Poll: Ban of "automatic handguns ?" - Page 3

Weissen · 11-06-2002, 04:42 PM

Guys
It must be remembered that it is still early days with this. If you read the article carefully and disregard the first few media sensationalist sentences it is clear that everything is 1. a proposal 2. a recommendation 3. could result 4. may be likely. i.e. Nothing is certain at this time except for the feeling that something must be done by the politicians despite what the media reports are saying.The police ministers of the different states and the federal government are notoriously bad at agreeing on anything, so we'll just have to sit back and watch. From what I can gather, if you are a legitimate shooter in a legitimate club shooting sanctioned events you will probably be OK. It might be a bit tougher for you to get involved in the sport initially, and types of firearms may be limited but I think it unlikely that there will be an outright ban UK style. These people are involving members of the shooting sports (the REAL stakeholders)in their decisions and hopefully it's not going to be a knee jerk like last time.
Time will tell.......
Mr Tacfoley, where do all of the anti-gun femminazis go after they have done what they have set out to achieve? Do they just go away or do they move onto other things to make someone elses life a misery? What is your experience in the UK?

<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Edmond , DCB shooting · 11-06-2002, 05:26 PM

Yo Gang!Hallo JÃ?Â¼rgen ! seems that finally european shooters are on the move, in France we got reddish green talibans out of business , last April. registered shooters are only 140 000 but hunters are 1.5 million, exactly the opposite from Germany. we are talking more and more here about a king of European Union NRA, any talk or debate or writing about such an idea in Germany? MFG

Weissen · 11-06-2002, 09:55 PM

Me again
This is hot off the press.
Police Ministers Meeting
So it looks like a total ban is off the menu for a while anyway (phew!).
What do people think of this keeping in mind that this could be used as a model for future firearms ownership in the US?

<img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

hermit · 11-06-2002, 11:28 PM

Hello Australia and Tac in the UK! If I recall correctly, the uk was the model used here in good ol Canada and we are now to be the forerunners for policy in Australia. Justice minister Allan Rock is now health minister and is now royally screwing up the health system. Seems a lot of people here think that smokers are a burden on the health system, so they wanted to impose a tax on the smokers. Never mind that we pay $8.50 a pack of which most of that price is taxes. Anyways; January is coming up fast which is the deadline here to have all firearms registered, but only %35 have so far. Whats the result? Pour another 800 million into something that isn't working. P.S I got pulled over today and fined $54 for not wearing a seat belt. Who else am I endangering? Sorry for the rant.

JuergenG · 11-07-2002, 03:31 AM

Edmond,
a European NRA sounds like a great idea, but...
at least in Germany the different associations don't co-operate well.
It's always like "us" and "them".
Poorest representation of our intrerests is by the biggest one (Deutscher Schuetzenbund) accounting for approx. 1.6 million members. We feel that they have not many other interests than the "olympic disciplines". Other associations such as the BDS (Bund Deutscher Sportschuetzen) and the BdMP (Bund der Militaer- und Polizeischuetzen) which are more in the big bore and dynamic area are way too small; the account for 30,000 to 50,000 members.
As long as the big one don't make a real move I fear there won't be improvement in the political arena.
BTW: Whom would you like to see as the "King of the European NRA", Jean-Claude Van Damme, Belmondo ?
Salutations,
Juergen

Weissen · 11-07-2002, 09:24 PM

Here is the list of guns that the govt. are planning to ban.
http://www.theage.com.au/articles/20...308421460.html
Looks like Lugers will be spared, or maybe they just forgot to add them to the list...
A bloody lot of guns there eh?

[img]frown.gif[/img]

John -Melb · 11-08-2002, 06:15 AM

Weissen,
You may or may not be right about the sparing of Lugers.
The guns on the list will be banned, whether you keep others(like Lugers) or not will depend on whether or not they are "suitable" for use in "competitive events" that have been
"recognised or credited for legitimate use of handguns for sporting purposes"
This means, if your state's Registrar of Firearms doesn't consider a P08 as suitable for use in a "recognised or accreditied" competition (of which there looks like being about 14), then that old Luger is Valhalla bound!

wterrell · 11-08-2002, 11:18 PM

I suggest that you must start a grass roots political party with a single goal -- creation of a constitution which is a Zerox copy of the US Constitution.
Heady stuff!

