9mm Star BM

sheepherder · 12-11-2009, 04:54 PM

I have a short list of handguns I want; Colt 1903, Nambu Type 14, Remington Model 51, a few others...One of the others is/was a 9mm Star. My local shop had one in this week, at a very competitive price...So I treated myself...

All steel; 8+1 single stack mag; lockwork and general lines like a 7/8 scale M1911A1. FN style extractor, mag safety (which I dislike and will remove as soon as I figure it out), plastic grips. CAI import markings; and a slide cartouche which I don't recognize. "This pistol was officially adopted in 1976 by the Spanish Navy, the Guardia Civil, and the Cuerpo General de Policia" (from the NRA Assembly book). I don't know exactly what year this one is, but the finish is about 85%, bore excellent, and barrel bushing wear negligible.

I attached a pic of the cartouche and the letters; they don't match anything I could find on GB...Does anyone recognize them???

Curly1 · 12-11-2009, 08:51 PM

Interesting marking, if you don't get any answers here post over in the "Spanish handgun" forum on gunboards.

Low serial also according to this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Model_BM

"BM serial numbers ranged from 1,226,501 to somewhere around 1,942,445"

Very well built and shoot nice. If you really like it your list is gonna get longer like mine did with other Star's

)

sheepherder · 12-11-2009, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curly1

Low serial also according to this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Model_BM

"BM serial numbers ranged from 1,226,501 to somewhere around 1,942,445"

Gary -

Thanks for the info! I didn't know Gunboards had a Spanish subforum...

It's not a low serial...The full serial is on the left side, behind the trigger, vertically...(You can just see it)...It's 1567840...The right side shows 0840 on both slide & frame...Right above the CAI Georgia VT mark...No idea why...

Edit: Thread posted "over there"...

Curly1 · 12-11-2009, 11:14 PM

Maybe it is the CAI import number

alanint · 12-12-2009, 05:24 AM

Just a guess, but since Spanish tends to initial the opposite from English. This may stand for "Nitro Proof" or "Prueba Nitro"

Another wild guess would be "Policia Nacional" or "National Police"

sheepherder · 12-12-2009, 08:39 AM

Thanks for the replies!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curly1

Maybe it is the CAI import number

Could very well be (the 4-digit number); the 7-digit number may not have been convenient for CAI to fill in their forms...

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanint

Just a guess, but since Spanish tends to initial the opposite from English. This may stand for "Nitro Proof" or "Prueba Nitro"

Another wild guess would be "Policia Nacional" or "National Police"

Policia Nationale was my first guess, and also the guess of a member on Gunboards/Spanish Pistols...

But no one has identified the cartouche...I don't really buy the "proof" guess for the cartouche (not yet, anyway), as why put a proof on a part of the pistol that is not stressed??? (And is easily separable from the barrel/frame). And the barrel/chamber already has a proof (looks like a flaming bomb)...

alvin · 12-12-2009, 07:30 PM

Interesting gun. Planned to buy a book on Star. I have been searching a couple of guns that I am interested in for years and could not find an appropriate one. Now gun $$ is putting into something else, hopefully nothing will come up until a year later. If Star is competitive, I can play Star a little bit in 2010.

How it compare with Astra in quality? I mean, in general.

sheepherder · 12-12-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alvin

How it compare with Astra in quality? I mean, in general.

I don't know...I've never owned an Astra.

Quality of machining is much better than WW II Lugers/P38's; not quite as good as Colt Series 70 [commercial]. But close...Tolerances are very good. Finish is very good (still a lot left).

****************************************************

Montelongo at Gunboards tells me the cartouche is the "Águila de San Juan" and is part of the "Shield of Spain"...I'm not sure where that Shield is found, but there are a lot of Eagles on Spanish flags, Police cars, gov't buildings, etc...

HuntMaster · 12-12-2009, 11:31 PM

I don't know what these pistols are worth, but a guy in Olive Branch, Ms is advertising one on AR15.com for $275 .

