1941 byf

byf42 · 08-29-2004, 12:45 AM

Sorry I am unable to post pics, but have a question about a recent purchase. landed a very nice 41 BYF rig. Gun is all matching, except for the holdopen which has an s/42 on it. Serial number 963 with no suffix. The question is about the mags. They are aluminum based, pin through the middle, fxo stick eagle 37. The mag bottoms have only 963 and numbered 1 and 2. no other marks on the bottom of the mag. I thought these were police mags, but the gun has no sear safety on it. Thanks. M. Holt

byf42 · 08-29-2004, 12:49 AM

In addition have capture papers with the pistol showing where a S/Sgt. was authorized to bring home:
1 german pistol P.38 #5543
1 luger pistol #963
1 german pr binoculars

jamese · 08-29-2004, 08:33 AM

BYF42,
The Ã¢??S/42Ã¢?Âmarked hold open is most likely an arsenal replacement.

The generic Ã¢??S/42Ã¢?Â was stamped on arsenal replacement parts for K Date, G Date, Ã¢??36, Ã¢??37,Ã¢??38, and Ã¢??39 Mauser series

Edward Tinker · 08-29-2004, 10:06 AM

I have seen police guns without a sear safety. They are "rare", I don't know if you'd say more valauble, but they are rarer.

The guess is that they were issued to the police and were not modified, either because of time constraints, or they were issued in a part of germany or time frame that the sear safety was not added.

They could also be bogus mags...

Can you scan in the pictures with a scanner, or have a friend take digital etc?

Ed

byf42 · 08-29-2004, 08:09 PM

Ed,
I have access to a digital camera, but am unable to download pics onto the forum. I have disc's with pics of black widow repro grips I posted about in another section of this forum, as well as pics of a 1938 rig I picked up awhile back. I just hate to always bug someone to post the pics. The problem is old computer I believe.
Mike

Edward Tinker · 08-29-2004, 10:33 PM

Well, actually, posting the pictures shouldn't make any difference in how old the comptuer is. More than likely it is the size of your intial photos.

Send them to me and I'll post them.

Ed

byf42 · 08-30-2004, 02:25 AM

Ed,
I figured it out, but thanks for offering. Will have pics of the gun and mags as soon as I put my mitts on the digital camera again.

Mike

Lugerdoc · 08-30-2004, 08:12 AM

Mike, If the size of the numbers on your FXO mags is the same size & style as the serials on the front of the frame, chances are they are correct WW2 mags. If the digits on the mags are much larger, they are probably renumbered, possibily by the DDR. Th

byf42 · 08-31-2004, 05:44 AM

Here are the mag pictures, as well as some others of the guns.

[click on the Ã¢??thumbnailsÃ¢?? to see the photos full size - Admin-JS]

<a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0015.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0015.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0016.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0016.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0019.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0019.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0021.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0021.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>

the gunman · 08-31-2004, 04:29 PM

IMHO These mags have definitely been renumbered

Edward Tinker · 08-31-2004, 04:55 PM

Richie, I actually dislike the numbering on the frame worse than the mags? The mags are essentially the same. I would like an even closer, larger more pixels of the mags, so I could blow them up, I can't tell if they are re-stamped or if there is just a marking or two by the numbers?

Since there is "capture papers" and they look current to the time frame, they might be renumbered by the police pre-WW2?

Ed

SteveM · 08-31-2004, 07:35 PM

I am curious as to whether or not the pistol has been drilled for a sear safety.

Thanks,
SteveM

byf42 · 08-31-2004, 09:15 PM

Where would it be drilled at for a sear safety?

SteveM · 08-31-2004, 09:23 PM

Just above and to the rear of the sideplate. I don't have a pic handy to post. Maybe one of the other members will have one..

SteveM

Edward Tinker · 08-31-2004, 09:41 PM

It is the top bar at the top of the screen above the middle 39.

http://gallery.rennlist.com/lugergal...ce_parts_color

byf42 · 08-31-2004, 10:40 PM

I checked, its not drilled.

M. Holt

byf42 · 09-01-2004, 12:18 AM

It just did not make sense to me to have a 41 byf with no sear safety, and have police type mags. The gun as far as I can tell is right as rain, but the mags were the catch. The good thing is it was a trade, a fella had to have something I wanted to get rid of, so I am not into it deep at all.

Frank · 09-01-2004, 09:25 AM

Mike, your 41 byf looks like a legit Luger. Just get a "fxo" black plastic bottom magazine and you'll be all set with the proper magazine for your new toy. Are the waffenamt marks both E/655?

byf42 · 09-01-2004, 05:24 PM

Frank, The waffenamt marks are E/135's. I guess my question is could those mags be legit? Under a magnifying glass I cannot see anything out of place on the mag bottoms. Maybe its just wishful thinking on my part.

Mike

Johnny C. Kitchens · 09-01-2004, 09:15 PM

The 9 sure looks odd on the frame picture...

