K date Kriegsmarine

Lugers down under · 01-08-2005, 08:55 PM

I have been given the oportunity to purchase a 100% condition K date Kreigsmarine Luger complete with correct mags and Holster and tools.
I have no idea what so ever of what it would be worth!
Can anyone advise please........!
Regards

lugerholsterrepair · 01-08-2005, 11:13 PM

3-4-$5000 and up U.S. K dates are extremly hard to find and a KM would be icing on the kake. So many questions, so little time. Holster KM marked? Tool marked? Condition? KM marking on pistol? Where and what? Photo's ?Mags match? Could be an $8000 pistol. More info! Jerry Burney

Imperial Arms · 01-09-2005, 12:08 AM

If I had to give an estimate, I would say between $10k-$15k. I would definitely like to see an image of the near mint KM rig if you have an opportunity to photograph it.

Good luck,
Albert

Lugers down under · 01-09-2005, 12:55 AM

Thanks Guys,
After my investment in the Borchardt, the offer of this gun is very untimely.
Yes to all the questions, matching mags, correct holster, correct tool, correct cleaning rod. I will post some photos.
If I dont buy it, one of you guys might. It is in the USA.
Kind wishes
Murray

Navy · 01-09-2005, 02:11 PM

I purchased a KM K-Date rig 2 years ago. Had 2 matching mags and holster SN to pistol. It was a 5 figure price....

Tom A.

MauserLugers · 01-16-2005, 01:38 AM

I purchased my K-date Navy at least 8 years ago and it was over $4000 then. At that time there was only approximately 12 documented. There are a lot of totally fake K-dates and a lot of fake K-date Navies also. A complete rig with two matching magazines is almost too good to be true. I'd check this out very well before purchasing and find out what history I could on it. A gun like that had to be known and someone will have some information on it. --- Bill

Navy · 01-16-2005, 09:26 AM

Gun was from a vet's widow's estate. He was a career Navy man. There was a bunch of other souvenirs but I was only interested in the pistol. It was offered to me for less by the old woman's daughter, but I told her that I insisted on paying a "fair" price.

Sometimes a blind pig finds an acorn.

Tom A.

MauserLugers · 01-16-2005, 11:31 AM

Hi Tom,
The way you acquired yours is the best way, but seldom found these days. Mine came from the Tom Knox collection. In reference to the gun that "Lugers down under" is looking at, there should be some history on it, and someone should know something about it. A complete K-date Navy with 2 matching magazines just doesn't stay hidden with no one remembering it, unless it was like your Luger and a vet still had it. I know of only 2 K-date Lugers with 2 matching magazines, yours makes 3, and I remember who has them and roughly what the serial numbers are, and other collectors remember these things also. Anyway, if the above rig is correct it is a real find. -- Bill

Lugers down under · 01-16-2005, 02:06 PM

I have made some more inquiries and the responce is as follow:
Quote.
This luger came from Florida. I purchased it from a wealthy collector here in Minnesota who lives there in the winter, summers in a VERY affluent part
of Minnesota. He has been a serious colllector for a long, long, time. He buys and sells only top quality pieces. His friend owns and operates a WWII collector's business in the Naples, Florida area.
They both are on the lookout for quality pieces every day. To put it simply, they do this for a living, and have done so, for a long time. As you are probably aware, a lot of retires live in Florida, and these WWII vets are dying off at a rate of about 1,000 per day. I guess the world's loss is a collector's gain.
I appreciate your genuine concern regarding the authenticity of this piece. I would feel the same way. Also, understand, I KNOW what I've got. And am willing to sit on it for the right price.

I get the feeling that this item is out side my current bank account having just bought the Borchardt .
I will post some photos and then leave it to you guys.

Heinz · 01-16-2005, 05:25 PM

LDU, you might check with Pete Ebrink on that Minnesota - Naples Florida connection. He had some information a couple of weeks ago and I don't remember if that was the same locus of operation.

That Borchardt may be doing you a favor.

George Anderson · 01-16-2005, 05:47 PM

Murray, Minnesota is a very nice place; good pheassant hunting and some huns also. The women are all of Norwegian and German stock and can step across a four strand barbed wire fence with ease. It's cold but nice but neither as cold nor as nice as North Dakota.

Another thing about Minnesota and Lugers is that there is a notorious Luger dealer/counterfeiter there. This is not the case with North Dakota also North Dakota hase sharp tailed grouse and some sage grouse. A much better place.

I have no interest in a K date. Email me the name of the dealer and I'll tell you if you have wandered into a minefield.

