1914 Erfurt markings?

rboandl1@aol.com · 11-30-2009, 03:31 PM

This Erfurt has 1914 and 1920 stamped on top, and has "II./J.R. 6.41" on the frame. Any clues as to what it means? Thanks in advance !

Ron Smith · 11-30-2009, 04:06 PM

Hi Ron,

Welcome to the forum.

The Luger is marked to post WWI Reichswehr 2nd Battalion / Infantry Regiment 6 weapon #41. The "1920" isn't a date, as much as a Gov't property mark applied after WWI to prevent theft from inventory.

Can you post some photos?

Ron

rboandl1@aol.com · 11-30-2009, 05:18 PM

Thanks for the info Ron, I'm considering purchasing the weapon and I only have a few photos. I'll post them as soon as I can figure out how.

rboandl1@aol.com · 11-30-2009, 05:33 PM

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rboandl1@aol.com · 11-30-2009, 05:37 PM

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Norme · 11-30-2009, 06:36 PM

Hi Ron, A couple of cautions if you are considering buying this pistol. It appears to have been been refinished at some point and heavily buffed. The magazine (which dates from about 1936) is dented, which might make it a tight fit. Regards, Norm

rboandl1@aol.com · 12-02-2009, 11:52 AM

Thanks Norm, I checked with the owner and he said it was not refinished and the mags don't match. Any idea of it's worth?

Thor · 12-02-2009, 12:09 PM

Not to rain on anyones parade, but that gun definetly has been refinished. No Erfurt is that shiny as issued, they are rougher finished than DWMs. The top view of the chamber area is really shiny. Check the safety marking for paint, check the inside of the receiver forks and top of the inside of the frame to be polished white steel, not bluing. Check the inside of the mag well in the frame, it should be polished white steel, not blued. The strawing on the different parts are not consistent in color, another thing I would look for. The bluing on the inside of the frame ears on the outside of the frame is not consitent with the high areas, it looks like it was bead blasted then the high areas polished and salt blued. This pistol should be rust blued and it just doesnt look right to me with what I can see. A 1914 Erfurt would not have a notched top receiver unless it was for a 1914 Erfurt Artillery Luger. The common notching practice did not start until 1916 with both standard 4" and 8" Lugers having this notch in the top of the receiver. Please take my comments kindly as they were intended that way.

Ron Smith · 12-02-2009, 12:14 PM

Value in that condition is around $500, as a shooter. Collector value has been destroyed.

Ron Wood · 12-02-2009, 12:23 PM

Giving him the benefit of doubt, the owner may not think it has been refinished, but it has and certainly not authentically. Norme spotted it and Thor has pointed out what is wrong. It is a good looking gun but has been removed from collectable status. The value therefore is as a shooter and representative piece until a collector quality example can be obtained. I have no idea what value the holster has but the gun is in the $500-$700 shooter category.

P.S. Man! I've got to learn to type faster or stop letting Ron Smith's thoughts get through to my brain.

Ron Smith · 12-02-2009, 12:38 PM

"Man! I've got to learn to type faster or stop letting Ron Smith's thoughts get through to my brain."

I am Omnipotent!!

(whew! big word..., now I have to take a nap...)

rboandl1@aol.com · 12-03-2009, 01:39 AM

Thanks everyone, I appreciate all the feedback. Now I know at least some of the things to look for.

11-30-2009, 03:31 PM	#1
rboandl1@aol.com User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1914 Erfurt markings? This Erfurt has 1914 and 1920 stamped on top, and has "II./J.R. 6.41" on the frame. Any clues as to what it means? Thanks in advance !

11-30-2009, 04:06 PM	#2
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Hi Ron, Welcome to the forum. The Luger is marked to post WWI Reichswehr 2nd Battalion / Infantry Regiment 6 weapon #41. The "1920" isn't a date, as much as a Gov't property mark applied after WWI to prevent theft from inventory. Can you post some photos? Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

12-02-2009, 12:09 PM	#8
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Not to rain on anyones parade, but that gun definetly has been refinished. No Erfurt is that shiny as issued, they are rougher finished than DWMs. The top view of the chamber area is really shiny. Check the safety marking for paint, check the inside of the receiver forks and top of the inside of the frame to be polished white steel, not bluing. Check the inside of the mag well in the frame, it should be polished white steel, not blued. The strawing on the different parts are not consistent in color, another thing I would look for. The bluing on the inside of the frame ears on the outside of the frame is not consitent with the high areas, it looks like it was bead blasted then the high areas polished and salt blued. This pistol should be rust blued and it just doesnt look right to me with what I can see. A 1914 Erfurt would not have a notched top receiver unless it was for a 1914 Erfurt Artillery Luger. The common notching practice did not start until 1916 with both standard 4" and 8" Lugers having this notch in the top of the receiver. Please take my comments kindly as they were intended that way. __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

12-02-2009, 12:14 PM	#9
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Value in that condition is around $500, as a shooter. Collector value has been destroyed. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

12-02-2009, 12:23 PM	#10
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,988 Thanks: 1,067 Thanked 5,096 Times in 1,676 Posts	Giving him the benefit of doubt, the owner may not think it has been refinished, but it has and certainly not authentically. Norme spotted it and Thor has pointed out what is wrong. It is a good looking gun but has been removed from collectable status. The value therefore is as a shooter and representative piece until a collector quality example can be obtained. I have no idea what value the holster has but the gun is in the $500-$700 shooter category. P.S. Man! I've got to learn to type faster or stop letting Ron Smith's thoughts get through to my brain. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

11-30-2009, 05:18 PM	#3
rboandl1@aol.com User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for the info Ron, I'm considering purchasing the weapon and I only have a few photos. I'll post them as soon as I can figure out how.

11-30-2009, 05:33 PM	#4
rboandl1@aol.com User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

11-30-2009, 05:37 PM	#5
rboandl1@aol.com User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

11-30-2009, 06:36 PM	#6
Norme Always A Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,414 Thanks: 224 Thanked 2,591 Times in 930 Posts	Hi Ron, A couple of cautions if you are considering buying this pistol. It appears to have been been refinished at some point and heavily buffed. The magazine (which dates from about 1936) is dented, which might make it a tight fit. Regards, Norm

12-02-2009, 11:52 AM	#7
rboandl1@aol.com User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Norm, I checked with the owner and he said it was not refinished and the mags don't match. Any idea of it's worth?

12-02-2009, 12:38 PM	#11
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	"Man! I've got to learn to type faster or stop letting Ron Smith's thoughts get through to my brain." I am Omnipotent!! (whew! big word..., now I have to take a nap...) __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

12-03-2009, 01:39 AM	#12
rboandl1@aol.com User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks everyone, I appreciate all the feedback. Now I know at least some of the things to look for.