Curly1 · 12-12-2009, 11:36 PM

$275 is on the high side unless it is is in hi end condition with 2 mags then I would consider it.

Douglas Jr. · 12-13-2009, 07:56 AM

Nice pistol.
You date this pistol using this chart:
http://www.star-firearms.com/firearms/proof.shtml

From your pictures I can't read the letter code stamped on it.

Nice purchase.

Douglas

sheepherder · 12-13-2009, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Douglas Jr.

Nice pistol.
You date this pistol using this chart:
http://www.star-firearms.com/firearms/proof.shtml

From your pictures I can't read the letter code stamped on it.

That's because on the BM/BKM it is under the left grip.

I had found a site with the BM/BKM letter codes, but that page you referenced is much better. Lots more Star stuff. Thanks!

Here's a pic of my letter code, with proof marks. 1981.

Interestingly, my plumed helmet proof has the "X" in the shield, but my Flaming Bomb proof does not have the "P"...

sheepherder · 12-13-2009, 11:07 AM

Btw: In the pic above, that gaping black hole is where the magazine safety (only shoots if magazine is inserted) was...I took it out.

I just shot 50 rounds out of it an hour ago. My reloads; 125 gr FMJ RN with 5.2 grs Win 231 powder. Felt like a hot load, although in my S&W 659 it feels average. My Speer reloading manual from 1981 shows this combination giving ~1100 fps...

At a WAG, I would say this was sighted in for a left handed shooter. All my shots shooting right handed were off to the left; shooting left handed, I was right on the black. I can't shoot rifles right handed any more, so I try to do all my shooting left handed. This can stay as it is.

sheepherder · 12-13-2009, 11:23 AM

When I got this, I wanted some more 9mm brass for reloading, so I bought the only box of 9mm brass-cased FMJ cartridges the shop had (the rest were aluminum cases or hollow point/segmented bullets).

They're "American Eagle" brand, made by Federal, the box says "Made in USA"...and they're 147 gr FMJ FP...

I know some here have commented on there not being any truncated 9mm rounds anymore...Well, here are some...but look at that bullet!!! A whopping 147 grs!!!

The box lists the muzzle velocity as 1000 fps...and muzzle energy as 325 ft-lbs...That is one honking round!!!

Definitely not for Lugers!!!

But might make a nice display round...

Here's a pic of one on the left, along with a couple of my 124 gr FMJ-FP reloads...

saab-bob · 12-13-2009, 02:33 PM

Postino

You should try a ASTRA 400 which is chambered for the 9mm Largo. A buddy just got a pristine Interarms imported one for cheap. Better made then expected.
Got some surplus non-corrosive ammo from SARCO.
Fun to shoot. Similar ballistics to a 38 Super. Hard on the palm after a few magazines,as the back strap has a thin profile. The gun is straight blow back and it has "the mother of all recoil springs"!

Bob

sheepherder · 12-13-2009, 06:11 PM

saab-bob -

Is that Astra a large frame pistol??? I wanted this Star because it was a medium frame auto in 9mm...I have enough scars on my stomach from Colt autos...

BTW: I neglected to say if the Star had any problems...With five rounds loaded in the mag (my usual string of fire) I had none...but with eight rounds loaded, I had three stovepipes...

My handloads were set up to ~1.169" OAL, which is what SAAMI recommends for 9mm auto-loading pistols...but looking in my Speer handloading book, they recommend 1.100" OAL for 125 gr bullets, and 1.080" for 100 gr bullets...

I'll try another 50 with the shorter rounds; or if I can find a box here that are shorter than 1.169"...

Gotta get another pound of 231...I'm out...

Curly1 · 12-13-2009, 10:03 PM

Ya the astra 400 is big they didnt call it the "pipe wrench" for nothing, makes an effective club when you run ottta ammo

sheepherder · 02-25-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alvin

How it compare with Astra in quality? I mean, in general.

