FFL in Western Washinton

BW2723 · 09-15-2014, 12:59 PM

Any members know an FFL in Western Washinton State who can appraise and evauate the condition of a luger? I'm a new collector and want to find someone who I can learn and do business with.

Edward Tinker · 09-15-2014, 01:25 PM

Welcome to the forum

Big difference in an FFL / dealer and someone who knows lugers - lots of so-called long time collectors don't know a lot. Present company excepted

See New Collectors area, read the how to ID a luger, then post words and description here and lots of pictures, full left, full right, top, serial number and suffix, and some close ups.

No offense, you'll do better here than most shops.

I grew up on the dry side..

BW2723 · 09-15-2014, 01:42 PM

Thanks Ed, how do I reach you directly?

BW2723 · 09-15-2014, 05:32 PM

Thank you so much.
I appreciate your reply but can't for the following reasons:
The luger that I'm interested in purchasing is not in my possession at this time. Its offered for sale over the internet. I don't feel comfortable using the sellers pics w/o his permission nor do I want to advertise his gun on the forum which would undercut my position.
I've learned a great deal so far from your forum. I sold off much of my gun collection this past year because I really enjoy the history and feel of lugers. I've spent hours reading your posts so that I can make good decisions about which lugers are right for me- thats another story.
One of the more important lessons learned from your forum is how a buyers greed can "color" his choices. It can be extremely difficult determining whether or not a gun has been re-blued or reconditioned especially when it looks so good in your hand!!! Furthermore, trying to recover the loss of a collectable is daunting in our legal system. I don't know much about buyers rights or internet fraud but most buyers just seem to accept their loss and move on.
So thats why I'm looking for a "pro" to help me out. I would prefer having a professioal opinion before a purchase rather than afterwards. With only three days to examine a purchase that would mean a "pro with an FFL".
I'm sure there is someone in Washington State who knows more about collectible Lugers than I do.
Someone on the wet side.
Yours truly- BW

Edward Tinker · 09-15-2014, 07:17 PM

I know several collectors in Washington, but here or there...

If on gun broker than probably 1/3 of the people here have already looked. If on a dealers site, more so.

I suggest you buy from a well known dealer with a good rep. Although I always say, before buying anything, decide on what interests you. Can't be a "Luger" because variations are many. WWI, WWII, weimar, army, police, shooter or Collectable.

And if you expect a FFL receiving to appraise it for you, either I'd expect to pay them, or...

Buy books, buy from the forum, buy from a reputable dealer. I would say EVERY collector has bought something in poorer condition or something wrong with it, to include myself

TheRomanhistorian · 09-16-2014, 03:55 AM

Out of curiosity, where are you located? There are a few Lugers available locally (Pinto's in Renton, WA has two at the moment) and I've dealt with them many times for firearms transfers. Don't know if anyone will 'appraise' in that sense though.

Unless you happen, perhaps, to leave near one of our W. Washingtonian collectors who can come over and take a look for you...

Which variations are you interested in (by the way)?

sheepherder · 09-16-2014, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BW2723

I don't know much about buyers rights or internet fraud but most buyers just seem to accept their loss and move on.

That's because even if you have a generous/honest seller who will take back a Luger you don't want, cost can be prohibitive.

Let's say I buy a Luger from Joe Blow here on the forum. Joe's pictures are poor and few in number, so I can only go on his description. The Luger is a variation I already have , but I want one in better condition, so I pay for the pistol + $20 shipping and $40 for my FFL receiver/LGS to receive it. I decide it's not in any better condition than the one I have (I'm upgrading), so I ask to return it and get my purchase price back. Joe agrees, and now I pay another $20 shipping plus $40 to my FFL receiver/LGS to send it back.

Now I'm back where I started, except I'm $120 poorer.

Some FFL receivers here in NYS will charge less ($25 is lowest I've seen) but they will also charge NYS sales tax [8%]. Gas prices also play a part. I get 15mpg @$4/gal. It's not worth it to me to pay an additional $10 for gas to a $25 receiver who charges NYS sales tax. Some sellers will only send 2-Day or even Overnight Delivery, more $$$.

And hereabouts, even a Luger in less than 'collector' condition will command a premium, so selling it is easier/cheaper to do than returning it.

Just my $.02...

TheRomanhistorian · 09-16-2014, 09:45 AM

Rich raises good points about the process of three-day inspection (Checkpoint Charlies is a good place, Mr. Justmann is great to deal with for that and Simpsons Ltd. are good in general, though I don't remember their inspection policy (they have such excellent photos that I've not had to return any pistol I've gotten from them).

