DWM LUGER PROTOTYPE, 1900 MODEL, 7.65MM for auction @ Manions

[John Sabato]

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/30574-6000-2-W.jpg

[John Sabato]

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/30574-6000-3-W.jpg

[John Sabato]

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/30574-6000-4-W.jpg

[John Sabato]

IT appears in REALLY NICE shape!


Whish I had the money!


-John




http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/30...0prototype.jpg

[Dok]

[Big Norm]

Aw Gee! Non-matching mags. They look like they have been buffed. Maybe I can punch some numbers on them and get a couple of hundred. You know how hard it is to find 30 cal ammo. If I can't take it out and shoot it, whats the sense in having it? I already have an oil dispenser and a cleaning rod. Take down tools are only $20. Five bucks for the punch. The markings are in kinda light so they are questionable. Can't see any machining marks so its probably been restored. No mention of the bores condition. 5-15/16" barrel, won't be able to find a holster for it. Maybe a navy holster would work but they are pretty hard to find. Lugers with grip safeties are hard to work. Commercial Lugers aren't worth much. Just another obsolete shooter in an old box. Maybe I can talk them down in price.

Big Norm

[Johnny Peppers]

Serial number 10035B has a reverse toggle, and I notice that the pistol shown has a reverse toggle. The original magazines would not have been numbered, so the magazines are probably orphaned militaries. The pistol is advertised in excellent original condition, but the pictures sure make it look like it has been refinished. The stawing is just too perfect, and a little on the light side. The strawed finish was very fragile, and in the last 100 years it would be showing some ageing to the straw. The front toggle with the DWM logo appears to have been dressed down with a belt sander. Just my opinion, but doesn't look original to me.

[John Sabato]

But since this is a 1900 prototype, I wondered if they were still perfecting the manufacturing methodology at the time that they may have just lightly stamped the toggle ???


There is no telling where this pistol has been hiding for 101 years... I can't comment on the appearance of the strawing if it has been in ideal storage conditions for that length of time.


Comments and opinions anyone?


-John

[Johnny Peppers]

The pistol is not a prototype in the true sense of the word. DWM had already manufactured over 10000 Lugers, and apparently were experimenting with velocities of different barrel lengths, as well as the 9mm caliber. There are pistols in the early 10000 range as well as the 10000B range that have odd barrel lengths and sights. In the 10000B range there are 4",4.75",5.25", and 6" 9mm barrels in the heavy, or "fat barrel" configuration, as well as a 7" and 8" 9mm barrel in the standard configuration.

If the pistol had been hidden away all this time in pristine new condition, you would expect it to have at least one original magazine.

Additionally, there are also out and out fakes in this serial number range.

[John Sabato]

[BILL]

It does appear to have been restored at some point. Properly done to the right pistol still puts it in a high price category. It would be interesting to see the pistol close up. The DWM stamp on the toggle is a little too light for me think that hasn't had some metal removed in the restoration process. I would also doubt the authenticity of the case it is in (but then, according to purist philosophy,) it adds no value to a collector grade pistol. It sure looks nice and would fit right into my collection I must say. I wish I could see what is under the safety lever. I agree that 101 years would automatically take it's toll on the strawing.

[Johnny Peppers]

As the area under the safety was originally milled out after the pistol was blued, it would be interesting to see how this was handled on this pistol.

The case is possibly original, but the lining is not. Most of these cases show heavy soiling due to the oil used on the pistol. These early commercial cases are getting as high as the pistols themselves. A few years back Bob Simpson had one of these fitted cases for a carbine, and the price was $10,000.

[Dok]

having looked at literally dozens of cases prior to starting my own case endeavours, this is the first case I've seen in quite this layout. It has elements similar to those early cases, particularly the curved section. However in those early cases, the curve follows the form of the pistol (See examples in Luger - The International Pistol). My gut feel is the case is new.


Dok

[Johnny Peppers]

I have an original case for the 4 3/4" 1900, and it has the curved section under the barrel and in front of the frame like you mentioned.

Hi

Comparing the DWM logo on this and my 1906 AE .

The Logo here appears to have more material removed

in the upper right area than on the lower left area.

This causes the scroling letters to have a warying depth.

That never seems to appear on un monkeyed guns.

My opinion.

ViggoG

[Milt Keller]

Any of you generous guys wanna lend me $985.00?


Milt

[Milt Keller]

Sorry, I mean $9850.00?

To be very frank,

After examining the "DWM logo" and the finish around it,

I would not invest more than 1/10 th. that amount.

See my previous post.

ViggoG

Yeah, there is something about that DWM logo that looks wrong.