Navy · 01-16-2005, 09:08 PM

To ampliyfy my pal George,

If the gun came out of Minnesota, I'd be VERY AFRAID.

Tom A

Pete Ebbink · 01-16-2005, 10:19 PM

Hi Heinz,

The posting I was involved with a couple of weeks ago had to do with a luger vendor that lives in Michigan and moves to Florida for the winter...G&G Relics...Gil Hoffman...one of our LF members was concerned when he lost track of Gill during his seasonal move...no connection to the state of MN...

http://www.ggrelics.com/

Regards,

Pete...

Heinz · 01-16-2005, 10:42 PM

Thanks Pete,

I think I confused the Ellis/Zomber posting you did with something else I heard from Minnesota.

The story Murray had about the expert dealers sounded a little like one of the stories associated with that sad affair

Certainly did not mean to associate Gil Hoffman with that crowd!

Pete Ebbink · 01-16-2005, 11:05 PM

Anyone know where in Florida the Harvey Branch-family operated/operates from...? Is it Naples ???

Navy · 01-17-2005, 07:46 AM

Pete,

Last I heard it was Jacksonville.

Tom A

Heinz · 01-17-2005, 09:06 AM

Which is pretty close to Naples as I recall. if that is relevant.

Lugers down under · 01-18-2005, 02:30 AM

OK Guys,
here are some photos of this Luger.

These photos are off a CD given to me while I was in Arizona last month.
I have a lot more photos on the CD.
I have no other details other than what I have already posted.
I am out of the buying loop as I have to pay the wife back for buying me the Borchardt for Christmas.
If anyone is interested, please e-mail me.
The asking price is $12K plus.
If any one has any compliants they can argue with me.
Regards
Murray.

lugerholsterrepair · 01-18-2005, 10:40 AM

WOW Murray! It's a beauty. I cannot critique it as I know nothing about these except I would love to have one. I will be interested to see what the experts say about it.

I like the photo of your complaint department!

Jerry Burney

John Sabato · 01-18-2005, 12:41 PM

What a comfortable looking armchair... I have never seen one before that had a place to rest your hands

01-08-2005, 08:55 PM	#1
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	K date Kriegsmarine I have been given the oportunity to purchase a 100% condition K date Kreigsmarine Luger complete with correct mags and Holster and tools. I have no idea what so ever of what it would be worth! Can anyone advise please........! Regards __________________ Lugers down under

01-08-2005, 11:13 PM	#2
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	3-4-$5000 and up U.S. K dates are extremly hard to find and a KM would be icing on the kake. So many questions, so little time. Holster KM marked? Tool marked? Condition? KM marking on pistol? Where and what? Photo's ?Mags match? Could be an $8000 pistol. More info! Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

01-09-2005, 12:55 AM	#4
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Thanks Guys, After my investment in the Borchardt, the offer of this gun is very untimely. Yes to all the questions, matching mags, correct holster, correct tool, correct cleaning rod. I will post some photos. If I dont buy it, one of you guys might. It is in the USA. Kind wishes Murray __________________ Lugers down under

01-16-2005, 02:06 PM	#9
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	I have made some more inquiries and the responce is as follow: Quote. This luger came from Florida. I purchased it from a wealthy collector here in Minnesota who lives there in the winter, summers in a VERY affluent part of Minnesota. He has been a serious colllector for a long, long, time. He buys and sells only top quality pieces. His friend owns and operates a WWII collector's business in the Naples, Florida area. They both are on the lookout for quality pieces every day. To put it simply, they do this for a living, and have done so, for a long time. As you are probably aware, a lot of retires live in Florida, and these WWII vets are dying off at a rate of about 1,000 per day. I guess the world's loss is a collector's gain. I appreciate your genuine concern regarding the authenticity of this piece. I would feel the same way. Also, understand, I KNOW what I've got. And am willing to sit on it for the right price. I get the feeling that this item is out side my current bank account having just bought the Borchardt . I will post some photos and then leave it to you guys. __________________ Lugers down under

01-18-2005, 02:30 AM	#18
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	OK Guys, here are some photos of this Luger. These photos are off a CD given to me while I was in Arizona last month. I have a lot more photos on the CD. I have no other details other than what I have already posted. I am out of the buying loop as I have to pay the wife back for buying me the Borchardt for Christmas. If anyone is interested, please e-mail me. The asking price is $12K plus. If any one has any compliants they can argue with me. Regards Murray. __________________ Lugers down under Last edited by Lugers down under; 01-18-2005 at 02:51 AM.

