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Unread 05-16-2008, 01:06 PM   #1
Jackthrock
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Default Help with Krieghoff Luger (SN 3249)

Hello, All:

A friend just dropped off her WW II-vet-dad's Luger (and accessories) for me to "take a look at." You folks are the experts. Before describing the gun, I realize that condition descriptions are highly subjective, especially w/o photos. Neither she or I have any internet photo capability. We live in the Port Charlotte, FL area and would be happy to show the piece to any forum members in the area.

The gun arrived in a black/dark brown leather holster that I would describe as "good." All stitching is intact, belt loops, strap, buckle, etc. are intact. Has "dta41,"WaA195" (under Nazi eagle) and "P.08" markings on the back. Inside the holster flap is a pouch w/ a blued steel "combo tool."

There is a oxidized brass cleaning rod that appears like it goes with the ensemble.

Two magazines are present. They are blued w/ minor wear. The knurled aluminun "end pieces" are numbered 10471 and 11246. Each end piece has what I guess to be a small eagle mark above a "2." Each mag tube is marked w/ an eagle(?) above a "37" on the upper and lower portion of the mag. The bottom marking carries a "122" above the "eagle/37."

The pistol:

1. SN 3249 on bottom of barrel, front of frame (ahead of "take down lever(?)" and on forward left side of "receiver."
2. Bottom of barrel is also marked w/ a small eagle and "882."
3. Right side of receiver (fwd) has 3 "eagle" marks, diminishing in size. The largest can be clearly seen w/ a "2" beneath the eagle.
3. Pistol is completely blued with what I would call minor use and holster wear. What you folks call "straw" appears to my eyes to be in pretty darn good condition (no rust).
4. Grips appear to be wood (walnut?) w. a pencil lead-sized chip out of the upper portion of the right grip.
5. Before cleaning w/ an oily rag, there is minor rust on the "backstrap." The muzzle crown is unblued and oxidized with what appears to be minor "old" rust.
6. Some bluing appears worn away in the vicinity of the mag well, but no rust.

I have no plans to disassemble or otherwise "tinker" with the piece. Any info/assistance will be appreciated.

Again, I reckon the best course of a action would be to let one of your members examine and evaluate the piece. Of course, my friend and I would be
willing to pay for the time expended. Thanks in advance.

Best Regards,
Jackthrock
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Unread 05-16-2008, 01:18 PM   #2
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Default Re My Previous Post

I forgot to mention the "S" and "H anchor K" and Krieghoff Suhl" makings on the top of pistol 3249. These markings are crisp and the bluing here is excellent shape, by anyone's definition.

Best Regards,
Jackthrock
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Unread 05-16-2008, 01:30 PM   #3
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Jackthrock,

Welcome to the Lugerforum. Your posting title says "Krieghoff" but You forgot to mention what the marking is on top of the toggle and the year or marking over the chamber area. There may also be a small script letter under the serial number on the front of the frame just in front of the trigger guard... if there is a letter there, it is part of the serial number.

These marks are important in the evaluation, especially without photos.

We do have an active member within about 75 miles of you, he is a law enforcement officer in the town of Stuart. His screen name is Jamese... find one of his posts and send him a private message by using the icon at the bottom of the post that shows two people shaking hands in front of an envelope...

... I am sure he would be interested in meeting you and giving you a first hand inspection and evaluation. He is also capable of good photography and can share what he has seen with the forum. He can disassemble your Luger and make sure you don't have a rust problem internally and show you how to take it apart and put it back together safely.

Use an oily rag and really get that active rust stopped as soon as possible by rubbing, but try to not get any oil on the grips. Do not remove the grips just yet. Were there any markings on the tool?
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Unread 05-16-2008, 02:22 PM   #4
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Welcome,

Based on the description - my guess is you have a Late Series "S" HK. I'd need to see the toggle stamp to be certain. But - since it has wood grips (if they are original!), serial range and the rest of your description puts in that era of HK manufacture... Brown leather holsters with an HK are not uncommon - but you may want to take a look for an LWaA 2 stamp.

Sounds like a terrific RIG - but before I toss out a price - I need to understand originality of both the HK and the holster..???

Now - pictures??!!



And welcome!!!!

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Unread 05-16-2008, 02:34 PM   #5
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Mr. Sabato:

Thanks for the prompt! reply. Will contact Jamese. The tool is marked with what appears (I have no loupe) to be a tiny eagle with either "135" or "13S" beneath.

The top of the chamber area is marked with an "S." The toggle has the "sword/anchor" with an "H" to the left and a "K" to the right. Beneath that is "KRIEGHOFF SUHL" (two lines). I see no other markings on the top of the pistol. 'Course I could be missing something. The bluing on the top is excellent and all the marks are crisp and quite legible.

Re SN on front of frame: The bluing here is pristine. All I can see is "3249." There is no other proof/numeral/letter beneath that, or in the trigger guard vicinity.
Thanks again for your kind assistance and advice.

