I Need Help! - Page 2

policeluger · 07-12-2006, 11:11 AM

surf the web dealers and place an add in the "want to buy" section here...we'll keep an eye out..........listen to Jerry, patience.

John D. · 07-12-2006, 11:19 AM

Hi Sean,

I agree with Jerry - don't let that money burn a hole in your pocket and make a "quick decision" you may regret later (trust me - I know from experience

)..

As many have said, a "matched shooter" nowadays, is somewhat of an oxymoron - as "matched" means it's collectible - and a "shooter" means you can risk replacing some parts without hurting the "collectors" value

Hmmm..>?? So now - let me get you started down the "slippery slope" of collecting..!

I'd sugget that you purchase a mis-matched import if you want a shooter. I recently bought two - the "priciest" is a "byf" in original finish with a mis-matched sideplate. It was a mere $625 - and it's kind of neat.. The second is a finnish luger (w/ a 9mm Tikkakoski barrel) - import marked that I got for under $550 (Ed T. saw it too, so I had to snatch it before he did - hi Ed! )

After getting a nice import shooter, take your time and just enjoy it for a few months (read "rebuild your checking account!!") and start looking for a nice matched Luger from the era/variation that most interests you....

Anyway - that's my $0.00002..

Hope it helps!

John D.

Pete Ebbink · 07-12-2006, 11:22 AM

Hi Sean,

You are using 2 sets of criteria that are mutually exclusive of each other.

A 98% all matching (except mag) that you only want to shoot 20-30 rounds a year is still a collector-grade pistol by the fact of its original finish being so strong and having matching serials. Such a pistol has price premiums.

A shooter is either an original finish gun down in the 50-70% finish range with or without all matching serials.

If you are looking for a luger under $ 700 or so, that would most likely be a shooter as I have described above.

Doug Smith and Ken Clark of FGS in Portsmouth, OH have a couple of nice offerings in the $ 950-975 asking price range; that are somewhere in the middle of the 2 sets of criteria I have described. You might want to look at their web site; these guns are towards the bottom of this page.

FGS also has a very solid reputation with collectors as far as a retail dealer goes. I have had several very pleasant transactions with them.

Ken Clark will also usually send more photos if you call or email him and he knows you have serious interest.

Make sure your 1st. shooter is a 9 mm as 7,65 luger ammo is a bit pricey to shoot alot. But shooting 7,65 is more enjoyable (my opinion, only) than 9 mm.

http://www.fgsinc.8m.com/photo.html

p.s.

Check-Point Charlies has a couple of $ 725-975 offerings as well that seem to be WWI honest pieces with history, mostly or all matching, with some wear and non-matching mag's.

http://www.checkpointcharlies.com/sh...4&categoryid=9

lugerluser · 07-12-2006, 11:49 AM

Jerry, How does a person who is not intelligent (as far as Lugers) ask intelligent questions? Lugers are very complicated. Sean.....

lugerluser · 07-12-2006, 12:01 PM

Would a 98% reblued matching (except mag) be a good choice for my first Luger (shooter). I want is to look good have a little history. And have fun shooting, a little. The matching thing is something i don't want to give up. It's to cool not to have! Thanks.

pipeman45 · 07-12-2006, 02:16 PM

One thing to keep in mind. If you do shoot a matching gun,and break one of the # parts. You have just turned it into a non-matching shooter worth much less!

lugerholsterrepair · 07-12-2006, 04:06 PM

Sean, Simple answer to your question, get intelligent first. John D., the owner and kind benifactor of the very Forum we are presently on gave you good advice. So has Pete Ebbink and some others. My advice is to spend a hundred bucks on several books and read them. There is a thread with advice on what book a newbie should buy. The hundred spent will be returned to you a couple times over. Looking for a girlfriend? Do the same thing...Only no books have been written that will help you. Jerry Burney

Bob in OH · 07-12-2006, 04:16 PM

Another option is to find a mentor who can take you under his wing and help assist with purchases. I looked at your "profile" and see you are in Winchester, VA. I know a serious collector from these boards who collects Nazi weaponary and resides in Winchester. You are not looking/collecting in a vacuum. If possible befriend one of your locals who just might be willing to help... Alternatively, an internet mentor works too

Happy hunting and books are important too...

John Sabato · 07-12-2006, 05:54 PM

I guess I didn't notice that in your profile when I first looked... Drop me a private message... the ability to do that is by clicking on the icon at the bottom of any of my postings that looks like two people shaking hands in front of an envelope... (I Live in Winchester TOO!)

lugerluser · 07-12-2006, 09:01 PM

You guys are great! thanks! First, to you pipeman45, I NEVER thought of it that way! You are right. An unmatched might be my best bet. Who knows. And John, I will contact you thanks again guys!