I should be able to give an opinion in about a week...Niagara County changed it's pistol registration regs; I won't be able to pick it up for another week...but I picked up an Astra 4000 in 7.65mm...Serial 842493; no idea what year it is, but my local shop has had it for many years, the owner says...and he let it go for very little...(note tag is blank)...

Red/brown plastic grips, what looks like a chromed magazine (but stamped "Astra")...excellent bore, about maybe 80% blue...

This was the 2nd of the two I've been eyeballing; I may still go after the S&W .35 auto as well...

(Pardon the pics; taken with my phone)

saab-bob · 02-25-2010, 02:48 PM

To Postino

Interesting post-war version of the ASTRA 300. Has a exposed hammer.
Nice gun and fairly rare.
Bob

Steve Richards · 02-26-2010, 02:26 AM

A very nice Astra 4000. Does the magazine have a cutout at the top left front corrner? Mine does and the few replacement grips that I have seen do not.

A very good book on Astra is Astra Automatic Pistols by Leonardo Antaris. He will have a new edition out in a couple of months but the current one is well worth the price.

He also has a book on Star pistols. I do not collect Star so cannot vouch for the book except to say that if it is comparable to his Astra book, it should be excellent.

Steve

12-11-2009, 04:54 PM	#1
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	9mm Star BM I have a short list of handguns I want; Colt 1903, Nambu Type 14, Remington Model 51, a few others...One of the others is/was a 9mm Star. My local shop had one in this week, at a very competitive price...So I treated myself... All steel; 8+1 single stack mag; lockwork and general lines like a 7/8 scale M1911A1. FN style extractor, mag safety (which I dislike and will remove as soon as I figure it out), plastic grips. CAI import markings; and a slide cartouche which I don't recognize. "This pistol was officially adopted in 1976 by the Spanish Navy, the Guardia Civil, and the Cuerpo General de Policia" (from the NRA Assembly book). I don't know exactly what year this one is, but the finish is about 85%, bore excellent, and barrel bushing wear negligible. I attached a pic of the cartouche and the letters; they don't match anything I could find on GB...Does anyone recognize them??? Attached Thumbnails Attached Images

12-11-2009, 08:51 PM	#2
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,230 Thanks: 113 Thanked 703 Times in 365 Posts	Interesting marking, if you don't get any answers here post over in the "Spanish handgun" forum on gunboards. Low serial also according to this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Model_BM "BM serial numbers ranged from 1,226,501 to somewhere around 1,942,445" Very well built and shoot nice. If you really like it your list is gonna get longer like mine did with other Star's ) __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

12-11-2009, 11:14 PM	#4
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,230 Thanks: 113 Thanked 703 Times in 365 Posts	Maybe it is the CAI import number __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

12-12-2009, 11:36 PM	#10
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,230 Thanks: 113 Thanked 703 Times in 365 Posts	$275 is on the high side unless it is is in hi end condition with 2 mags then I would consider it. __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

12-13-2009, 11:23 AM	#14
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	When I got this, I wanted some more 9mm brass for reloading, so I bought the only box of 9mm brass-cased FMJ cartridges the shop had (the rest were aluminum cases or hollow point/segmented bullets). They're "American Eagle" brand, made by Federal, the box says "Made in USA"...and they're 147 gr FMJ FP... I know some here have commented on there not being any truncated 9mm rounds anymore...Well, here are some...but look at that bullet!!! A whopping 147 grs!!! The box lists the muzzle velocity as 1000 fps...and muzzle energy as 325 ft-lbs...That is one honking round!!! Definitely not for Lugers!!! But might make a nice display round... Here's a pic of one on the left, along with a couple of my 124 gr FMJ-FP reloads... Attached Thumbnails

12-12-2009, 05:24 AM	#5
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Just a guess, but since Spanish tends to initial the opposite from English. This may stand for "Nitro Proof" or "Prueba Nitro" Another wild guess would be "Policia Nacional" or "National Police"

12-12-2009, 07:30 PM	#7
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Interesting gun. Planned to buy a book on Star. I have been searching a couple of guns that I am interested in for years and could not find an appropriate one. Now gun $$ is putting into something else, hopefully nothing will come up until a year later. If Star is competitive, I can play Star a little bit in 2010. How it compare with Astra in quality? I mean, in general.

