Erma conversion kit- long box reproduction

[DonVoigt]

It has taken way longer than I thought to produce this "prototype"
of the early long Erma .22lr conversion kit storage box.

The tough part was producing a clone of the singular design of the latch!

This box is made from pine, which does not "cut" well and leaves a pretty ragged inlet for the parts. I've found a nice white maple which cuts cleanly and will be used for any more boxes produced. The white maple is a hard "soft" wood, or a soft "hard" wood and close in grain, color and appearance to the original box wood.

I have the first production box from the maple wood nearing completion as I post this. I'll be listing it for sale in the trading forum when completed- in a week or so. The repro boxes will be stamped inconspicuously on the bottom outside with my initials and the two last digits of the year produced and the number of the box.

The reproduction is the upper box in the closed pictures and the one with the ligher color and clean inside in the open shots.

Pictures show the prototype along side an original 1930's military long box for the Erma kit. I have to thank my friend David for the long time loan of his box for use as a pattern!

[Edward Tinker]

looks good - well done

I think the locking mechanism and the hinges are the hard part to find


Ed

[DonVoigt]

Right Ed.
The hinge material I as able to find, with the holes un drilled- as the spacing is not standard.

The latches I never found anywhere for sale, here or in Europe. They are made from scratch, steel and spring stock, then assembled with rivets after bending and fabrication. I'm not so slow, but it still takes me an hour to put one together after the pieces are already made. The male part of the latch is milled from a single piece of steel, takes me 1/2 hour just to make it.

[Jim Solomon]

Don,
Very nice project. Time consuming work for the locking mechanism and hinges.
Jim

[sheepherder]

Very nice!

Do you have plans for any more inletted box projects???

[wlyon]

Don
Very nice work!! Bill

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

Very nice!

Do you have plans for any more inletted box projects???

Rich,
I'm going to make one more long box from the better wood and see if it sells. I have enough wood to make a total of 4 long boxes.

I have made a couple trial small boxes, and will do one or two of those when I get the latch zeroed in. The small box latch is different than the large one, of course. There are a few more cuts for a long box, but the small one takes essentially the same effort to produce.

GT has given me a head start on the small box latches with some pieces already formed, but I have not yet put one together. Been busy with the long box.

[Ron Wood]

Great job Don! I do not need a box but I could put one of your latches to good use. So if you decide to crank out an extra give me a heads up. Thanks
Ron

[DonVoigt]

Thanks Ron.
While the latches are a near exact copy of the original, each one was hand inlet to its box.
If you need one to replace a missing or broken latch- that could/would create a fit problem.

PM me with particulars, there may be other options or ideas; I'll do my best to help.

[ithacaartist]

Great work, Don!

[John Sabato]

Very nice work Don... especially on the reproduction latch. What are the dimensions of the boards used to create the wooden halves? I may have some appropriate hardwood pieces that would work and you could try.

[Ron Wood]

Don,
I don't have an existing box so I don't need a latch for that. I am just pleased with the job you have done on the repro and it would be neat to have one around if I decide to make a custom case for something. I am enough of a "wood butcher" to do any inletting required.

[DonVoigt]

John,
the long box is about 16" long, bottom is about 1 1/8" thick, top a little less than 3/4".

Ron,
I'll see if I have one left over, if so you can get it.

Here is my box of latch pieces and "hardware" with some of the jigs used to make the pieces.

[sheepherder]

Don -

One thing I have noticed on that soft pine box for my Nambu that I made, is that after milling/routering out the slots, the box halves will warp. The board I selected was nice & flat and stored inside here for a week or so until I milled it. My board and box was stored in my house, in a controlled climate area. I'm theorizing that the loss of some wood, from one side of the board only [the slots], caused an unbalance that allowed the boards to warp.

It took several weeks, maybe months, to warp. I didn't check it closely and only noticed it when I was getting ready to put my 'artillery Nambu' on GB.

[Olle]

Wood is funny that way... You start out with a perfectly straight piece, mill, drill etc and all of a sudden it moves on you. Actually, I have seen the same thing happen with steel, especially when you mill it really thin. There is always some stress and tension inside the material, and when this is released you'll end up with a warped piece.

One way to get around that is to work with an oversized blank, and true it up once all the cuts are made. There's still no guarantee that it won't keep moving, but a good coat of oil usually seems to stabilize it. Denser wood species don't move as much, but pine, poplar and such can really act up.

Wonder how they did it back in the good ol' days?

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Olle

One way to get around that is to work with an oversized blank, and true it up once all the cuts are made.

+ 1

My thought was to wait a couple weeks/months, and then plane it flat. My pine box was just a 'feasibility study' to see if it was difficult/time consuming/boring. If it was something that would ultimately interest me, I would step up to maple or walnut.

It's good that Don is making these!

[Ron Wood]

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

...Here is my box of latch pieces and "hardware" with some of the jigs used to make the pieces.

Looks like you swedged/staked the push button to the spring. I never would have thought of that. (or maybe I'm not seeing what I think I'm seeing )

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

+ 1

My thought was to wait a couple weeks/months, and then plane it flat. My pine box was just a 'feasibility study' to see if it was difficult/time consuming/boring. If it was something that would ultimately interest me, I would step up to maple or walnut.

It's good that Don is making these!

Actually the pine is fine, no change or warping.
I "fixed" several small boxes last year that had warped, had to sand them flat, then deepen the cut outs.

Ollie is right about the stress, happens with metal too. That is why it has to be annealed and equalized for some applications.

The wood is not that big a deal - it can be "fixed".

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Looks like you swedged/staked the push button to the spring. I never would have thought of that. (or maybe I'm not seeing what I think I'm seeing )

Ron,
you are seeing the button "riveted" to the spring- same way the original was done; cheap and easy!

[DonVoigt]

Well,
the #1 box from white maple is finished, not perfect but close- next one I'll get it right.

I waited till the last thing to put the hinge on this one, what a struggle- took me two days to remember I put the hinge on the prototype first, then sanded the edges to match! That is what happens when you have CRS and it is two or four months in between the times you do something!

Anyway, here are some pictures- a little fuzzy cause the light was
"weak" yesterday.

One picture or two show the pieces in cut outs, I don't have a complete large kit, so I do not have the cleaning "guide" that would be in the one cut out near the end of the cleaning rod.

One of the noticeable differences between the small and long box is that the cut out for the toggle is large enough in the long box to hold the 9mm toggle when it is removed. The other "empty" cut out is for safe keeping of the 9mm ejector which has to be removed to install the sub-caliber kit.

See the WTS post for this box if you "need/want" one!