Best Regards,
Jackthrock
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Unread 05-16-2008, 02:39 PM   #6
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Too bad that you can't post photos sooner than that. I thought our benevolent benefactor and system owner John D. was on his way back to Haiti... He -IS- our resident Krieghoff expert... see if you can get someone with a digital camera to take some good photos and post them as soon as you can. John D. stays pretty busy when he is out of town... better to get his input while you can.
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Unread 05-16-2008, 02:58 PM   #7
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Hey John..!

Actually - I'm scheduled to go back next week for one of the projects.. As well - I read your PM the other day - and THANK YOU!!! This week (in fact as I write this ) we are moving the servers from my Porsche site to their new owners (corporation) in CA - so - it's been a bit hectic.. BUT - now I have a HUGE SERVER sitting in my office - and I was thinking last evening - that this site deserves an upgrade - so you and Ed can do some of the ADMIN stuff

Also - Jackthrock..

Yep - I kind of figured it was a Late S.. Again - pictures would be great! As well - since your loading tool in not an HK tool, my guess it may not be an HK accepted holster (however - I'd need to see pics..??)..

Best to you two folks! and John? My thanks again for all you do as well....

John D.
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Unread 05-16-2008, 03:01 PM   #8
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Thanks JD. Ed and I stand ready to serve.
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Unread 05-16-2008, 04:09 PM   #9
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All:
Tried to send some extremely poor-quality shots from my scanner - file size(s) too large. Will get hooked up w/ Jamese so he can eyeball/properly photograph the piece. Will advise forum members.

John D: I'm a retired boat captain who lived in the Dom Rep long ago - more recently delivered a private boat to Haiti for some of the Petionville elite a coupla years ago. Interesting country.

Thanks to all hands for your assistance!
Jackthrock
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Unread 05-16-2008, 04:44 PM   #10
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I combined the postings, and changed the name of the subject (no boneheads here on this forum


send me the picutres large, 2-3 at a time and I'll resize and post.


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if after tomorrow AM, i will be at the Reading PA show all day


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Unread 05-16-2008, 06:27 PM   #11
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Ed:

Three separate emails sent. Thanks.

Jackthrock




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Unread 05-16-2008, 06:34 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jackthrock
....John D: I'm a retired boat captain who lived in the Dom Rep long ago - more recently delivered a private boat to Haiti for some of the Petionville elite a coupla years ago. Interesting country....
Interesting country - to be sure...

Here is my experience in Haiti - I'm bound and determined to change the course for over 2,000 kids - and we are well on our way. And I am thrilled.. But - well - 2000 kids doesn't mean much - unless one of you is one of them...

Yep - I've been in a boat in Haiti. A dugout - "dug out" by hand with an axe from a log. I fished. And we caught fish. And so the guys family ate another day...

Here is what I'm doing there - click on CURRENT EFFORTS from this link:

http://www.rennwish.org/

And glad to help with your H-K I've seen, owned and appraised one or two in my time..

John D.
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Unread 05-16-2008, 08:10 PM   #13
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Can't wait to see pictures of this, sounds terriffic!
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Unread 05-17-2008, 07:43 AM   #14
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Dang - "ain't she pretty"!! From what I can tell - the good news is - I guessed right on the variation.. The bad news is, because I guessed right - unfortunately - you'll have to send it to me

Seriously - if the internals are all correct/matched and your next set of pictures show the detail of the condition - in that condition - and presuming the holster is NOT an HK holster - she would probably fetch about $8500 -$9000 on a good day at auction. Private sale/value would be in the $7750 - $8200 range - but again - if it's not refinished/restored - and all correct, with two non-matched but, HK mags

Looking forward to more pics!!!

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Unread 05-17-2008, 01:33 PM   #15
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John D:

Thanks for the info. And a big "roger that" on (all) the caveats! Have sent PM to forum member Jamese and am awaiting reply. In the meantime, will see what I can do on this end to provide better pics. Will keep the forum advised.

Best wishes to you for a safe and productive trip to Haiti for what obviously is a very worthy endeavor.

Best Regards,

Jackthrock
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Unread 05-17-2008, 03:04 PM   #16
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I think I have found a gun that matchs one of the mags you have. If you did not want to sell the mag (or gun) outright, I'm sure I could get a tradable mag that would be closer in number to your gun.
Please let me know if you would be willing to work on such a trade or sale. Thanks. Whitemant@aol.com
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Unread 05-20-2008, 10:11 AM   #17
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Hello, All:

Random/better(?) pics of SN 3249 are attached. Had a friend stop by over the weekend and he shot these. Forgot to "shoot" the holster. Oh, well... At this point it appears that these are sent to the forum for "historical" purposes, in that the owner expresses no desire to sell/trade at this point. Best regards to all. Jack T










[i](Moderator note (JS) - message syntax edited to display photos instead of links.)[\i]
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Unread 05-20-2008, 01:07 PM   #18
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jacktherock,
I own Krieghoff 10271 and would like to buy or trade for your mag. Pls contact me off forum at catofong@aol.com.

Thanks,

Tom A
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