Real or fake?

02tobbe · 03-11-2010, 06:22 PM

Can any of you please enlighten me if this is real or fake? The seller says it´s real but I ´m not sure.

Ron Wood · 03-11-2010, 07:27 PM

In my opinion it is a fake. The belt loops and top strap are sewn on incorrectly. The magazine pouch has the WWI method of attachment so the holster should not be marked P08 as that would indicate WWII manufacture.

Ron Smith · 03-11-2010, 07:53 PM

I agree with Ron.

The leather looks like the same as in a Pakistani Rerpo.

The Eagle Swaztika is too large.

"P.08" was not put on holsters until around 1940 or '41 to distinguish them from P.38 holsters. So, it would not be found on a 1939 dated holster.

Ron

lugerholsterrepair · 03-11-2010, 08:03 PM

Yikes! If it were real..and it's not..2 Ron's agree with excellent reasoning, it's still a doggy chew toy. As P08 leather goes, condition is a factor.

Jerry Burney

MP38 · 03-11-2010, 11:27 PM

FAKE!

Belt loops are vertically straight, Flap is wrong, closure strap doesn't look right, materials don't look right, and the Proof marking is WAY too big!

Matt

02tobbe · 03-12-2010, 06:41 AM

Oh crap! I guess I should have checked here before I bought it ;(

The seller guaranteed that it was original, and would take it back if it wasn´t, we´ll see if he stands by that statement.

What would an estimated value for this holster be(if any), including a takedown tool, which obviously also is a fake?

alanint · 03-12-2010, 06:52 AM

You can buy reproduction holsters which are WAY better copies of an original for $25-$29 at IMA, The Sportsmansguide, Cheaper than Dirt, etc.

I would not give $10 for this example.

02tobbe · 03-13-2010, 04:18 PM

Well the seller claims the holster comes from his old grandfather that fought in the war, and has been known to him the last 40 years. He has even given me the name of him and some link to his war merits.

I have also find another mark on the holster, it´s very faint, looks like a makers mark, but it´s veeery hard to read, can´t even manage to get it on photo. It is located right below "1939", it goes something like this: (could be wrong on any letter and number)

HAUNZMH
1931
small nazi eagle
some text in a half cirlce

Any thoughts?

Norme · 03-13-2010, 04:37 PM

Any thoughts? Yes. I think you should heed the advice you have been given. This holster is an obvious fake. Regards, Norm

lugerholsterrepair · 03-13-2010, 05:08 PM

Torbjörn ...Get your money back immediately if you possibly can. 40 years ago was not that long ago. Fakes were made then as they are now.
You can find all the little markings you want and the holster is still a 2 dollar dog chew toy. But hey..it's your money.

Jerry Burney

Ice · 03-13-2010, 05:53 PM

1970 was 40 years ago so thats not so far back. Fakes were made long before 1970.

Charlie

wlyon · 03-13-2010, 10:36 PM

You have been given some expert advice from some leading experts. Jerry especially has looked at and repaired more holsters than one can imagine. If he says fake take it to the bank. Again it's your money. If you continue to collect lugers and use this Forum you will come to realize the vast wealth of knowledge available and for free. Welcome to the Forum. Bill

Vlim · 03-14-2010, 11:08 AM

Yep,

This holster has so many issues that it almost has value as a 'show and tell' version to illustrate what faked holsters look like.

Some issues:
-Leather looks like it has floated in gello for years.
-Stitching and general workmanship is bad.
-Holster is of WW1 type construction yet labeled 1931 and stamped with a P08 marking that was introduced in 1940.
-The nazis were not ruling Germany in 1931.
-Straps are in the wrong place.
-Lid looks like it shrunk, it should be much wider.

I have a hard time believing that the Yak whose bottom this holster was made from died 40 years ago. I think the beast still roams around the mountains of Pakistan with a bad temper and a sore butt.

alanint · 03-14-2010, 11:34 AM

These holsters always have a particular smell to them as well. It comes from whatever evil concoction the Pakistanys "age" it in....

02tobbe · 03-14-2010, 04:57 PM

I really do appreciate your responses, hopefully they´ll help in trying to get my money back.

The year I mentioned, 1931, was wrong, should probably be 1941, found the same faint marking on another holster on the net, see picture. The holster doesn´t smell anything but leather. I know it´s still a fake, just wanted to get the facts correct.

Edit: Forgot the image. As I said, this is another holster but the marking looks identical. Is this ome know mark that fakers use?

Vlim · 03-14-2010, 05:12 PM

Hi,

Noted

Even with the 1941 date it has major issues. Let's hope you can get a refund.

02tobbe · 03-29-2010, 04:03 PM

The seller, who still won´t admit that the holster could be a fake, wanted you guys to look at the gun that belonged to the holster, and see if you thought that was also a fake.

I can´t rellay see the point in this, doesn´t make the holster any more real even if the gun is ok, but he insisted and so here it is. What can you say about the gun, real? Fake? Would it belong in a holster marked 1939 or 1941?

Norme · 03-29-2010, 04:11 PM

Hi, From what I can see in the photos, the gun looks very nice. Tell the seller you'll keep the holster if he throws in the gun. Fat chance! Regards, Norm

mrerick · 03-29-2010, 05:47 PM

Did Mauser ever form the "S" like that on the toggle S/42 ?

MFC · 03-30-2010, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrerick

Did Mauser ever form the "S" like that on the toggle S/42 ?

Yes... on K dates

03-11-2010, 06:22 PM	#1
02tobbe User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 19 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Real or fake? Can any of you please enlighten me if this is real or fake? The seller says it´s real but I ´m not sure.

