1899 Luger

02-09-2006, 03:56 PM

I am not sure this belong here or in Early Luger. A dealer tells me he knows where a 1899 Swiss test luger is located. He said is not in real good shape and that the price is around $6,000. I assume this may be one of the about 100 that were made for the Swiss army to test.. What is a proper price and how can one tell if it is faked. I know these are difficult questions. Any input would be appreciated.

Pete Ebbink · 02-09-2006, 06:49 PM

Hi Richard,

I would suggest you switch to Jan Still's Gun Board and read through the following posting :

http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6491

Here is a continuation of that discuss in aother thread :

http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6489

If you can meet with this dealer and make arrangements to take detailed photos and post them on the Forum, I am sure folks will help with their opinions and info.

Given the fact that it is rumored that many pre-production Swiss lugers were forged/boosted in the 1990's, one should proceed with caution and have local advanced collectors (not associated with the sale) to assist you.

LF member Ron Wood lives on the border of TX and NM...he might be one fellow close enough to help you beyond the help you might receive on the Forum or on the Gun Board...

Ron Wood · 02-09-2006, 07:31 PM

Richard,
I appreciate Pete's endorsement. I have had some experience with 1899 Preproduction Lugers (not all good!). There were only approximately 30 to 32 of this series of early Lugers produced, of which there are only a little over a dozen whose whereabouts are known. Also, there are at least 4 fakes known (I have seen two). If you are willing, please contact me directly at rwood1@elp.rr.com to set up further discussion. As a start, a serial number and photos will be needed. Based on the results of that start, I would be willing to do what I can to arrange a hands on examination.

Pete Ebbink · 02-09-2006, 08:46 PM

Hey Ron,

Glad you did not mind my "volunteering" you...

With your new house completed...we need to keep you lucky retired guys busy...

02-09-2006, 09:06 PM

Thanks for the help. I called the dealer and am getting the run around. I think he just saw it on a table then later realized what is was and now does not seem to know where it is.

Ron Wood · 02-09-2006, 11:11 PM

The "run around" is not unexpected. It is nearly always the case that if something is too good to be true it will vaporize as soon as it is subject to scrutiny. Too bad.

Pete Ebbink · 02-09-2006, 11:40 PM

Richard,

Mind indicating what state the Dealer resides...???

Based on such info., this might reflect on the "pedigree" of a luger...

Pete Ebbink · 03-11-2006, 04:30 PM

Richard,

Were you at least able to get the serial number from the dealer before he went quiet on the piece ?

If yes, knowing the serial number and location of the dealer would help you fellow collectors from being careful if approached by this same seller or if the gun changes hands and shows up elsewhere in the future.

03-12-2006, 09:46 AM

No, could not get serial number. The gun was seen at a gun show in Belton Texas. I went back to a gun show in Belton yesterday and saw just one refinished 1916 luger. I think the trai is now too cold.

Pete Ebbink · 03-12-2006, 11:45 AM

Richard,

One of the bigger (note: not the BIGGEST) reported snakes in the boosted luger trade is some older fellow in poor health out of Cooperas Cove, TX - which is not too far from Belton, TX...he might have newer fellows known as "runners" peddling his stuff as his face and name is well-known.

03-12-2006, 01:39 PM

Ya, I know the guy in Copperas Cove. I have not seen him at any gun shows for a couple of years. I agree he is a snake.

02-09-2006, 03:56 PM	#1
RGARRETT Guest Posts: n/a	1899 Luger I am not sure this belong here or in Early Luger. A dealer tells me he knows where a 1899 Swiss test luger is located. He said is not in real good shape and that the price is around $6,000. I assume this may be one of the about 100 that were made for the Swiss army to test.. What is a proper price and how can one tell if it is faked. I know these are difficult questions. Any input would be appreciated.

02-09-2006, 07:31 PM	#3
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	Richard, I appreciate Pete's endorsement. I have had some experience with 1899 Preproduction Lugers (not all good!). There were only approximately 30 to 32 of this series of early Lugers produced, of which there are only a little over a dozen whose whereabouts are known. Also, there are at least 4 fakes known (I have seen two). If you are willing, please contact me directly at rwood1@elp.rr.com to set up further discussion. As a start, a serial number and photos will be needed. Based on the results of that start, I would be willing to do what I can to arrange a hands on examination. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

02-09-2006, 11:11 PM	#6
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	The "run around" is not unexpected. It is nearly always the case that if something is too good to be true it will vaporize as soon as it is subject to scrutiny. Too bad. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

02-09-2006, 06:49 PM	#2
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Richard, I would suggest you switch to Jan Still's Gun Board and read through the following posting : http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6491 Here is a continuation of that discuss in aother thread : http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6489 If you can meet with this dealer and make arrangements to take detailed photos and post them on the Forum, I am sure folks will help with their opinions and info. Given the fact that it is rumored that many pre-production Swiss lugers were forged/boosted in the 1990's, one should proceed with caution and have local advanced collectors (not associated with the sale) to assist you. LF member Ron Wood lives on the border of TX and NM...he might be one fellow close enough to help you beyond the help you might receive on the Forum or on the Gun Board...

02-09-2006, 08:46 PM	#4
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hey Ron, Glad you did not mind my "volunteering" you... With your new house completed...we need to keep you lucky retired guys busy...

02-09-2006, 09:06 PM	#5
RGARRETT Guest Posts: n/a	Thanks for the help. I called the dealer and am getting the run around. I think he just saw it on a table then later realized what is was and now does not seem to know where it is.

02-09-2006, 11:40 PM	#7
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Richard, Mind indicating what state the Dealer resides...??? Based on such info., this might reflect on the "pedigree" of a luger...

03-11-2006, 04:30 PM	#8
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Richard, Were you at least able to get the serial number from the dealer before he went quiet on the piece ? If yes, knowing the serial number and location of the dealer would help you fellow collectors from being careful if approached by this same seller or if the gun changes hands and shows up elsewhere in the future.

03-12-2006, 09:46 AM	#9
RGARRETT Guest Posts: n/a	No, could not get serial number. The gun was seen at a gun show in Belton Texas. I went back to a gun show in Belton yesterday and saw just one refinished 1916 luger. I think the trai is now too cold.

03-12-2006, 11:45 AM	#10
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Richard, One of the bigger (note: not the BIGGEST) reported snakes in the boosted luger trade is some older fellow in poor health out of Cooperas Cove, TX - which is not too far from Belton, TX...he might have newer fellows known as "runners" peddling his stuff as his face and name is well-known.

03-12-2006, 01:39 PM	#11
RGARRETT Guest Posts: n/a	Ya, I know the guy in Copperas Cove. I have not seen him at any gun shows for a couple of years. I agree he is a snake.