts do deserve some respect, and yes, what they state has more meaning than someone re-siting a 50 yr old book! ---- John, shut this damn thread off and lets move on!!!

[John Sabato]

For those with a concern about Jan Still, He has posted 4 times during the 1st week of this month. why he has been silent this week is either anyone's guess, or more likely nobody's business but his.

Jan is a welcome contributor to this forum... He is not now, nor never has been banned from posting on this forum. Who starts these rumors? [img]rolleyes.gif[/img]

And Bill M, you and I have been at opposite sites of a technical discussion on more than one occassion in the last few years, but it has never led to name calling and outright arrogance... I have great respect your collected knowledge and often recommend that others seek your guidance..."experts" DO deserve respect... and they generally get it when they have earned it.

Respect for technical knowledge does not automatically carry with it respect for the person, their attitude, or their manners. That is a totally separate issue.

That is all that is expected of anyone who comes to this place... mutual respect, (the key word being mutual) and simply stated, the obvious exercise of the golden rule...

If Garfield doesn't care how other people treat him in public, that is his business, but his technical and historical knowledge do not give him the right to abuse others because he doesn't care how they will react... at least not here.

And no, I won't shut off this thread either, just because folks are speaking their minds... as long as they do it with respect for others who may not agree with them. Once the evidence of respect has dissipated... then and only then will I step in and pound the gavel, and maybe snap the padlock on a thread.

I have worked hard during the last 3 years to help make this a great place to visit and exhange information... I don't get paid a dime, I am not a dealer, or a collector... and I haven't fired a shot out of anything that I own in almost 10 years. I do it out of fascination with the Luger, it's engineering marvel, it's diverse and interesting history, and it's remarkable longevity. I also like Luger people.

From 1981 to 1986 I served as an Inspector General while on active duty. The motto that adorns the IG crest is "Droit et Avant" ...it has been my personal motto since that time. For those of you who have never heard the translation, it means, "be right, then go (forward)."

I won't stand idly by and let this site slide down the tubes AGAIN. I stand by everything I said in this message thread, and I have received a remarkable number of backchannel messages and email supporting my stance on the issue.

Good Night and God Bless to all...

[wterrell]

Damn, John S., don't embarrass me. I was hoping that was forgotten. I truly admire these men who have the knowledge. They can call me stupid, ignorant, foolish, village idiot-----it does not matter, as long as they give away in a few sentences what took them many years and piles of money to learn.
I will take all the short-cuts that come along. I will not let my pride interfere with my accumulation of knowledge.
This is the real world and the name of the game is to win.