Other east bloc countries refurbishing?

jeffs · 07-14-2009, 03:45 PM

Dear Experts

Would anyone know if east bloc countries beside East Germany reworked captured lugers, of if East Germany reworked them for other east bloc countries? Is it reasonable to assume that, if a Russian captured (X'ed) luger has been reworked or has post war replacement parts, it was done by the East Germans, even if there are no proofs applied?

Thanks,
Jeff

Edward Tinker · 07-14-2009, 04:14 PM

Jeff, not sure I follow the question; sorry.

I think you are asking if east germans reworked other countries lugers. I believe the answer is no; but I could very well be wrong.

But this is what I understand.

East Germany; refurbed their lugers in stock and made about 1000 new ones during the 1950's and made new parts.

Austria, as far as I know with the lugers left behind it is unknown if they made their own parts or if they refurbed their own.

Russia mostly did not "issue" the lugers that were captured, but dipped them in a solution and then stored them. I beleive, but just my opinion is that those that needed repair or possibly checked to see if they needed work, were then "X"d and placed in storage. But many have come with other russian captured stocks and were never "X"d. Also, I have heard from folks who went out to the sites where they were stored that many were dipped, placed in huge 50 gallon drums of oil and when checked to be sold, grips were disentergrated and thus plastic grips were put on them.

As an aside, Norway refurbed the lugers left behind and in stock, and most likely made some new parts.

Ed

jeffs · 07-14-2009, 04:31 PM

HI Ed

Thanks! What I am trying to figure out is if a Luger has been dipped in the famous Russian black, has the Russian X, and has Russian grips with vertical ridges, but also seems to have some undipped replacement parts that appear to have a Krieghoff-like look to them (take down lever, side plate, and possibly the toggles), does that mean that the work was done by the East Germans?

All this obsessing is about this pistol:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=134033291

I know that Russian dipped does not necessarily mean East German/Vopo, but does evidence of East German rework mean that the Luger in all likelyhood served some role in East Germany, rather than in some other east bloc country? I would like to buy this pistol if I can be reasonably sure that it saw some role in East Germany, rather then either just sitting in Russian storage someplace, and rather than seeing use in some other east bloc country.

Does this make any sense at all!?! Am I way off base here?

Thanks!
Jeff

sheepherder · 07-14-2009, 07:16 PM

Buy it quick!!!

Drachenstein · 07-15-2009, 12:03 AM

Seems a bit much for a mismatched VOPO

jeffs · 07-15-2009, 08:18 AM

Would you agree that it is East German/Vopo in origin?

Jeff

jamese · 07-15-2009, 08:38 AM

$800 seems to be on the high end for this shooter

Drachenstein · 07-15-2009, 10:33 AM

The unmarked toggle leads me to believe it's a VOPO. A mismatch is a mismatch, it's a shooter, $800 is a little on the high end. For $800 a vopo should be all matching, excluding of course the magazine and grips.

Lugerdoc · 07-15-2009, 10:42 AM

Jeff, Most DDR used rehabed PO8 have some DDR proofing added or even unit markings. Most of the others were used to supply communist "national liberation" groups such as in Chile, Lebanon, etc. or after German unification, sold commerically for hard currency. TH

jeffs · 07-15-2009, 11:18 AM

Thanks!

Jeff

07-14-2009, 03:45 PM	#1
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Other east bloc countries refurbishing? Dear Experts Would anyone know if east bloc countries beside East Germany reworked captured lugers, of if East Germany reworked them for other east bloc countries? Is it reasonable to assume that, if a Russian captured (X'ed) luger has been reworked or has post war replacement parts, it was done by the East Germans, even if there are no proofs applied? Thanks, Jeff

07-15-2009, 08:38 AM	#7
jamese User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South Florida Posts: 789 Thanks: 0 Thanked 84 Times in 34 Posts	$800 seems to be on the high end for this shooter __________________ The "truth" is a matter of Perception

07-15-2009, 10:42 AM	#9
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Jeff, Most DDR used rehabed PO8 have some DDR proofing added or even unit markings. Most of the others were used to supply communist "national liberation" groups such as in Chile, Lebanon, etc. or after German unification, sold commerically for hard currency. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

07-14-2009, 04:14 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	Jeff, not sure I follow the question; sorry. I think you are asking if east germans reworked other countries lugers. I believe the answer is no; but I could very well be wrong. But this is what I understand. East Germany; refurbed their lugers in stock and made about 1000 new ones during the 1950's and made new parts. Austria, as far as I know with the lugers left behind it is unknown if they made their own parts or if they refurbed their own. Russia mostly did not "issue" the lugers that were captured, but dipped them in a solution and then stored them. I beleive, but just my opinion is that those that needed repair or possibly checked to see if they needed work, were then "X"d and placed in storage. But many have come with other russian captured stocks and were never "X"d. Also, I have heard from folks who went out to the sites where they were stored that many were dipped, placed in huge 50 gallon drums of oil and when checked to be sold, grips were disentergrated and thus plastic grips were put on them. As an aside, Norway refurbed the lugers left behind and in stock, and most likely made some new parts. Ed

07-14-2009, 04:31 PM	#3
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	HI Ed Thanks! What I am trying to figure out is if a Luger has been dipped in the famous Russian black, has the Russian X, and has Russian grips with vertical ridges, but also seems to have some undipped replacement parts that appear to have a Krieghoff-like look to them (take down lever, side plate, and possibly the toggles), does that mean that the work was done by the East Germans? All this obsessing is about this pistol: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=134033291 I know that Russian dipped does not necessarily mean East German/Vopo, but does evidence of East German rework mean that the Luger in all likelyhood served some role in East Germany, rather than in some other east bloc country? I would like to buy this pistol if I can be reasonably sure that it saw some role in East Germany, rather then either just sitting in Russian storage someplace, and rather than seeing use in some other east bloc country. Does this make any sense at all!?! Am I way off base here? Thanks! Jeff

07-14-2009, 07:16 PM	#4
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,398 Thanked 4,440 Times in 2,328 Posts	Buy it quick!!!

07-15-2009, 12:03 AM	#5
Drachenstein User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Elizabethtown, KY Posts: 78 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Seems a bit much for a mismatched VOPO

07-15-2009, 08:18 AM	#6
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Would you agree that it is East German/Vopo in origin? Jeff

07-15-2009, 10:33 AM	#8
Drachenstein User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Elizabethtown, KY Posts: 78 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	The unmarked toggle leads me to believe it's a VOPO. A mismatch is a mismatch, it's a shooter, $800 is a little on the high end. For $800 a vopo should be all matching, excluding of course the magazine and grips.

07-15-2009, 11:18 AM	#10
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks! Jeff