08-29-2004, 12:45 AM	#1
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1941 byf Sorry I am unable to post pics, but have a question about a recent purchase. landed a very nice 41 BYF rig. Gun is all matching, except for the holdopen which has an s/42 on it. Serial number 963 with no suffix. The question is about the mags. They are aluminum based, pin through the middle, fxo stick eagle 37. The mag bottoms have only 963 and numbered 1 and 2. no other marks on the bottom of the mag. I thought these were police mags, but the gun has no sear safety on it. Thanks. M. Holt

08-29-2004, 08:33 AM	#3
jamese User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South Florida Posts: 789 Thanks: 0 Thanked 84 Times in 34 Posts	BYF42, The Ã¢??S/42Ã¢?Âmarked hold open is most likely an arsenal replacement. The generic Ã¢??S/42Ã¢?Â was stamped on arsenal replacement parts for K Date, G Date, Ã¢??36, Ã¢??37,Ã¢??38, and Ã¢??39 Mauser series __________________ The "truth" is a matter of Perception

08-29-2004, 10:06 AM	#4
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,924 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,518 Times in 2,087 Posts	I have seen police guns without a sear safety. They are "rare", I don't know if you'd say more valauble, but they are rarer. The guess is that they were issued to the police and were not modified, either because of time constraints, or they were issued in a part of germany or time frame that the sear safety was not added. They could also be bogus mags... Can you scan in the pictures with a scanner, or have a friend take digital etc? Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-29-2004, 10:33 PM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,924 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,518 Times in 2,087 Posts	Well, actually, posting the pictures shouldn't make any difference in how old the comptuer is. More than likely it is the size of your intial photos. Send them to me and I'll post them. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-30-2004, 08:12 AM	#8
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Mike, If the size of the numbers on your FXO mags is the same size & style as the serials on the front of the frame, chances are they are correct WW2 mags. If the digits on the mags are much larger, they are probably renumbered, possibily by the DDR. Th __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

08-29-2004, 12:49 AM	#2
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	In addition have capture papers with the pistol showing where a S/Sgt. was authorized to bring home: 1 german pistol P.38 #5543 1 luger pistol #963 1 german pr binoculars

08-29-2004, 08:09 PM	#5
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ed, I have access to a digital camera, but am unable to download pics onto the forum. I have disc's with pics of black widow repro grips I posted about in another section of this forum, as well as pics of a 1938 rig I picked up awhile back. I just hate to always bug someone to post the pics. The problem is old computer I believe. Mike

08-30-2004, 02:25 AM	#7
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ed, I figured it out, but thanks for offering. Will have pics of the gun and mags as soon as I put my mitts on the digital camera again. Mike

08-31-2004, 05:44 AM	#9
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Here are the mag pictures, as well as some others of the guns. [click on the Ã¢??thumbnailsÃ¢?? to see the photos full size - Admin-JS] <a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0015.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0015.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0016.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0016.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0019.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0019.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0021.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/2004_0830guns0021.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>

08-31-2004, 04:29 PM	#10
the gunman User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Leland NC 28451 Posts: 1,017 Thanks: 1 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	IMHO These mags have definitely been renumbered

08-31-2004, 04:55 PM	#11
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,924 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,518 Times in 2,087 Posts	Richie, I actually dislike the numbering on the frame worse than the mags? The mags are essentially the same. I would like an even closer, larger more pixels of the mags, so I could blow them up, I can't tell if they are re-stamped or if there is just a marking or two by the numbers? Since there is "capture papers" and they look current to the time frame, they might be renumbered by the police pre-WW2? Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-31-2004, 07:35 PM	#12
SteveM User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,016 Thanks: 94 Thanked 275 Times in 137 Posts	I am curious as to whether or not the pistol has been drilled for a sear safety. Thanks, SteveM

08-31-2004, 09:15 PM	#13
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Where would it be drilled at for a sear safety?

08-31-2004, 09:23 PM	#14
SteveM User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,016 Thanks: 94 Thanked 275 Times in 137 Posts	Just above and to the rear of the sideplate. I don't have a pic handy to post. Maybe one of the other members will have one.. SteveM

08-31-2004, 09:41 PM	#15
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,924 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,518 Times in 2,087 Posts	It is the top bar at the top of the screen above the middle 39. http://gallery.rennlist.com/lugergal...ce_parts_color __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-31-2004, 10:40 PM	#16
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I checked, its not drilled. M. Holt

09-01-2004, 12:18 AM	#17
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	It just did not make sense to me to have a 41 byf with no sear safety, and have police type mags. The gun as far as I can tell is right as rain, but the mags were the catch. The good thing is it was a trade, a fella had to have something I wanted to get rid of, so I am not into it deep at all.

09-01-2004, 09:25 AM	#18
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 163 Times in 87 Posts	Mike, your 41 byf looks like a legit Luger. Just get a "fxo" black plastic bottom magazine and you'll be all set with the proper magazine for your new toy. Are the waffenamt marks both E/655?

09-01-2004, 05:24 PM	#19
byf42 User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Great Plains Posts: 74 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Frank, The waffenamt marks are E/135's. I guess my question is could those mags be legit? Under a magnifying glass I cannot see anything out of place on the mag bottoms. Maybe its just wishful thinking on my part. Mike

09-01-2004, 09:15 PM	#20
Johnny C. Kitchens User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Arlington, Texas Posts: 518 Thanks: 0 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	The 9 sure looks odd on the frame picture... __________________ Johnny C. Kitchens