John -Melb · 11-14-2002, 11:53 PM

I have some interesting news which, although does not change the bleak outlook for handgun owners "down-under", I haven't been able to stop laughing about.
Down here in Victoria we are saddled with the 1996 Firearms Act, brought in by a previous Liberal Government following the Port Arthur shooting (as a result of our Prime Minister's intense dislike for firearms.) This particular Government suffered what is known in these parts as a "Ballot-Box Reaming" at the 1999 State Election. We face the next election on November 30, and the Liberal Opposition Leader has already publicly stated his desire to ban the private ownership of handguns.
One of the leading lights of this party, Dr Robert Dean (supposedly the smartest man in Victorian Parliament?), who was a member of the government responsible for the 1996 Act (and a good "mate" of the bloke who wants to ban handgun ownership) will not be running in the next state election, he has in fact been very publicly dumped.
You see Dr Dean moved house but "forgot" to change his address on the electoral roll, as he wasn't living where he was enroled the Victorian Electoral Commission removed him from the electoral roll. If you're not on the electoral roll you canot stand for Parliament.
Scratch another gun-grabber! And they recon' this guy is bright!
<img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> : <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />

JuergenG · 11-15-2002, 03:50 AM

John,
sounds like the brightest move this fellow could make!
Juergen

John -Melb · 11-19-2002, 07:05 PM

More bad news from down-under.
The latest proposal the Police Ministers are looking at is a ban on all handguns with barrel lengths of less than 120mm
That's all P08's gone, if it gets up! [img]mad.gif[/img] <img src="graemlins/cussing.gif" border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" /> [img]mad.gif[/img] <img src="graemlins/cussing.gif" border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" />

Jimbo · 11-19-2002, 11:48 PM

That stinks. And the worst part is that it it senseless and will do NOTHING to deter crime.

Just absolutely stinks.

John -Melb · 12-02-2002, 10:20 PM

Re. my previous post regarding the upcoming State Election and the Liberal Party's plan to completely ban the private ownership of handguns in this state, if elected.
We had our election on the 30th November. We are not by any means out of the woods yet, (We still have and extremely "anti" Liberal Federal Government and their the ones doing the pushing) but the Liberal Party got BADLY REAMED at the ballot box.
I have sent the fellow who said he would ban handguns if he won the election, and asked him "what are my guns worth now?"

Haven't had a reply yet, funny about that.
[img]biggrin.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

G.W. Gill · 12-02-2002, 11:20 PM

The Political Pendulem can only be stopped by contibution to opposing $. We must be AWARE!

Avatar · 12-03-2002, 04:50 AM

Nice one John-Melb, can't let 'em off that easy, just gotta rub it in a bit eh? [img]biggrin.gif[/img]
Now that the anti-gun media merry-go-round has slowed down a little with less of the "never let the facts get in the way of a good story" routine there may be a chance to get some sensible dialogue going on. I can't help but get the feeling that there are more people on our side than we imagine but they are somehow unwilling (or more likely, unable) to say what they want. There just isn't quite the ferventness that we saw back in '96, there are bigger fish to fry this time around....

<img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />

Avatar · 12-06-2002, 04:10 AM

This is the very latest news on Australias new handgun laws.New Aussie Handgun Laws

I love those first couple of lines, what tripe!
<img src="graemlins/oops.gif" border="0" alt="[oops]" />

hermit · 12-06-2002, 04:49 AM

Well, possibly some good news in Canada. The registry had asked for another 73 million dollars in funding, but was turned down. I also read yesterday that some MPs in New Brunswick are trying for a bill to remove long guns from the new legislation. It may end up folding yet.

John -Melb · 12-06-2002, 06:49 AM

Bad News Folks
The agreement reached by the State Premiers and the Prime Minister in Canberra today will ban the private ownership of all autos with barrel lengths of less than 120mm. That's all P08's gone.

John Sabato · 12-06-2002, 12:02 PM

A truly sad day for the people of Australia!

VOTE THEM OUT! my friend... since you won't have to reserve time for shooting handguns you will have plenty of time for political activism...

Change your representatives, change your constitution,

do it for yourself and your heirs!