I know Pinto's charges $30 for a transfer (plus WA sales tax) and West Coast Armory is $50 per transfer plus sales tax (I've used both numerous times to handle my Luger or Webley transfers).

I forgot to ask: Have you considered putting up a 'Want to buy' thread here on the Forum? One of our members generally has a Luger they might want to pass on as they improve their own collections.

Best,

Michael

JD · 09-17-2014, 04:15 PM

I'm a life long western Washington resident, and I can tell you that there are no FFL's in this part of the state that really know much of about lugers.... There are some great FFL's around... I really like Pinto's Guns and have know Diana since she was about 5 years old, but she calls me to find out about lugers, and I'm not really an expert.... None of the other shops around, I would consider to be an expert. If I was forced to chose an FFL who might have some knowledge, I'd talk to Bruce at DJ's Loans in Bothel. Bruce is an expert on old Winchesters and Colts, and is sharp enough to do some research and give an educated opinion....

Really, the most knowledgeable people that you could hope to find are right here on this board. If it were me, I'd post photos here and ask for opinions. You won't find this kind of knowledge anywhere else, and you could pay a hefty penalty if you buy something that isn't what you think....

CAP Black · 09-17-2014, 06:25 PM

I would think that most FFL's don't have much traffic in Lugers therefore why should we expect them to be experts on the subject?
Thanks
Jack

Sergio Natali · 09-18-2014, 03:33 AM

I completely agre with Edward, and with the above posts, to own a FF Licence doesn't necessarily make you an expert on a certain sort of gun, especially on "niche" guns as Lugers are.
Probably the most knowledgeable people that you could hope to find are right here on this forum.
Personally I've made so many mistakes with guns, and the chances to get something different from what you expected makes me say that before I buy something I prefer to see it in my hands, although I realize that sometimes is a bit difficult.

My2 cents

Segio

BW2723 · 09-18-2014, 07:02 PM

You guys are awesome. Thanks for your ideas about how to deal with this situation. I am getting another opinion however before the purchase is finalized. I'll let you know more if the deal goes through.

09-15-2014, 12:59 PM	#1
BW2723 New User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	FFL in Western Washinton Any members know an FFL in Western Washinton State who can appraise and evauate the condition of a luger? I'm a new collector and want to find someone who I can learn and do business with.

09-15-2014, 01:25 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,916 Thanks: 1,995 Thanked 4,507 Times in 2,081 Posts	Welcome to the forum Big difference in an FFL / dealer and someone who knows lugers - lots of so-called long time collectors don't know a lot. Present company excepted See New Collectors area, read the how to ID a luger, then post words and description here and lots of pictures, full left, full right, top, serial number and suffix, and some close ups. No offense, you'll do better here than most shops. I grew up on the dry side.. __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

09-15-2014, 07:17 PM	#5
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,916 Thanks: 1,995 Thanked 4,507 Times in 2,081 Posts	I know several collectors in Washington, but here or there... If on gun broker than probably 1/3 of the people here have already looked. If on a dealers site, more so. I suggest you buy from a well known dealer with a good rep. Although I always say, before buying anything, decide on what interests you. Can't be a "Luger" because variations are many. WWI, WWII, weimar, army, police, shooter or Collectable. And if you expect a FFL receiving to appraise it for you, either I'd expect to pay them, or... Buy books, buy from the forum, buy from a reputable dealer. I would say EVERY collector has bought something in poorer condition or something wrong with it, to include myself __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

09-16-2014, 03:55 AM	#6
TheRomanhistorian User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 301 Thanks: 170 Thanked 88 Times in 64 Posts	Out of curiosity, where are you located? There are a few Lugers available locally (Pinto's in Renton, WA has two at the moment) and I've dealt with them many times for firearms transfers. Don't know if anyone will 'appraise' in that sense though. Unless you happen, perhaps, to leave near one of our W. Washingtonian collectors who can come over and take a look for you... Which variations are you interested in (by the way)? __________________ Michael Nos morituri te salutant - Supposed saying of the gladiators to the emperor ('We, who are about to die, salute you.') 'We are the lantern bearers, my friend; for us to keep something burning, to carry what light we can forward into the darkness and the wind' - From Rosemary Sutcliff's The Lantern Bearers