01-09-2005, 12:08 AM	#3
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	If I had to give an estimate, I would say between $10k-$15k. I would definitely like to see an image of the near mint KM rig if you have an opportunity to photograph it. Good luck, Albert

01-09-2005, 02:11 PM	#5
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	I purchased a KM K-Date rig 2 years ago. Had 2 matching mags and holster SN to pistol. It was a 5 figure price.... Tom A.

01-16-2005, 01:38 AM	#6
MauserLugers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Philipsburg, Montana 59858 Posts: 250 Thanks: 0 Thanked 8 Times in 1 Post	I purchased my K-date Navy at least 8 years ago and it was over $4000 then. At that time there was only approximately 12 documented. There are a lot of totally fake K-dates and a lot of fake K-date Navies also. A complete rig with two matching magazines is almost too good to be true. I'd check this out very well before purchasing and find out what history I could on it. A gun like that had to be known and someone will have some information on it. --- Bill

01-16-2005, 09:26 AM	#7
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Gun was from a vet's widow's estate. He was a career Navy man. There was a bunch of other souvenirs but I was only interested in the pistol. It was offered to me for less by the old woman's daughter, but I told her that I insisted on paying a "fair" price. Sometimes a blind pig finds an acorn. Tom A.

01-16-2005, 11:31 AM	#8
MauserLugers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Philipsburg, Montana 59858 Posts: 250 Thanks: 0 Thanked 8 Times in 1 Post	Hi Tom, The way you acquired yours is the best way, but seldom found these days. Mine came from the Tom Knox collection. In reference to the gun that "Lugers down under" is looking at, there should be some history on it, and someone should know something about it. A complete K-date Navy with 2 matching magazines just doesn't stay hidden with no one remembering it, unless it was like your Luger and a vet still had it. I know of only 2 K-date Lugers with 2 matching magazines, yours makes 3, and I remember who has them and roughly what the serial numbers are, and other collectors remember these things also. Anyway, if the above rig is correct it is a real find. -- Bill

01-16-2005, 05:25 PM	#10
Heinz User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Greenville SC Posts: 1,004 Thanks: 377 Thanked 410 Times in 180 Posts	LDU, you might check with Pete Ebrink on that Minnesota - Naples Florida connection. He had some information a couple of weeks ago and I don't remember if that was the same locus of operation. That Borchardt may be doing you a favor.

01-16-2005, 05:47 PM	#11
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,769 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	Murray, Minnesota is a very nice place; good pheassant hunting and some huns also. The women are all of Norwegian and German stock and can step across a four strand barbed wire fence with ease. It's cold but nice but neither as cold nor as nice as North Dakota. Another thing about Minnesota and Lugers is that there is a notorious Luger dealer/counterfeiter there. This is not the case with North Dakota also North Dakota hase sharp tailed grouse and some sage grouse. A much better place. I have no interest in a K date. Email me the name of the dealer and I'll tell you if you have wandered into a minefield.

01-16-2005, 09:08 PM	#12
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	To ampliyfy my pal George, If the gun came out of Minnesota, I'd be VERY AFRAID. Tom A

01-16-2005, 10:19 PM	#13
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Heinz, The posting I was involved with a couple of weeks ago had to do with a luger vendor that lives in Michigan and moves to Florida for the winter...G&G Relics...Gil Hoffman...one of our LF members was concerned when he lost track of Gill during his seasonal move...no connection to the state of MN... http://www.ggrelics.com/ Regards, Pete...

01-16-2005, 10:42 PM	#14
Heinz User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Greenville SC Posts: 1,004 Thanks: 377 Thanked 410 Times in 180 Posts	Thanks Pete, I think I confused the Ellis/Zomber posting you did with something else I heard from Minnesota. The story Murray had about the expert dealers sounded a little like one of the stories associated with that sad affair Certainly did not mean to associate Gil Hoffman with that crowd!

01-16-2005, 11:05 PM	#15
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Anyone know where in Florida the Harvey Branch-family operated/operates from...? Is it Naples ???

01-17-2005, 07:46 AM	#16
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Pete, Last I heard it was Jacksonville. Tom A

01-17-2005, 09:06 AM	#17
Heinz User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Greenville SC Posts: 1,004 Thanks: 377 Thanked 410 Times in 180 Posts	Which is pretty close to Naples as I recall. if that is relevant.

01-18-2005, 10:40 AM	#19
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	WOW Murray! It's a beauty. I cannot critique it as I know nothing about these except I would love to have one. I will be interested to see what the experts say about it. I like the photo of your complaint department! Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

01-18-2005, 12:41 PM	#20
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	What a comfortable looking armchair... I have never seen one before that had a place to rest your hands __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*