Avatar · 12-07-2002, 12:16 AM

[quote]The agreement reached by the State Premiers and the Prime Minister in Canberra today will ban the private ownership of all autos with barrel lengths of less than 120mm. <hr></blockquote>

Anyone got a real cheap 6" or 8" tube they wanna sell me? [img]wink.gif[/img]

11-06-2002, 05:26 PM	#42
Edmond , DCB shooting User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: FRANCE Posts: 53 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Yo Gang!Hallo JÃ?Â¼rgen ! seems that finally european shooters are on the move, in France we got reddish green talibans out of business , last April. registered shooters are only 140 000 but hunters are 1.5 million, exactly the opposite from Germany. we are talking more and more here about a king of European Union NRA, any talk or debate or writing about such an idea in Germany? MFG __________________ Shoot'in by DCB

11-08-2002, 11:18 PM	#48
wterrell User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,096 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I suggest that you must start a grass roots political party with a single goal -- creation of a constitution which is a Zerox copy of the US Constitution. Heady stuff! __________________ Noli me vocare, ego te vocabo, wes --------------------

12-06-2002, 12:02 PM	#59
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	A truly sad day for the people of Australia! VOTE THEM OUT! my friend... since you won't have to reserve time for shooting handguns you will have plenty of time for political activism... Change your representatives, change your constitution, do it for yourself and your heirs! __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

11-06-2002, 04:42 PM	#41
Weissen User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South Australia Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Guys It must be remembered that it is still early days with this. If you read the article carefully and disregard the first few media sensationalist sentences it is clear that everything is 1. a proposal 2. a recommendation 3. could result 4. may be likely. i.e. Nothing is certain at this time except for the feeling that something must be done by the politicians despite what the media reports are saying.The police ministers of the different states and the federal government are notoriously bad at agreeing on anything, so we'll just have to sit back and watch. From what I can gather, if you are a legitimate shooter in a legitimate club shooting sanctioned events you will probably be OK. It might be a bit tougher for you to get involved in the sport initially, and types of firearms may be limited but I think it unlikely that there will be an outright ban UK style. These people are involving members of the shooting sports (the REAL stakeholders)in their decisions and hopefully it's not going to be a knee jerk like last time. Time will tell....... Mr Tacfoley, where do all of the anti-gun femminazis go after they have done what they have set out to achieve? Do they just go away or do they move onto other things to make someone elses life a misery? What is your experience in the UK? <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

11-06-2002, 09:55 PM	#43
Weissen User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South Australia Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Me again This is hot off the press. Police Ministers Meeting So it looks like a total ban is off the menu for a while anyway (phew!). What do people think of this keeping in mind that this could be used as a model for future firearms ownership in the US? <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

11-06-2002, 11:28 PM	#44
hermit User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: canada Posts: 51 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hello Australia and Tac in the UK! If I recall correctly, the uk was the model used here in good ol Canada and we are now to be the forerunners for policy in Australia. Justice minister Allan Rock is now health minister and is now royally screwing up the health system. Seems a lot of people here think that smokers are a burden on the health system, so they wanted to impose a tax on the smokers. Never mind that we pay $8.50 a pack of which most of that price is taxes. Anyways; January is coming up fast which is the deadline here to have all firearms registered, but only %35 have so far. Whats the result? Pour another 800 million into something that isn't working. P.S I got pulled over today and fined $54 for not wearing a seat belt. Who else am I endangering? Sorry for the rant.

11-07-2002, 03:31 AM	#45
JuergenG User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 154 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Edmond, a European NRA sounds like a great idea, but... at least in Germany the different associations don't co-operate well. It's always like "us" and "them". Poorest representation of our intrerests is by the biggest one (Deutscher Schuetzenbund) accounting for approx. 1.6 million members. We feel that they have not many other interests than the "olympic disciplines". Other associations such as the BDS (Bund Deutscher Sportschuetzen) and the BdMP (Bund der Militaer- und Polizeischuetzen) which are more in the big bore and dynamic area are way too small; the account for 30,000 to 50,000 members. As long as the big one don't make a real move I fear there won't be improvement in the political arena. BTW: Whom would you like to see as the "King of the European NRA", Jean-Claude Van Damme, Belmondo ? Salutations, Juergen

11-07-2002, 09:24 PM	#46
Weissen User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South Australia Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Here is the list of guns that the govt. are planning to ban. http://www.theage.com.au/articles/20...308421460.html Looks like Lugers will be spared, or maybe they just forgot to add them to the list... A bloody lot of guns there eh? [img]frown.gif[/img]

11-08-2002, 06:15 AM	#47
John -Melb User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Melbourne, Peoples Republic of Australia! Posts: 145 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Weissen, You may or may not be right about the sparing of Lugers. The guns on the list will be banned, whether you keep others(like Lugers) or not will depend on whether or not they are "suitable" for use in "competitive events" that have been "recognised or credited for legitimate use of handguns for sporting purposes" This means, if your state's Registrar of Firearms doesn't consider a P08 as suitable for use in a "recognised or accreditied" competition (of which there looks like being about 14), then that old Luger is Valhalla bound!

