Imperial proofs - Page 5

Ron Wood · 09-03-2012, 02:13 PM

Here is an enlarged image of one of the rifle chamber markings in the link that Ben provided. I think it is pretty instructive with regard to the difference between a stamped marking and a pantographed marking.

Edward Tinker · 09-03-2012, 02:30 PM

One thing to keep in mind with toggles, is that there are tons of blank toggles out there, either on 'sneaks' or from the factory (WW1, Weimar, WW2, Vopo) that could and were probably used.

Fred, although You paid a ton of money, a conversation piece like this is always interesting. I was 'dogged' out by a couple of collectors but I bought a 'deaths head' luger on purpose, knowing it was fake, because, by gum, I wanted one, that and the price I paid was just above a shooter price.

Ed

Ron Wood · 09-03-2012, 06:41 PM

Based on Klaus' input, no. It appears that the firing proof on the gun (red outline) is an Erfurt proof and not a Spandau proof (blue outlined insert).

friendlyfred · 09-03-2012, 09:44 PM

Got this pix from Jan's forum of the suspect #13 that was for sale.
It seems to bear neither the E or the S proof mark??

Some great detective work on that one by you guys... Fuzzy square insert detected...swiss clip...etc

klaus 3338 · 09-11-2012, 02:43 AM

Spandau Lugers were discussed on Jan´s site some time ago. I do not know one Spandau Luger in Europe with exception of one in Norway. But this one was bought in the USA.
All the Spandau Lugers I have seen were shown on pictures. Striking is that all these "Spandau" Lugers have receivers of 1918 Erfurt Lugers (I saw only one or two with 1917 Erfurt receivers). One can identify them on the acceptance marks and the Erfurt proof marks. They have always two added acceptance stamps and the added crown K on the toggle. The barrels are Erfurt made, too.
For me have these "Lugers" not any value.

friendlyfred · 09-12-2012, 03:15 PM

Many thanks to Rich B. for tracking down the original magazine and sending it to me. (Check's in the mail)
You folks might want to save this file for future reference.

All the best to all for their help...

Fred

sheepherder · 09-16-2012, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by postino

...Rounded ends indicate a rotary engraving tool, rather than a fixed stamp or die...

To expound on this a bit, there was a magazine bottom stamp shown recently...The "3" is a good example of a sharp ended stamping, as opposed to a rounded ended engraving...

(Fred - The check will go toward more vintage magazine articles, already being scanned!)

09-03-2012, 02:13 PM	#81
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	Here is an enlarged image of one of the rifle chamber markings in the link that Ben provided. I think it is pretty instructive with regard to the difference between a stamped marking and a pantographed marking. Attached Thumbnails __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

09-03-2012, 02:30 PM	#82
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,909 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	One thing to keep in mind with toggles, is that there are tons of blank toggles out there, either on 'sneaks' or from the factory (WW1, Weimar, WW2, Vopo) that could and were probably used. Fred, although You paid a ton of money, a conversation piece like this is always interesting. I was 'dogged' out by a couple of collectors but I bought a 'deaths head' luger on purpose, knowing it was fake, because, by gum, I wanted one, that and the price I paid was just above a shooter price. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

09-03-2012, 06:41 PM	#83
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	Based on Klaus' input, no. It appears that the firing proof on the gun (red outline) is an Erfurt proof and not a Spandau proof (blue outlined insert). Attached Thumbnails __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

09-03-2012, 09:44 PM	#84
friendlyfred User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Washington State Posts: 33 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Curious, what is the firing proof on this one? Got this pix from Jan's forum of the suspect #13 that was for sale. It seems to bear neither the E or the S proof mark?? Some great detective work on that one by you guys... Fuzzy square insert detected...swiss clip...etc Attached Images

09-11-2012, 02:43 AM	#85
klaus 3338 User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 513 Thanks: 0 Thanked 394 Times in 156 Posts	Spandau Lugers were discussed on Jan´s site some time ago. I do not know one Spandau Luger in Europe with exception of one in Norway. But this one was bought in the USA. All the Spandau Lugers I have seen were shown on pictures. Striking is that all these "Spandau" Lugers have receivers of 1918 Erfurt Lugers (I saw only one or two with 1917 Erfurt receivers). One can identify them on the acceptance marks and the Erfurt proof marks. They have always two added acceptance stamps and the added crown K on the toggle. The barrels are Erfurt made, too. For me have these "Lugers" not any value.