Stoeger Luger Dimensions

Ponyman · 03-10-2005, 11:43 AM

Is the Stoeger Luger dimensionally identical to the "P.08"?

I've seen several pictured in ads various places. They have a "boxy" look about the grips - appear to lack the fluid grace of the P.08 grip. Are there other differences???

Lugerdoc · 03-10-2005, 01:01 PM

PM, The stainless Stoeger 9mm Luger is roughly the same size as the original PO8 but the parts are not interchangeable. Since Omark is no longer making these, parts availability may be a problem. You may be better off for a shooter, with one of the recently imported DDR or Russian reworks for about the same price. TH

Ponyman · 03-10-2005, 02:48 PM

Thanks for the reply, Tom, but I don't think you understood the intent of my question. Perhaps my question was not stated with sufficient clarity.....

I read somewhere on this site that Don Mitchell set up the tooling required to build stainless Lugers dimensionally identical to one of the American Eagles produced in the 1920's. I've seen the pics - they were really pretty.

Did AIMCO and then Stoeger successively acquire the tooling? What is Orimar's relationship with Mitchell, AIMCO and Stoeger? When were the changes made that resulted in the visually unappealing Stoeger?

I have three lovely shooters: two Mauser-Interarms 4" 9mm (one 29/70, one 06/73) and a DWM 1920 Commercial in 7.65. I want a stainless LUGER (not an ugly step-sister) and I need to know which production runs were faithful and which were not.

Steve Richards · 03-10-2005, 08:44 PM

I do not have experience with the Stoeger Lugers but I have a latter stainless made by AIMCO and a second one after they became ORIMAR. The same company made all of the stainless guns. This is true regardless if they were marketed by Stoeger, Mitchell, AIMCO or ORIMAR.

The grip areas on mine are slightly larger (about a tenth of an inch) when measured front to back when compared to my older guns. They also have the flat sided magazines and cannot use the original style magazines. The earlier stainless models have magazines that will interchange with vintage guns. I do not know when the change was made. This may afect the outside dimension difference, but I do not know.

So far, the only real differences this has made is in the "feel" of the gun and in using a 1902 holster by El Paso Saddlery. Someone with a large hand may like the larger grip while a person with a smaller hand will probably like the older size. The flap on the holster will close on the vintage gun but the flap hole needs to be repositioned to close on the new stainless gun.

I hope that this helps.

Johnny C. Kitchens · 03-11-2005, 02:09 AM

I believe that Aimco made the Mitchell version as well. I bought a book from 1993 that features the Mitchell, today. You can see the AIMCO name in the same place as it appears on others. You can find stainless Lugers with AIMCO, SSP, and Orimar in that position above the right grip. I know for sure that two of those are the same and suspect that the third is the same company. Starting with the Stoeger take over of the stainless, the design was indeed changed in many less than noticeable places. Some are better, some are just OK. The Mitchell version is so close you can interchange parts between it and older Lugers. I have a post Stoeger version and some parts are of different dimensions. As mentioned the magazine was given a redesign...

Steve Richards · 03-11-2005, 08:33 PM

AIMCO, now ORIMAR did indeed make all of the stainless guns.

Steve

unspellable · 03-17-2005, 01:59 PM

The stainless Luger was originally a Mitchell design, fairly closely copied from a 1942 Mauser. When Stoeger took over distribution they switched to a non-standard magazine and plastered the Stoeger logo on the side, neither of which changes were for the better. So far as I know the latest ones use the Stoeger style magazine. The magazine is not interchangable with a standard one. There may have been other changes. Stoeger has not had a reputation for doing things right in the last twenty years.

Ponyman · 03-17-2005, 03:27 PM

What is the chronological sequence of names found on the stainless guns?
Starting with Mitchell, in what year?
Ending with Stoeger in 2004 - but what came in between, and what years?

Steve Richards · 03-18-2005, 01:39 AM

By 2000, the guns were marked with AIMCO Houston, TX on the right side on the frame just above the grip. The right side of the slide was marked AMERICAN EAGLE and below that was the caliber in my case 9MM LUGER. The chamber was stamped with an eagle and the year.

By 2002 the company had changed names to ORIMAR. OFM CORP is on the right side of the frame above the grip and the caliber is alone on the right side of the frame. The chamber has an Eagle but no date and the front toggle link has a scroll OFM patterned after the DWM on their guns.

I hope that this helps.

Steve

DougT · 03-18-2005, 01:48 AM

I had a conversation with someone at Aimco in about 1995 who told me that the reason they switched distributors from Mitchell to Stoeger was because "Mitchell didn't pay their bills".
DougT

unspellable · 03-18-2005, 08:08 AM

Something for you guys to dream about. There exists a Mitchell era stainless Luger chambered for the 10 mm cartridge. It was a one off engineering model. Mitchell was seriously thinking of putting it on the market when the ditributer ship passed to Stoeger. For my money, I'd rather have one in 357 Sig or 10 mm than 45 ACP.

