My .30 Reloads ran great today

spacecoast · 12-27-2014, 01:20 PM

After today's regular NRA Outdoor Bullseye match at the local range, we had a 30-round "fun match" - National Match Course format (10 rounds slow fire at 50 yards, 10 rounds Timed Fire and 10 round Rapid Fire at 25 yards each).

I was a little apprehensive about shooting my 1922 Commercial Luger in the fun match because I had only tried a dozen rounds each of several reload recipes in it before today. I even took a 9mm Luger as a backup in case the .30s wouldn't feed reliably. However, it ran flawlessly for all 30 rounds using 4.1 gr. of AA#2 under the 93 grain bullets and brass I picked up here from GT.

Accuracy-wise, I was pretty pleased with the gun as well. Even with the typically heavy, creepy Luger trigger, 3-7/8" barrel, fixed sights and lack of trigger time with the gun, I had a 72 at slow fire, 87 at timed fire and 81 at rapid fire for a 240/300 aggregate. I normally shoot around 800 in a 900 match just for comparison purposes, averaging 82-85 slow fire and 92-94 timed and rapid fire with a nice High Standard .22 (iron sights).

All of my .30 rounds were loaded to 1.16" OAL. Thanks to everyone here for the prior advice for how to make reliably feeding reloads.

rhuff · 12-27-2014, 03:36 PM

That is excellent news, and thanks for the followup. I will bet that you were the ONLY one in the contest shooting a 30 Luger chambered Luger. It does take a bit of time and practice to get used to most Luger trigger pulls. I have one that is terrible, but another that is just not too bad. To have 100% reliability is awesome for most Lugers. Congrats!!

sheepherder · 12-27-2014, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spacecoast

...using 4.1 gr. of AA#2 under the 93 grain bullets...

Sounds good to me! I'm currently keeping my ears pricked

for "unpopular" powders that function in 9mm and 7.65 Parabellum calibers.

Not many people hereabouts reload with AA#2 so that powder is largely ignored.

My chart shows it to be fast-burning, and 4.1grs a fairly 'light' load...Maybe 1000-1100fps???

spacecoast · 12-27-2014, 05:19 PM

Quote:

I will bet that you were the ONLY one in the contest shooting a 30 Luger chambered Luger.

Yeah, you bet right. I've never seen another .30 at that range or any other, and hardly any Lugers shooting at all ever.

I should also mention that the gun shoots maybe 6" high at 50 yards, I ended up aiming at the bottom of the 8-ring when I figured out where it was shooting. It was much closer to POA at 25 yards, of course.

Quote:

My chart shows it to be fast-burning, and 4.1grs a fairly 'light' load...Maybe 1000-1100fps???

That sounds reasonable, I would have put it at near-supersonic speeds from the way it sounded, but haven't chronographed it. That same load of AA#2 under a 115 gr. plated round nose is also pretty light (for a 9mm) but it runs my Ruger P95 and Hi-Point 995 TS (rifle) just fine as well as my 9mm Lugers.

nukem556 · 12-27-2014, 09:01 PM

What dies are you using?

sheepherder · 12-27-2014, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nukem556

What dies are you using?

Taper crimp or roll crimp???

spacecoast · 12-27-2014, 09:31 PM

RCBS dies (2-piece). I don't mind the combo primer removal and expansion dies, but I wish I had separate seating and crimping dies as the adjustment of both operations simultaneously is tricky. I ruined a few pieces of brass getting it right.

I believe that a taper crimp is applied with these dies.

sheepherder · 12-27-2014, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spacecoast

RCBS dies (2-piece). I don't mind the combo primer removal and expansion dies, but I wish I had separate seating and crimping dies as the adjustment of both operations simultaneously is tricky. I ruined a few pieces of brass getting it right.

I believe that a taper crimp is applied with these dies.

I also have the RCBS 25001 die set, but I use a 22-250 decapping pin/punch in a 44 Magnum sizer die to punch out the primers before tumbling (and before sizing). I just got into the habit long ago. It probably has no benefit. It doesn't do anything to the case itself. I've convinced myself that it cleans out the primer pocket before the other operations. I do the same for pretty much all my reloading.

Someone here mentioned a Lee roll crimping die for seating/crimping the bullet. If anyone knows the Lee part number, I'd like to try it. None of my .308" bullets have a cannelure, but it's something to try.

I had one of those collet-crimping dies once, like a R8 collet, and it was pretty much worthless. I forget what I was crimping/reloading, but I like the basic idea.

sheepherder · 12-28-2014, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick W.

I did not know that RCBS had a taper crimp die for the 30 Luger, always thought the basic die on a RCBS set for a shouldered cartridge die a roll crimp.

...???...Just curious: How do you roll crimp when there is no cannelure???

It's possible that RCBS has changed die forms over the years...I know there are at least three different RCBS die set numbers for the 8mm Nambu; possible for the 7.65 Parabellum as well...

The problem I had with the R8-style collet crimping die was that I could not get enough leverage on the collet/press to compress the collet. It worked by drawing the collet down in the die and the lip was supposed to compress the case mouth...It didn't...The bench would lift off the floor first...

spacecoast · 12-28-2014, 10:35 AM

I rechecked the RCBS instructions and it has a section for either a roll crimp or a taper crimp. I followed the taper crimp instructions. The bullets I am using have a cannelure, but it is very low in the bullet and nowhere near where the case mouth gets crimped.

rhuff · 12-28-2014, 05:49 PM

Many years ago, I purchased a cannalure tool to try in various reloading experiments. I use it 100% on all of the .308in. jacketed bullets for the 30 Luger brass. Once seated, on a separate station of my press, I have a Lee Factory Crimp die(#90175) that applies a collet crimp into the cannalure. I also use this type of crimping die for 38-40 brass(bottleneck brass) and it applies a uniform, thin 360 degree crimp. I don't use the Lee FCD for any other brass, just the bottleneck brass.