09-16-2014, 09:45 AM	#8
TheRomanhistorian User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 301 Thanks: 170 Thanked 88 Times in 64 Posts	Rich raises good points about the process of three-day inspection (Checkpoint Charlies is a good place, Mr. Justmann is great to deal with for that and Simpsons Ltd. are good in general, though I don't remember their inspection policy (they have such excellent photos that I've not had to return any pistol I've gotten from them). I know Pinto's charges $30 for a transfer (plus WA sales tax) and West Coast Armory is $50 per transfer plus sales tax (I've used both numerous times to handle my Luger or Webley transfers). I forgot to ask: Have you considered putting up a 'Want to buy' thread here on the Forum? One of our members generally has a Luger they might want to pass on as they improve their own collections. Best, Michael __________________ Michael Nos morituri te salutant - Supposed saying of the gladiators to the emperor ('We, who are about to die, salute you.') 'We are the lantern bearers, my friend; for us to keep something burning, to carry what light we can forward into the darkness and the wind' - From Rosemary Sutcliff's The Lantern Bearers

09-15-2014, 01:42 PM	#3
BW2723 New User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Ed, how do I reach you directly?

09-15-2014, 05:32 PM	#4
BW2723 New User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thank you so much. I appreciate your reply but can't for the following reasons: The luger that I'm interested in purchasing is not in my possession at this time. Its offered for sale over the internet. I don't feel comfortable using the sellers pics w/o his permission nor do I want to advertise his gun on the forum which would undercut my position. I've learned a great deal so far from your forum. I sold off much of my gun collection this past year because I really enjoy the history and feel of lugers. I've spent hours reading your posts so that I can make good decisions about which lugers are right for me- thats another story. One of the more important lessons learned from your forum is how a buyers greed can "color" his choices. It can be extremely difficult determining whether or not a gun has been re-blued or reconditioned especially when it looks so good in your hand!!! Furthermore, trying to recover the loss of a collectable is daunting in our legal system. I don't know much about buyers rights or internet fraud but most buyers just seem to accept their loss and move on. So thats why I'm looking for a "pro" to help me out. I would prefer having a professioal opinion before a purchase rather than afterwards. With only three days to examine a purchase that would mean a "pro with an FFL". I'm sure there is someone in Washington State who knows more about collectible Lugers than I do. Someone on the wet side. Yours truly- BW

09-17-2014, 04:15 PM	#9
JD User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Western Washington Posts: 107 Thanks: 58 Thanked 22 Times in 17 Posts	I'm a life long western Washington resident, and I can tell you that there are no FFL's in this part of the state that really know much of about lugers.... There are some great FFL's around... I really like Pinto's Guns and have know Diana since she was about 5 years old, but she calls me to find out about lugers, and I'm not really an expert.... None of the other shops around, I would consider to be an expert. If I was forced to chose an FFL who might have some knowledge, I'd talk to Bruce at DJ's Loans in Bothel. Bruce is an expert on old Winchesters and Colts, and is sharp enough to do some research and give an educated opinion.... Really, the most knowledgeable people that you could hope to find are right here on this board. If it were me, I'd post photos here and ask for opinions. You won't find this kind of knowledge anywhere else, and you could pay a hefty penalty if you buy something that isn't what you think....

09-17-2014, 06:25 PM	#10
CAP Black User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Fairmont, WV Right here in Mountaineer country and God's country Posts: 767 Thanks: 100 Thanked 168 Times in 96 Posts	I would think that most FFL's don't have much traffic in Lugers therefore why should we expect them to be experts on the subject? Thanks Jack

09-18-2014, 03:33 AM	#11
Sergio Natali User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Somewhere in Northern Italy Posts: 2,646 Thanks: 1,082 Thanked 1,783 Times in 1,007 Posts	I completely agre with Edward, and with the above posts, to own a FF Licence doesn't necessarily make you an expert on a certain sort of gun, especially on "niche" guns as Lugers are. Probably the most knowledgeable people that you could hope to find are right here on this forum. Personally I've made so many mistakes with guns, and the chances to get something different from what you expected makes me say that before I buy something I prefer to see it in my hands, although I realize that sometimes is a bit difficult. My2 cents Segio __________________ "Originality can't be restored and should be at the top of any collector's priority list.

09-18-2014, 07:02 PM	#12
BW2723 New User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	You guys are awesome. Thanks for your ideas about how to deal with this situation. I am getting another opinion however before the purchase is finalized. I'll let you know more if the deal goes through.