Pete Ebbink · 07-14-2006, 10:31 PM

Sean,

If you can find a few more loose quarters in the sofa cushions, you might want to go a bit above your budget and consider this 8" LP-08 Artillery luger the folks at Simpsons just listed for sale.

There is nothing quite like shooting one of these 8" beauties.

This one is refinished. The sales ad does not say if small parts match or not. You might also want to re-straw the appropriate small parts if you buy it.

Also...asking price does not necessarily mean selling price with most retail sellers

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=4440

Parabellus · 07-14-2006, 11:25 PM

Sean,

Pete is right on. This is less than I paid for mine a couple months ago. If it shoots properly you'll have yourself great target pistol. Get a repro stock (ATF approved of course) and holster and you have a carbine good on the 100-yard range. The experts here say it's accurate out to 300 yards! Be aware that at short range with the stock board only you'll have the corner placed high on the shoulder against bone (depending on your physiology) and the kick is a little sharp. With a stock-mounted holster you have enough extension for a comfortable experience.

Russell

lugerluser · 07-14-2006, 11:45 PM

Thanks Guys, looks Great! But I still don't know what strawing means. Sean.....

Parabellus · 07-14-2006, 11:50 PM

Sean,

It took me awile too.
This should help.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...threadid=14911

Russell

lugerluser · 08-14-2006, 09:50 AM

Ok, bought my first Luger! I bought it at the Chantilly, Va. Show. Thought I got a good deal, Now, not so sure. Had some help from another dealer there, very helpful. It is a 1917 DWM all matching, or so i thought. When i got it home, noticed that all numbers matched except ONE! The hold back lever DID NOT MATCH! Stupid me! I have some pix, about 12. I upload them, then have no idea what to do with them. I don't understand PC talk. Man I am pissed! Live and Learn! Thanks. By the way, He was asking $1300 got it for $1050. Waited till late Sunday, Last day of the show. The story gets worse, but to red faced to say right now. POOR ME!

John Sabato · 08-14-2006, 10:53 AM

Sean, if you got a functioning nice looking artillery luger for only $1050, then you did fine... all matching would have been nice, but that is about the going price for an artillery model in any condition these days...

There is a tutorial for posting photographs at the top of the Site Help and Feedback Forum that was written by Ed Tinker... it has helped countless computer novices to post photos here... try it... and if you still have problems then ask questions in that forum on what you are doing wrong... but I think you will be successful.

policeluger · 08-14-2006, 11:03 AM

Sean, it sounds like you are to willing to jump in and beat yourself up, there should have been some good LF folks at the show, as I hear talk of the show here all the time, should have hooked up with one of them, now if the "hold back" is what I call the "hold open" device, and it is mis matched, I would not consider it the worst thing that could happen. Its a part often broken in heavy use, often replaced in the field and when I am looking for a pure collection grade piece for my Weimar police collection, I do not let a mis matched hold open device stand in my way in considering buying the gun.....as for red faced mistakes we all have made 'em....I think I am putting together a good police collection, but as it has been said before, I paid my tuition at Luger University, learned and went on....I wish you the very best, and do not let this get you down, count your blessings as we are indeed lucky to be able to buy one gun in a world where so many go without.

Pete Ebbink · 08-14-2006, 12:11 PM

Sean,

For your great price, one minor part that is not matching that is internal to the gun should not keep you up at night.

One more lesson one can learn from your buying experience at a gun show :

If a seller knows you are serious and have money and paperwork in hand to buy his luger; ask the seller to do a complete take-down for you before you agree to buy the gun. This should include removing both grips and disassembly of the firing pin assembly.

Having the seller do the take-down should alievate his concern that his gun may become damaged by you.

If the seller does not agree to do a take-down for you; there is probably something he would rather you not see in detail about his gun...and you can simply walk away with your cash still in your pockets.

lugerluser · 08-14-2006, 04:14 PM

Thanks Guys, Like I said Live And Learn. John, unless i am not finding what you are talking about, all i can find is about resizing pix. I get all the pix uploaded, but have no idea were they are or were to put them. Thanks.

lugerluser · 08-14-2006, 04:20 PM

Policeluger, Thanks. There was a very nice Luger dealer from New Market Va. there, who did not have what i wanted. He stopped what he was doing, and took me around the show to find a good deal ( about 1/2 hour of his time) could not have been nicer! He took down the gun, He must have just missed it. Sean.....

07-12-2006, 11:49 AM	#24
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Jerry, How does a person who is not intelligent (as far as Lugers) ask intelligent questions? Lugers are very complicated. Sean..... __________________ "GOD IS!"