My press toolhead has a variety of brands of dies, as I kept experimenting to find out what works the best for me in my press. I believe that I have found the formula.

Sieger · 01-05-2015, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spacecoast

After today's regular NRA Outdoor Bullseye match at the local range, we had a 30-round "fun match" - National Match Course format (10 rounds slow fire at 50 yards, 10 rounds Timed Fire and 10 round Rapid Fire at 25 yards each).

I was a little apprehensive about shooting my 1922 Commercial Luger in the fun match because I had only tried a dozen rounds each of several reload recipes in it before today. I even took a 9mm Luger as a backup in case the .30s wouldn't feed reliably. However, it ran flawlessly for all 30 rounds using 4.1 gr. of AA#2 under the 93 grain bullets and brass I picked up here from GT.

Accuracy-wise, I was pretty pleased with the gun as well. Even with the typically heavy, creepy Luger trigger, 3-7/8" barrel, fixed sights and lack of trigger time with the gun, I had a 72 at slow fire, 87 at timed fire and 81 at rapid fire for a 240/300 aggregate. I normally shoot around 800 in a 900 match just for comparison purposes, averaging 82-85 slow fire and 92-94 timed and rapid fire with a nice High Standard .22 (iron sights).

All of my .30 rounds were loaded to 1.16" OAL. Thanks to everyone here for the prior advice for how to make reliably feeding reloads.

Hi,

If you really want to shoot your Luger for accuracy and fun, here are some suggestions.

Medium to slow powders perform best and will bring your sights right "on" at 25 yards. If you have them, you might try Power Pistol or Herco as powder alternatives.

With round nose bullets, 1.173 inches should be about perfect for totally reliable feeding from a full 8 round magazine.

Lugers are really accurate shooters when they have their loads tuned properly!! Three shot clover leaves are common.

Good shooting!

Sieger

12-27-2014, 01:20 PM	#1
spacecoast User Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: FL and PA Posts: 332 Thanks: 276 Thanked 243 Times in 109 Posts	My .30 Reloads ran great today After today's regular NRA Outdoor Bullseye match at the local range, we had a 30-round "fun match" - National Match Course format (10 rounds slow fire at 50 yards, 10 rounds Timed Fire and 10 round Rapid Fire at 25 yards each). I was a little apprehensive about shooting my 1922 Commercial Luger in the fun match because I had only tried a dozen rounds each of several reload recipes in it before today. I even took a 9mm Luger as a backup in case the .30s wouldn't feed reliably. However, it ran flawlessly for all 30 rounds using 4.1 gr. of AA#2 under the 93 grain bullets and brass I picked up here from GT. Accuracy-wise, I was pretty pleased with the gun as well. Even with the typically heavy, creepy Luger trigger, 3-7/8" barrel, fixed sights and lack of trigger time with the gun, I had a 72 at slow fire, 87 at timed fire and 81 at rapid fire for a 240/300 aggregate. I normally shoot around 800 in a 900 match just for comparison purposes, averaging 82-85 slow fire and 92-94 timed and rapid fire with a nice High Standard .22 (iron sights). All of my .30 rounds were loaded to 1.16" OAL. Thanks to everyone here for the prior advice for how to make reliably feeding reloads.

12-27-2014, 03:36 PM	#2
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,270 Thanks: 2,686 Thanked 958 Times in 704 Posts	That is excellent news, and thanks for the followup. I will bet that you were the ONLY one in the contest shooting a 30 Luger chambered Luger. It does take a bit of time and practice to get used to most Luger trigger pulls. I have one that is terrible, but another that is just not too bad. To have 100% reliability is awesome for most Lugers. Congrats!!

12-27-2014, 09:01 PM	#5
nukem556 User Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Irmo, SC Posts: 625 Thanks: 35 Thanked 168 Times in 107 Posts	What dies are you using?

12-27-2014, 09:31 PM	#7
spacecoast User Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: FL and PA Posts: 332 Thanks: 276 Thanked 243 Times in 109 Posts	RCBS dies (2-piece). I don't mind the combo primer removal and expansion dies, but I wish I had separate seating and crimping dies as the adjustment of both operations simultaneously is tricky. I ruined a few pieces of brass getting it right. I believe that a taper crimp is applied with these dies.

12-28-2014, 10:35 AM	#10
spacecoast User Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: FL and PA Posts: 332 Thanks: 276 Thanked 243 Times in 109 Posts	I rechecked the RCBS instructions and it has a section for either a roll crimp or a taper crimp. I followed the taper crimp instructions. The bullets I am using have a cannelure, but it is very low in the bullet and nowhere near where the case mouth gets crimped.

12-28-2014, 05:49 PM	#11
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,270 Thanks: 2,686 Thanked 958 Times in 704 Posts	Many years ago, I purchased a cannalure tool to try in various reloading experiments. I use it 100% on all of the .308in. jacketed bullets for the 30 Luger brass. Once seated, on a separate station of my press, I have a Lee Factory Crimp die(#90175) that applies a collet crimp into the cannalure. I also use this type of crimping die for 38-40 brass(bottleneck brass) and it applies a uniform, thin 360 degree crimp. I don't use the Lee FCD for any other brass, just the bottleneck brass. My press toolhead has a variety of brands of dies, as I kept experimenting to find out what works the best for me in my press. I believe that I have found the formula.