03-11-2010, 07:27 PM	#2
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	In my opinion it is a fake. The belt loops and top strap are sewn on incorrectly. The magazine pouch has the WWI method of attachment so the holster should not be marked P08 as that would indicate WWII manufacture. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

03-11-2010, 07:53 PM	#3
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	I agree with Ron. The leather looks like the same as in a Pakistani Rerpo. The Eagle Swaztika is too large. "P.08" was not put on holsters until around 1940 or '41 to distinguish them from P.38 holsters. So, it would not be found on a 1939 dated holster. Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

03-11-2010, 08:03 PM	#4
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Yikes! If it were real..and it's not..2 Ron's agree with excellent reasoning, it's still a doggy chew toy. As P08 leather goes, condition is a factor. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

03-13-2010, 05:08 PM	#10
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Torbjörn ...Get your money back immediately if you possibly can. 40 years ago was not that long ago. Fakes were made then as they are now. You can find all the little markings you want and the holster is still a 2 dollar dog chew toy. But hey..it's your money. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

03-11-2010, 11:27 PM	#5
MP38 User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 464 Thanks: 36 Thanked 113 Times in 60 Posts	FAKE! Belt loops are vertically straight, Flap is wrong, closure strap doesn't look right, materials don't look right, and the Proof marking is WAY too big! Matt

03-12-2010, 06:41 AM	#6
02tobbe User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 19 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Oh crap! I guess I should have checked here before I bought it ;( The seller guaranteed that it was original, and would take it back if it wasn´t, we´ll see if he stands by that statement. What would an estimated value for this holster be(if any), including a takedown tool, which obviously also is a fake?

03-12-2010, 06:52 AM	#7
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	You can buy reproduction holsters which are WAY better copies of an original for $25-$29 at IMA, The Sportsmansguide, Cheaper than Dirt, etc. I would not give $10 for this example.

03-13-2010, 04:18 PM	#8
02tobbe User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 19 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Well the seller claims the holster comes from his old grandfather that fought in the war, and has been known to him the last 40 years. He has even given me the name of him and some link to his war merits. I have also find another mark on the holster, it´s very faint, looks like a makers mark, but it´s veeery hard to read, can´t even manage to get it on photo. It is located right below "1939", it goes something like this: (could be wrong on any letter and number) HAUNZMH 1931 small nazi eagle some text in a half cirlce Any thoughts?

03-13-2010, 04:37 PM	#9
Norme Always A Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,414 Thanks: 224 Thanked 2,591 Times in 930 Posts	Any thoughts? Yes. I think you should heed the advice you have been given. This holster is an obvious fake. Regards, Norm

03-13-2010, 05:53 PM	#11
Ice User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 552 Thanks: 13 Thanked 69 Times in 57 Posts	1970 was 40 years ago so thats not so far back. Fakes were made long before 1970. Charlie

03-13-2010, 10:36 PM	#12
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,614 Thanks: 3,140 Thanked 2,519 Times in 939 Posts	You have been given some expert advice from some leading experts. Jerry especially has looked at and repaired more holsters than one can imagine. If he says fake take it to the bank. Again it's your money. If you continue to collect lugers and use this Forum you will come to realize the vast wealth of knowledge available and for free. Welcome to the Forum. Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

03-14-2010, 11:08 AM	#13
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,032 Thanks: 1,018 Thanked 3,873 Times in 1,184 Posts	Yep, This holster has so many issues that it almost has value as a 'show and tell' version to illustrate what faked holsters look like. Some issues: -Leather looks like it has floated in gello for years. -Stitching and general workmanship is bad. -Holster is of WW1 type construction yet labeled 1931 and stamped with a P08 marking that was introduced in 1940. -The nazis were not ruling Germany in 1931. -Straps are in the wrong place. -Lid looks like it shrunk, it should be much wider. I have a hard time believing that the Yak whose bottom this holster was made from died 40 years ago. I think the beast still roams around the mountains of Pakistan with a bad temper and a sore butt.

03-14-2010, 11:34 AM	#14
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	These holsters always have a particular smell to them as well. It comes from whatever evil concoction the Pakistanys "age" it in....

03-14-2010, 04:57 PM	#15
02tobbe User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 19 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I really do appreciate your responses, hopefully they´ll help in trying to get my money back. The year I mentioned, 1931, was wrong, should probably be 1941, found the same faint marking on another holster on the net, see picture. The holster doesn´t smell anything but leather. I know it´s still a fake, just wanted to get the facts correct. Edit: Forgot the image. As I said, this is another holster but the marking looks identical. Is this ome know mark that fakers use? Last edited by 02tobbe; 03-15-2010 at 01:12 PM. Reason: Forgot the image.

03-14-2010, 05:12 PM	#16
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,032 Thanks: 1,018 Thanked 3,873 Times in 1,184 Posts	Hi, Noted Even with the 1941 date it has major issues. Let's hope you can get a refund.

03-29-2010, 04:03 PM	#17
02tobbe User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 19 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The seller, who still won´t admit that the holster could be a fake, wanted you guys to look at the gun that belonged to the holster, and see if you thought that was also a fake. I can´t rellay see the point in this, doesn´t make the holster any more real even if the gun is ok, but he insisted and so here it is. What can you say about the gun, real? Fake? Would it belong in a holster marked 1939 or 1941?

03-29-2010, 04:11 PM	#18
Norme Always A Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,414 Thanks: 224 Thanked 2,591 Times in 930 Posts	Hi, From what I can see in the photos, the gun looks very nice. Tell the seller you'll keep the holster if he throws in the gun. Fat chance! Regards, Norm

03-29-2010, 05:47 PM	#19
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,900 Thanks: 1,370 Thanked 3,094 Times in 1,503 Posts	Did Mauser ever form the "S" like that on the toggle S/42 ?