07-12-2006, 12:01 PM	#25
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Would a 98% reblued matching (except mag) be a good choice for my first Luger (shooter). I want is to look good have a little history. And have fun shooting, a little. The matching thing is something i don't want to give up. It's to cool not to have! Thanks. __________________ "GOD IS!"

07-12-2006, 02:16 PM	#26
pipeman45 User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Kentucky Posts: 539 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	One thing to keep in mind. If you do shoot a matching gun,and break one of the # parts. You have just turned it into a non-matching shooter worth much less! __________________ Dave

07-12-2006, 04:06 PM	#27
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Sean, Simple answer to your question, get intelligent first. John D., the owner and kind benifactor of the very Forum we are presently on gave you good advice. So has Pete Ebbink and some others. My advice is to spend a hundred bucks on several books and read them. There is a thread with advice on what book a newbie should buy. The hundred spent will be returned to you a couple times over. Looking for a girlfriend? Do the same thing...Only no books have been written that will help you. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

07-12-2006, 05:54 PM	#29
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	I guess I didn't notice that in your profile when I first looked... Drop me a private message... the ability to do that is by clicking on the icon at the bottom of any of my postings that looks like two people shaking hands in front of an envelope... (I Live in Winchester TOO!) __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

07-12-2006, 11:11 AM	#21
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	surf the web dealers and place an add in the "want to buy" section here...we'll keep an eye out..........listen to Jerry, patience.

07-12-2006, 11:19 AM	#22
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 471 Thanked 513 Times in 127 Posts	Hi Sean, I agree with Jerry - don't let that money burn a hole in your pocket and make a "quick decision" you may regret later (trust me - I know from experience ).. As many have said, a "matched shooter" nowadays, is somewhat of an oxymoron - as "matched" means it's collectible - and a "shooter" means you can risk replacing some parts without hurting the "collectors" value Hmmm..>?? So now - let me get you started down the "slippery slope" of collecting..! I'd sugget that you purchase a mis-matched import if you want a shooter. I recently bought two - the "priciest" is a "byf" in original finish with a mis-matched sideplate. It was a mere $625 - and it's kind of neat.. The second is a finnish luger (w/ a 9mm Tikkakoski barrel) - import marked that I got for under $550 (Ed T. saw it too, so I had to snatch it before he did - hi Ed! ) After getting a nice import shooter, take your time and just enjoy it for a few months (read "rebuild your checking account!!") and start looking for a nice matched Luger from the era/variation that most interests you.... Anyway - that's my $0.00002.. Hope it helps! John D.

07-12-2006, 11:22 AM	#23
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Sean, You are using 2 sets of criteria that are mutually exclusive of each other. A 98% all matching (except mag) that you only want to shoot 20-30 rounds a year is still a collector-grade pistol by the fact of its original finish being so strong and having matching serials. Such a pistol has price premiums. A shooter is either an original finish gun down in the 50-70% finish range with or without all matching serials. If you are looking for a luger under $ 700 or so, that would most likely be a shooter as I have described above. Doug Smith and Ken Clark of FGS in Portsmouth, OH have a couple of nice offerings in the $ 950-975 asking price range; that are somewhere in the middle of the 2 sets of criteria I have described. You might want to look at their web site; these guns are towards the bottom of this page. FGS also has a very solid reputation with collectors as far as a retail dealer goes. I have had several very pleasant transactions with them. Ken Clark will also usually send more photos if you call or email him and he knows you have serious interest. Make sure your 1st. shooter is a 9 mm as 7,65 luger ammo is a bit pricey to shoot alot. But shooting 7,65 is more enjoyable (my opinion, only) than 9 mm. http://www.fgsinc.8m.com/photo.html p.s. Check-Point Charlies has a couple of $ 725-975 offerings as well that seem to be WWI honest pieces with history, mostly or all matching, with some wear and non-matching mag's. http://www.checkpointcharlies.com/sh...4&categoryid=9

07-12-2006, 04:16 PM	#28
Bob in OH User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NE OH Posts: 129 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Another option is to find a mentor who can take you under his wing and help assist with purchases. I looked at your "profile" and see you are in Winchester, VA. I know a serious collector from these boards who collects Nazi weaponary and resides in Winchester. You are not looking/collecting in a vacuum. If possible befriend one of your locals who just might be willing to help... Alternatively, an internet mentor works too Happy hunting and books are important too...

07-12-2006, 09:01 PM	#30
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	You guys are great! thanks! First, to you pipeman45, I NEVER thought of it that way! You are right. An unmatched might be my best bet. Who knows. And John, I will contact you thanks again guys! __________________ "GOD IS!"