11-14-2002, 11:53 PM	#49
John -Melb User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Melbourne, Peoples Republic of Australia! Posts: 145 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I have some interesting news which, although does not change the bleak outlook for handgun owners "down-under", I haven't been able to stop laughing about. Down here in Victoria we are saddled with the 1996 Firearms Act, brought in by a previous Liberal Government following the Port Arthur shooting (as a result of our Prime Minister's intense dislike for firearms.) This particular Government suffered what is known in these parts as a "Ballot-Box Reaming" at the 1999 State Election. We face the next election on November 30, and the Liberal Opposition Leader has already publicly stated his desire to ban the private ownership of handguns. One of the leading lights of this party, Dr Robert Dean (supposedly the smartest man in Victorian Parliament?), who was a member of the government responsible for the 1996 Act (and a good "mate" of the bloke who wants to ban handgun ownership) will not be running in the next state election, he has in fact been very publicly dumped. You see Dr Dean moved house but "forgot" to change his address on the electoral roll, as he wasn't living where he was enroled the Victorian Electoral Commission removed him from the electoral roll. If you're not on the electoral roll you canot stand for Parliament. Scratch another gun-grabber! And they recon' this guy is bright! <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> : <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />

11-15-2002, 03:50 AM	#50
JuergenG User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 154 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	John, sounds like the brightest move this fellow could make! Juergen

11-19-2002, 07:05 PM	#51
John -Melb User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Melbourne, Peoples Republic of Australia! Posts: 145 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	More bad news from down-under. The latest proposal the Police Ministers are looking at is a ban on all handguns with barrel lengths of less than 120mm That's all P08's gone, if it gets up! [img]mad.gif[/img] <img src="graemlins/cussing.gif" border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" /> [img]mad.gif[/img] <img src="graemlins/cussing.gif" border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" />

11-19-2002, 11:48 PM	#52
Jimbo User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SF CA Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	That stinks. And the worst part is that it it senseless and will do NOTHING to deter crime. Just absolutely stinks.

12-02-2002, 10:20 PM	#53
John -Melb User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Melbourne, Peoples Republic of Australia! Posts: 145 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re. my previous post regarding the upcoming State Election and the Liberal Party's plan to completely ban the private ownership of handguns in this state, if elected. We had our election on the 30th November. We are not by any means out of the woods yet, (We still have and extremely "anti" Liberal Federal Government and their the ones doing the pushing) but the Liberal Party got BADLY REAMED at the ballot box. I have sent the fellow who said he would ban handguns if he won the election, and asked him "what are my guns worth now?" Haven't had a reply yet, funny about that. [img]biggrin.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

12-02-2002, 11:20 PM	#54
G.W. Gill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeastern USA Posts: 369 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The Political Pendulem can only be stopped by contibution to opposing $. We must be AWARE!

12-03-2002, 04:50 AM	#55
Avatar User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Nice one John-Melb, can't let 'em off that easy, just gotta rub it in a bit eh? [img]biggrin.gif[/img] Now that the anti-gun media merry-go-round has slowed down a little with less of the "never let the facts get in the way of a good story" routine there may be a chance to get some sensible dialogue going on. I can't help but get the feeling that there are more people on our side than we imagine but they are somehow unwilling (or more likely, unable) to say what they want. There just isn't quite the ferventness that we saw back in '96, there are bigger fish to fry this time around.... <img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />

12-06-2002, 04:10 AM	#56
Avatar User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	This is the very latest news on Australias new handgun laws.New Aussie Handgun Laws I love those first couple of lines, what tripe! <img src="graemlins/oops.gif" border="0" alt="[oops]" />

12-06-2002, 04:49 AM	#57
hermit User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: canada Posts: 51 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Well, possibly some good news in Canada. The registry had asked for another 73 million dollars in funding, but was turned down. I also read yesterday that some MPs in New Brunswick are trying for a bill to remove long guns from the new legislation. It may end up folding yet.

12-06-2002, 06:49 AM	#58
John -Melb User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Melbourne, Peoples Republic of Australia! Posts: 145 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Bad News Folks The agreement reached by the State Premiers and the Prime Minister in Canberra today will ban the private ownership of all autos with barrel lengths of less than 120mm. That's all P08's gone.

12-07-2002, 12:16 AM	#60
Avatar User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	[quote]The agreement reached by the State Premiers and the Prime Minister in Canberra today will ban the private ownership of all autos with barrel lengths of less than 120mm. <hr></blockquote> Anyone got a real cheap 6" or 8" tube they wanna sell me? [img]wink.gif[/img]