03-10-2005, 11:43 AM	#1
Ponyman User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Atlantic County, NJ, USA Posts: 138 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Stoeger Luger Dimensions Is the Stoeger Luger dimensionally identical to the "P.08"? I've seen several pictured in ads various places. They have a "boxy" look about the grips - appear to lack the fluid grace of the P.08 grip. Are there other differences??? __________________ "The Constitution is intended for use by a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the governance of any other." ~ John Quincy Adams

03-10-2005, 01:01 PM	#2
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	PM, The stainless Stoeger 9mm Luger is roughly the same size as the original PO8 but the parts are not interchangeable. Since Omark is no longer making these, parts availability may be a problem. You may be better off for a shooter, with one of the recently imported DDR or Russian reworks for about the same price. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

03-10-2005, 02:48 PM	#3
Ponyman User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Atlantic County, NJ, USA Posts: 138 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Thanks for the reply, Tom, but I don't think you understood the intent of my question. Perhaps my question was not stated with sufficient clarity..... I read somewhere on this site that Don Mitchell set up the tooling required to build stainless Lugers dimensionally identical to one of the American Eagles produced in the 1920's. I've seen the pics - they were really pretty. Did AIMCO and then Stoeger successively acquire the tooling? What is Orimar's relationship with Mitchell, AIMCO and Stoeger? When were the changes made that resulted in the visually unappealing Stoeger? I have three lovely shooters: two Mauser-Interarms 4" 9mm (one 29/70, one 06/73) and a DWM 1920 Commercial in 7.65. I want a stainless LUGER (not an ugly step-sister) and I need to know which production runs were faithful and which were not. __________________ "The Constitution is intended for use by a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the governance of any other." ~ John Quincy Adams

03-11-2005, 02:09 AM	#5
Johnny C. Kitchens User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Arlington, Texas Posts: 518 Thanks: 0 Thanked 20 Times in 8 Posts	I believe that Aimco made the Mitchell version as well. I bought a book from 1993 that features the Mitchell, today. You can see the AIMCO name in the same place as it appears on others. You can find stainless Lugers with AIMCO, SSP, and Orimar in that position above the right grip. I know for sure that two of those are the same and suspect that the third is the same company. Starting with the Stoeger take over of the stainless, the design was indeed changed in many less than noticeable places. Some are better, some are just OK. The Mitchell version is so close you can interchange parts between it and older Lugers. I have a post Stoeger version and some parts are of different dimensions. As mentioned the magazine was given a redesign... __________________ Johnny C. Kitchens

03-17-2005, 03:27 PM	#8
Ponyman User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Atlantic County, NJ, USA Posts: 138 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	What is the chronological sequence of names found on the stainless guns? Starting with Mitchell, in what year? Ending with Stoeger in 2004 - but what came in between, and what years? __________________ "The Constitution is intended for use by a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the governance of any other." ~ John Quincy Adams

03-10-2005, 08:44 PM	#4
Steve Richards User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Beaverton, Oregon Posts: 487 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I do not have experience with the Stoeger Lugers but I have a latter stainless made by AIMCO and a second one after they became ORIMAR. The same company made all of the stainless guns. This is true regardless if they were marketed by Stoeger, Mitchell, AIMCO or ORIMAR. The grip areas on mine are slightly larger (about a tenth of an inch) when measured front to back when compared to my older guns. They also have the flat sided magazines and cannot use the original style magazines. The earlier stainless models have magazines that will interchange with vintage guns. I do not know when the change was made. This may afect the outside dimension difference, but I do not know. So far, the only real differences this has made is in the "feel" of the gun and in using a 1902 holster by El Paso Saddlery. Someone with a large hand may like the larger grip while a person with a smaller hand will probably like the older size. The flap on the holster will close on the vintage gun but the flap hole needs to be repositioned to close on the new stainless gun. I hope that this helps.

03-11-2005, 08:33 PM	#6
Steve Richards User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Beaverton, Oregon Posts: 487 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	AIMCO, now ORIMAR did indeed make all of the stainless guns. Steve

03-17-2005, 01:59 PM	#7
unspellable User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 768 Thanks: 0 Thanked 18 Times in 10 Posts	The stainless Luger was originally a Mitchell design, fairly closely copied from a 1942 Mauser. When Stoeger took over distribution they switched to a non-standard magazine and plastered the Stoeger logo on the side, neither of which changes were for the better. So far as I know the latest ones use the Stoeger style magazine. The magazine is not interchangable with a standard one. There may have been other changes. Stoeger has not had a reputation for doing things right in the last twenty years.

03-18-2005, 01:39 AM	#9
Steve Richards User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Beaverton, Oregon Posts: 487 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	By 2000, the guns were marked with AIMCO Houston, TX on the right side on the frame just above the grip. The right side of the slide was marked AMERICAN EAGLE and below that was the caliber in my case 9MM LUGER. The chamber was stamped with an eagle and the year. By 2002 the company had changed names to ORIMAR. OFM CORP is on the right side of the frame above the grip and the caliber is alone on the right side of the frame. The chamber has an Eagle but no date and the front toggle link has a scroll OFM patterned after the DWM on their guns. I hope that this helps. Steve

03-18-2005, 01:48 AM	#10
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I had a conversation with someone at Aimco in about 1995 who told me that the reason they switched distributors from Mitchell to Stoeger was because "Mitchell didn't pay their bills". DougT

03-18-2005, 08:08 AM	#11
unspellable User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 768 Thanks: 0 Thanked 18 Times in 10 Posts	Something for you guys to dream about. There exists a Mitchell era stainless Luger chambered for the 10 mm cartridge. It was a one off engineering model. Mitchell was seriously thinking of putting it on the market when the ditributer ship passed to Stoeger. For my money, I'd rather have one in 357 Sig or 10 mm than 45 ACP.