07-14-2006, 10:31 PM	#31
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Sean, If you can find a few more loose quarters in the sofa cushions, you might want to go a bit above your budget and consider this 8" LP-08 Artillery luger the folks at Simpsons just listed for sale. There is nothing quite like shooting one of these 8" beauties. This one is refinished. The sales ad does not say if small parts match or not. You might also want to re-straw the appropriate small parts if you buy it. Also...asking price does not necessarily mean selling price with most retail sellers http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=4440

07-14-2006, 11:25 PM	#32
Parabellus User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: SF Bay Posts: 195 Thanks: 16 Thanked 9 Times in 4 Posts	Sean, Pete is right on. This is less than I paid for mine a couple months ago. If it shoots properly you'll have yourself great target pistol. Get a repro stock (ATF approved of course) and holster and you have a carbine good on the 100-yard range. The experts here say it's accurate out to 300 yards! Be aware that at short range with the stock board only you'll have the corner placed high on the shoulder against bone (depending on your physiology) and the kick is a little sharp. With a stock-mounted holster you have enough extension for a comfortable experience. Russell

07-14-2006, 11:45 PM	#33
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Guys, looks Great! But I still don't know what strawing means. Sean..... __________________ "GOD IS!"

07-14-2006, 11:50 PM	#34
Parabellus User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: SF Bay Posts: 195 Thanks: 16 Thanked 9 Times in 4 Posts	Sean, It took me awile too. This should help. http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...threadid=14911 Russell __________________

08-14-2006, 09:50 AM	#35
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ok, bought my first Luger! I bought it at the Chantilly, Va. Show. Thought I got a good deal, Now, not so sure. Had some help from another dealer there, very helpful. It is a 1917 DWM all matching, or so i thought. When i got it home, noticed that all numbers matched except ONE! The hold back lever DID NOT MATCH! Stupid me! I have some pix, about 12. I upload them, then have no idea what to do with them. I don't understand PC talk. Man I am pissed! Live and Learn! Thanks. By the way, He was asking $1300 got it for $1050. Waited till late Sunday, Last day of the show. The story gets worse, but to red faced to say right now. POOR ME! __________________ "GOD IS!"

08-14-2006, 10:53 AM	#36
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Sean, if you got a functioning nice looking artillery luger for only $1050, then you did fine... all matching would have been nice, but that is about the going price for an artillery model in any condition these days... There is a tutorial for posting photographs at the top of the Site Help and Feedback Forum that was written by Ed Tinker... it has helped countless computer novices to post photos here... try it... and if you still have problems then ask questions in that forum on what you are doing wrong... but I think you will be successful. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

08-14-2006, 11:03 AM	#37
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	Sean, it sounds like you are to willing to jump in and beat yourself up, there should have been some good LF folks at the show, as I hear talk of the show here all the time, should have hooked up with one of them, now if the "hold back" is what I call the "hold open" device, and it is mis matched, I would not consider it the worst thing that could happen. Its a part often broken in heavy use, often replaced in the field and when I am looking for a pure collection grade piece for my Weimar police collection, I do not let a mis matched hold open device stand in my way in considering buying the gun.....as for red faced mistakes we all have made 'em....I think I am putting together a good police collection, but as it has been said before, I paid my tuition at Luger University, learned and went on....I wish you the very best, and do not let this get you down, count your blessings as we are indeed lucky to be able to buy one gun in a world where so many go without.

08-14-2006, 12:11 PM	#38
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Sean, For your great price, one minor part that is not matching that is internal to the gun should not keep you up at night. One more lesson one can learn from your buying experience at a gun show : If a seller knows you are serious and have money and paperwork in hand to buy his luger; ask the seller to do a complete take-down for you before you agree to buy the gun. This should include removing both grips and disassembly of the firing pin assembly. Having the seller do the take-down should alievate his concern that his gun may become damaged by you. If the seller does not agree to do a take-down for you; there is probably something he would rather you not see in detail about his gun...and you can simply walk away with your cash still in your pockets.

08-14-2006, 04:14 PM	#39
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Guys, Like I said Live And Learn. John, unless i am not finding what you are talking about, all i can find is about resizing pix. I get all the pix uploaded, but have no idea were they are or were to put them. Thanks. __________________ "GOD IS!"

08-14-2006, 04:20 PM	#40
lugerluser User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Winchester, Virginia Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Policeluger, Thanks. There was a very nice Luger dealer from New Market Va. there, who did not have what i wanted. He stopped what he was doing, and took me around the show to find a good deal ( about 1/2 hour of his time) could not have been nicer! He took down the gun, He must have just missed it. Sean..... __________________ "GOD IS!"