12-12-2009, 11:31 PM	#9
HuntMaster User Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 69 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	I don't know what these pistols are worth, but a guy in Olive Branch, Ms is advertising one on AR15.com for $275 .

12-13-2009, 07:56 AM	#11
Douglas Jr. User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South America Posts: 948 Thanks: 598 Thanked 584 Times in 254 Posts	Nice pistol. You date this pistol using this chart: http://www.star-firearms.com/firearms/proof.shtml From your pictures I can't read the letter code stamped on it. Nice purchase. Douglas

12-13-2009, 11:07 AM	#13
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	Btw: In the pic above, that gaping black hole is where the magazine safety (only shoots if magazine is inserted) was...I took it out. I just shot 50 rounds out of it an hour ago. My reloads; 125 gr FMJ RN with 5.2 grs Win 231 powder. Felt like a hot load, although in my S&W 659 it feels average. My Speer reloading manual from 1981 shows this combination giving ~1100 fps... At a WAG, I would say this was sighted in for a left handed shooter. All my shots shooting right handed were off to the left; shooting left handed, I was right on the black. I can't shoot rifles right handed any more, so I try to do all my shooting left handed. This can stay as it is.

12-13-2009, 02:33 PM	#15
saab-bob User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: So Cal Posts: 459 Thanks: 774 Thanked 143 Times in 87 Posts	Postino You should try a ASTRA 400 which is chambered for the 9mm Largo. A buddy just got a pristine Interarms imported one for cheap. Better made then expected. Got some surplus non-corrosive ammo from SARCO. Fun to shoot. Similar ballistics to a 38 Super. Hard on the palm after a few magazines,as the back strap has a thin profile. The gun is straight blow back and it has "the mother of all recoil springs"! Bob __________________ "I think,therefore I own guns"

12-13-2009, 06:11 PM	#16
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	saab-bob - Is that Astra a large frame pistol??? I wanted this Star because it was a medium frame auto in 9mm...I have enough scars on my stomach from Colt autos... BTW: I neglected to say if the Star had any problems...With five rounds loaded in the mag (my usual string of fire) I had none...but with eight rounds loaded, I had three stovepipes... My handloads were set up to ~1.169" OAL, which is what SAAMI recommends for 9mm auto-loading pistols...but looking in my Speer handloading book, they recommend 1.100" OAL for 125 gr bullets, and 1.080" for 100 gr bullets... I'll try another 50 with the shorter rounds; or if I can find a box here that are shorter than 1.169"... Gotta get another pound of 231...I'm out...

12-13-2009, 10:03 PM	#17
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,230 Thanks: 113 Thanked 703 Times in 365 Posts	Ya the astra 400 is big they didnt call it the "pipe wrench" for nothing, makes an effective club when you run ottta ammo __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

02-25-2010, 02:48 PM	#19
saab-bob User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: So Cal Posts: 459 Thanks: 774 Thanked 143 Times in 87 Posts	To Postino Interesting post-war version of the ASTRA 300. Has a exposed hammer. Nice gun and fairly rare. Bob __________________ "I think,therefore I own guns"

02-26-2010, 02:26 AM	#20
Steve Richards User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Beaverton, Oregon Posts: 487 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	A very nice Astra 4000. Does the magazine have a cutout at the top left front corrner? Mine does and the few replacement grips that I have seen do not. A very good book on Astra is Astra Automatic Pistols by Leonardo Antaris. He will have a new edition out in a couple of months but the current one is well worth the price. He also has a book on Star pistols. I do not collect Star so cannot vouch for the book except to say that if it is comparable to his Astra book, it should be excellent. Steve